Ashigaru 4.5

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Ashigaru 4.5

Post by look »

Someone tells me that why Ashigaru has 4.5 speed ..?
While the others have only 4, What's the sense of this?
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by Hazza54321 »

They have increased cost but very poor stats, most of the cost is for their speed
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

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Post by jesus3 »

hazza watch your language
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by look »

really not.. need down speed to 4.0 too..
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by Hazza54321 »

Compare their stats to sepoy, theyre just bad honestly
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by lemmings121 »

I guess is just one of those design choices that doesnt have a lot of explanations, feels like they were designed like this just because would be cool, then they tried to balance arround it. (and we had insanelly op ashis for 4 patches before they accepted and nerfed it to current stats..)

now they are just a weird unit, weak early game, and strong enough to counter age 4 CIR skirms late game.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by rsy »

Hazza54321 wrote:Compare their stats to sepoy, theyre just bad honestly

And they even cost more than sepoy lul
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by 666_X »

ashigaru is the least cost effective musk type unit (combat + base stat) wise
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by _H2O »

TBH they got over nerfed. Generally the best Japan players are making less Ashi. Using them as a counter unit not the staple unit. Right now yumi and nagi are the good units
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by Garja »

They are fine. 15g is for 1atk and 0.5 speed. 5f for 20hp. Low hand atk I guess but I don't find it extremely influential.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by lordraphael »

_H2O wrote:TBH they got over nerfed. Generally the best Japan players are making less Ashi. Using them as a counter unit not the staple unit. Right now yumi and nagi are the good units

ye if the insane scaling of all jap units would be fixed at last ashi could actually get a slight buff ( cost decrease or a better multiplier vs cav early on imo). Thing is they get OP pretty fast even in late age 2 they are pretty strong when ashi combat and the daimyo has been sent. In age 3 they get the insane pavillon buff and the hp and hand combat multiplier card and in age they get that hilarious shogun buff who scales, just like the pavillon, off of current stats.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by macacoalbino »

Low hand atack isnt influential until someone adds cav
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by look »

I do not see problem in hp and life ... 0.5 is really something lamme .. since japanese has enough economy to produce with that little higher value..
It is without logic skirmshs can not micro against ashi. It goes against logic that inf ligh > heavy
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by kami_ryu »

Japan feels like a civ where you're looking to stack those upgrades on units and economy. Once you've boomed and upgraded your economy, that's when you win games with Japan. I feel like they're just too slow to do that consistently and efficiently.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by Hazza54321 »

whos not gonna make cav vs japan though
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

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Post by Rikikipu »

Usually an unit that got a lot of buffs as multiple cards tech smells bad. Or the unit is bad without upgrades and becomes viable with them, or the unit was already viable and then becomes too op cause upgrades stacked. Typical example are natives (bad --> viable with bunch of french cards), warships (viable --> too op with docks techs and hc cards like offshore support), etc. This typically shows a poor design and should be revamped in theory. Musketeers upgrades should be the model for upgrades actually.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by fei123456 »

patch no nerf yumi=noob patch 3.1.1.1
see my game vs blackstar, how 100% yumi>>>sowar, logic?
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by _H2O »

Japan is under represented in current games. There's not a strong case for nerfing them in anyway right now. I'm pretty sure they have reasonable matchups vs most things.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by Darwin_ »

they do well vs. ports and dutch
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by JakeyBoyTH »

Couprider wrote:patch no nerf yumi=noob patch 3.1.1.1
see my game vs blackstar, how 100% yumi>>>sowar, logic?

yumi best anti-cav
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by Lunatic_Fringe »

In the late game, when they get upgraded, they become worth their cost. But as H20 said, making less Ashis and going more Yumi-Nagi is a better option. Ashis as a main unit in the composition is not ideal.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by pecelot »

Couprider wrote:patch no nerf yumi=noob patch 3.1.1.1

Yumis were nerfed in EP 3 :!:
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by _RDX_ »

rsy wrote:
Hazza54321 wrote:Compare their stats to sepoy, theyre just bad honestly

And they even cost more than sepoy lul

How come that's possible lol, They almost cost the same as sepoys.
Comparing ashis and sepoys.
Sepoys stats:
HP: 190
Ranged Damage: 25
Melee Damage: 15
Siege Damage: 22
Speed: 4
20% range resist
Cost: 90 f, 30 g

Ashi stats:
HP: 170
Ranged Damage: 24
Melee Damage: 10
Siege Damage: 21
Speed: 4.5
20% Melee resist.
Cost: 80 f, 40 g
Imo, -10 f from sepoys for -20 HP, -1 ranged attack, -1 siege attack, ~-2-3 Melee attack (comparing their damage against other units, ashis have higher multiplier, hence they don't exactly have 5 melee attack difference), +10 g for +0.5 speed.

The only thing ashis do here is to exchange 10 g for 0.5 speed. Sepoys prove to be stronger than ashis here. Sepoys can not do things well if it goes in a long run, whereas ashis have their stats going up slowly. Ashis have lot of stats increase options, whereas sepoys have only few.

Late game ashis vs Late game sepoys is a close call Imo. Japan has Daimyo and lot of attack buff options. India has Mansabdar Sepoy and a few stats increase options (Though sepoys generally have higher HP stats than ashis).

Ashis are really good and fair late game musketeers Imo.

As Couprider said, If anything has to be nerfed in japan, that's definitely yumis.

@_H2O seems to be worried to see others to talk about nerfing his favourite civ. :uglylol:
oranges.
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Re: Ashigaru 4.5

Post by pecelot »

the main issue with any HI past age 2 is their speed, Ashi dont have to worry about that at all

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