Russians Discussion Thread

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United States of America __Uhlan__
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by __Uhlan__ »

yemshi wrote:Like Russia is the only civ that doesn't care about the MU, whether it is a land/sea/TP/livestock/high res/low rer/wallable/etc. map.
They do just fine even though they might lose a few times.


lol what
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by milku3459 »

__Uhlan__ wrote:
yemshi wrote:Like Russia is the only civ that doesn't care about the MU, whether it is a land/sea/TP/livestock/high res/low rer/wallable/etc. map.
They do just fine even though they might lose a few times.


lol what


meaning they are ok with different situations more than other civs are? for example, brits are negatively affected by low hunt maps; Russia also would like some fresh meate but at least they can get an advantage out of it by starving brit.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by __Uhlan__ »

milku3459 wrote:
__Uhlan__ wrote:
yemshi wrote:Like Russia is the only civ that doesn't care about the MU, whether it is a land/sea/TP/livestock/high res/low rer/wallable/etc. map.
They do just fine even though they might lose a few times.


lol what


meaning they are ok with different situations more than other civs are? for example, brits are negatively affected by low hunt maps; Russia also would like some fresh meate but at least they can get an advantage out of it by starving brit.


That's simply false
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by yemshi »

milku3459 wrote:meaning they are ok with different situations more than other civs are? for example, brits are negatively affected by low hunt maps; Russia also would like some fresh meate but at least they can get an advantage out of it by starving brit.

Basically that.
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Italy Garja
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Garja »

Ye russia is quite a versatile civ. It has 400w, steel traps and fast age up, does have schooners, it is an offensive civ but that outscales most civs in the long run and it also has all type of units.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by pecelot »

Goodspeed wrote:
was a massive deal that changed the civ from being near bottom to near top
Lol

placebo :hmm:
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Goodspeed »

Yes.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Garja »

Russia was never bottom nor top civ but the vill cost discount did buff the civ significantly.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Hazza54321 »

was hardly a placebo
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Darwin_ »

Yeah with 255 food vills russia could pretty much do the same thing every mu and have a good chance at winning.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Kaiserklein »

Just aging up slightly faster and being able to get an early market more easily was really nice for russia. Having to make market before blockhouse or from 400w age up is a bit awkward as russia, it's slow, when you get it age 1 you're just much faster and can even afford placer mines during transition + steel traps upon age up and get 5 musks fast with a couple treasures. With 270f vils you can still do it but you need more treasures
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by milku3459 »

milku:
doesn't play EP
doesn't play TAD
doesn't play russ
disagrees with brigadier
gets likes
8-)
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Darwin_ »

In my honest opinion, I think that russia has a little bit of potential to become a better civ through meta-game development, but I think that even then, it will still be a weak civ because of a few inherent flaws in its design. One of the problems I see is the bad consequences of their civ bonus. Yes their units train faster, but you need the full cost of a batch up-front, so until you have an economy that can gather all of the resources for the next batch while one is in queue, the training time reduction doesn't do too much beyond having a slightly earlier first batch. What this does mean though, is that if you have the eco for back-to-back batches, they end up scaling extremely well.

The issue I personally saw with 255 food vills is that russia's eco could support back-to-back batches a fair bit earlier in the game, allowing them to have incredibly good (some would argue overpowered) colonial and early game scaling. I think that a possible change to the civ could be to give them back the cheaper vill batches, but to in turn increase infantry train time, maybe increasing strelet train time by 5 seconds (30 to 35) and maybe musks by a few seconds as well.

For an even more drastic change to the civ, maybe the bonus russia gets (25% cheaper and 20% weaker infantry) could be changed to something like 30% cheaper and 24% weaker infantry units (still a 5:4 ratio). Maybe also a change to train time as well, if it seemed necessary. This would make their early game a little bit stronger because they would be able to get a few more units out, though not too many I would think. It would make their scaling about as good as it is now, because yes, you have more units, but they are less population-efficient and pathing is a little bit worse. If the patch team instituted this change, however, I don't think russia would require a villager batch cost-reduction. This is just an idea however, and I would like to see players better than me poke holes in it :P
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by milku3459 »

Darwin_ wrote: could be changed to something like 30% cheaper and 24% weaker infantry units (still a 5:4 ratio).


wow imagine ruskets
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by deleted_user0 »

I'm going to boycott esoc tournaments/patch before you buff Russia. This is so bullshit.

Hazza+Me both russia main civs and we can't even use Russia once in tournament simply because it's too weak. These changes are so retarded. Dutch benefits so much for having 2 mines+3 hunts in base almost every map. Also french+germ can just turle their base until they have III and they can rape Russia any possible way they want. It's just so fucking weak.

Ye blabla good on all maps and on water. Well, water is so fucking useless on esoc maps when there are 3-4 whales that donr help much. This dutch loving and anti-russia mentality has gone too far. Even BS_op said on RE it's the worst civ and still it gets 0 upgrades and most MU's gets huge disadvantage because you can turtle 12 mins in base with full mines and hunts.

Can you please fkign try do 10 games in i.e in manchuria russ-germ/fre and you will understand it's simply impossible if there are no huge fuck ups.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Kaiserklein »

Russia is not even that bad. And why compare russ to france/ger when their style counter russia + are really strong civs
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by NekoBerk »

Russia is fine :/, plz don't buff it or nerf it! ! ! ! !
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by yurashic »

Kaiserklein wrote:Russia is not even that bad. And why compare russ to france/ger when their style counter russia + are really strong civs


Because 80% of high level players main France and Germany.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Kaiserklein »

Where did you see that? I've seen more otto than france or ger in the last series of the tourney.
Also if it's the case, then just balance france and germany. Or maybe more like, balance tps
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by yurashic »

Kaiserklein wrote:Where did you see that? I've seen more otto than france or ger in the last series of the tourney.
Also if it's the case, then just balance france and germany. Or maybe more like, balance tps


RO8 of the current tournament.

LordRaphael - mains France, Germany, Brit, Dutch.
Stanley_Winston - mains Brit, France, Germany, Aztec, Dutch.
Knuschelbar - mains Brit, France, Germany, Dutch.
KaiserKlein - mains France, Germany.
Tit - mains India, Brit, Dutch.
Blackstar_OP - mains Germany, France, Japan.
Mitoe - mains Germany, Brit, Dutch.
Snowww - mains France, Germany, Brit, Dutch.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Garja »

French and Germans are like the most basic civs in the current meta. Russia is more complex but has more potential imo.
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Dsy »

I think russia beats france. How is it weak then?
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

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Post by tedere12 »

I think they don't
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

Post by Darwin_ »

-1 food crate, +1 starting villager, 5 cossacks reduced to 4: gg no re
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Re: Russian Discussion Thread

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Post by Hazza54321 »

terrible changes xD

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