No vill limit; how many do you make?

[Jaeger]

***This applies both to treaty and to supremacy lategame.

Since in most games people try to max out 99 vills, it seems that if there was no limit, people would go even higher; but how much higher (pop cap still 200)? Of course, the more vills you have, the more resources you gather, but the more military pop you have, the better you do in fights (which also translates to having more resources). I'm very curious about where the optimal point is.

I think it's very interesting to try to analyze the marginal utility you get from trading a vill for a military pop at different vill counts; for example you probably get much more utility from deleting a vil if you're at 160 vills vs than if you're at 50.

[SenorCallen]

25 stupid question ovi....please make realistic questions

[deleted_user]

(25 is the max vills otto can train before they waste resources upgrading villager pop)

[SenorCallen]

your telling me u actually play something else

[Kaiserklein]

You actually can't mix sup and treaty like that. In treaty, people would probs go for 200 vils if there was no limit, then delete a part of those (not sure how many though). In sup, you would just stop at some point. Not sure how many either here, but my guess is a bit more than 100 vils, because when I'm playing germany, I still get 99 settlers + extra SW and it feels fine.

[Jaeger]

You actually can't mix sup and treaty like that. In treaty, people would probs go for 200 vils if there was no limit, then delete a part of those (not sure how many though). In sup, you would just stop at some point. Not sure how many either here, but my guess is a bit more than 100 vils, because when I'm playing germany, I still get 99 settlers + extra SW and it feels fine.

Ofc in treaty you get 200 during 40 mins and then delete them lol, i was curious how many you delete. I jnow with germany they delete 40-60 vills

[deleted_user0]

i'd just vil fight.

[forgrin]

Without max training speed (Inca) most civs could probably maintain constant pumping of units with roughly 80-90 vill pop if the fight goes evenly.

Eventually as you get more resources the game becomes more about pop efficiency than cost efficiency, so then you'd cut vills as your bank grows and add them back in when it starts dropping. There won't be a specific equilibrium because the fight is always gonna go better or worse for one player.

[Jaeger]

Without max training speed (Inca) most civs could probably maintain constant pumping of units with roughly 80-90 vill pop if the fight goes evenly.

Eventually as you get more resources the game becomes more about pop efficiency than cost efficiency, so then you'd cut vills as your bank grows and add them back in when it starts dropping. There won't be a specific equilibrium because the fight is always gonna go better or worse for one player.

Wait so in sup you don't make past 80-90 vills? Even in treaty they keep 99 vills, they don't delete them (except germany, but they usually delete until they have 99, partly because they have one of the worst start armies, and uhlans are pop inefficient)

[HeatitUP_]

I would make 100 vills because half your population should be eco

[saveyourskill]

I think I was more on the greedy side in AOEO and did 80v and 20 caravans or 60v 40c around there but I think average in each game would be 80 counting both vills and caravans. I think depending on super late game like everyone is in age 5 I think 110v is fine(for sup). With 120 or more I would just be ending up having too much bank and sending 90k to my team just to lose because I don't have enough pop to send it on. Just depends how your many vills you need for your spam.

[Jaeger]

I think I was more on the greedy side in AOEO and did 80v and 20 caravans or 60v 40c around there but I think average in each game would be 80 counting both vills and caravans. I think depending on super late game like everyone is in age 5 I think 110v is fine(for sup). With 120 or more I would just be ending up having too much bank and sending 90k to my team just to lose because I don't have enough pop to send it on. Just depends how your many vills you need for your spam.

Well in treaty they have 99 vills all the time and they still run out of resources, so at some point you should be able to fight continously like in treaty and use your resources

[Jaeger]

I would make 100 vills because half your population should be eco

Why not 101?

[HeatitUP_]

I would make 100 vills because half your population should be eco

Why not 101?

cuz the population limit is fixed at 200 UNLESS you get a treasure that increases your population limit!

[Jaeger]

I would make 100 vills because half your population should be eco

Why not 101?

cuz the population limit is fixed at 200 UNLESS you get a treasure that increases your population limit!

But why exactly half :O?

[Jaeger]

@H2O_

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[forgrin]

Without max training speed (Inca) most civs could probably maintain constant pumping of units with roughly 80-90 vill pop if the fight goes evenly.

Eventually as you get more resources the game becomes more about pop efficiency than cost efficiency, so then you'd cut vills as your bank grows and add them back in when it starts dropping. There won't be a specific equilibrium because the fight is always gonna go better or worse for one player.

Wait so in sup you don't make past 80-90 vills? Even in treaty they keep 99 vills, they don't delete them (except germany, but they usually delete until they have 99, partly because they have one of the worst start armies, and uhlans are pop inefficient)

If we're thinking about a sup lategame scenario, once you have capitol upgrades you probably don't need 99 vills to maintain 200 pop (as long as you have h20 kinda deck with a couple mill/plant cards thrown in). You gotta keep in mind that training time is so much slower in normal sup vs treaty (esp in nats) since most people don't have training cards in their decks. This means you don't spend nearly as much on army since both you and your opponent would constantly have roughly 20-30 pop in training queues, maybe more, so units would die more slowly.

[HeatitUP_]

@H2O_

notification

[Jaeger]

@H2O_

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[princeofcarthage]

+-10% of what your opponent maintain should be optimal imo considering a fair game ( same civ same skill level ) it would be more situational than a straight out answer, cuz if you cut less you will just get rolled by Superior mass unless you lose badly in art war which shouldn't happen.

[Panmaster]

Theoretically the optimal abstract villager count is the minimum needed to maintain military production.

The warchief civs have a card that gives villagers 33 hand attack which combined with pioneers might make 200 vil pop an interesting possibility.

[lordraphael]

hm there are situation where you get above 99 vils ( sea ) . In any case i would never make more than 120 vill max. Thats also the magic number in aoc where you can theoretically make 200 vills. it also dpeneds strongly on the state of the game. Lets say you reach 99 vills in late age 3 and youre aging up to IV . Then id def make around 120ish vills maybe even more. Becasue im gonna need lots of eco to support production and getting upgrades. If i then want to try to go to age 5 id keep that amount of vills obv for extra economy. However if i try to close out the game in IV 120 vills could be to much (assuming ive already gotten all the ups and all i want is max mili pop ).

[thomasgreen6]

i'd just vil fight.

Yeah a use for that Sioux card...

[Jaeger]

hm there are situation where you get above 99 vils ( sea ) . In any case i would never make more than 120 vill max. Thats also the magic number in aoc where you can theoretically make 200 vills. it also dpeneds strongly on the state of the game. Lets say you reach 99 vills in late age 3 and youre aging up to IV . Then id def make around 120ish vills maybe even more. Becasue im gonna need lots of eco to support production and getting upgrades. If i then want to try to go to age 5 id keep that amount of vills obv for extra economy. However if i try to close out the game in IV 120 vills could be to much (assuming ive already gotten all the ups and all i want is max mili pop ).

Yeah another situation is cree cdb

[noissance]

I'd get 244 as iroquois -> Firepit population dance + 20 vill imperial age up