best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by wardyb1 »

fei123456 wrote:
lordraphael wrote:Early rush with 4 kanya and like 15 toma into age 3. You siege some houses kill a few vills,go for stagechoach if possible.basically You should so some dmg age up to 3 before dutch. Do some dmg again and then any eco dutch had should ne nulified and iros strongerr units will win

but does 4 kanya 15 toma really hurt dutch a lot? If you're playing french, do you think you can do mass damage with 4 hussar 15 musk? (and 4 hussar>4 kanya, 15 musk>15 toma)
dutch can even try to play age 2 with ep iro, and it's not easy to deal with hussar+skirm+8 pikes, backed up by 3 banks' eco.

Can't send 4 huss as french though. Would require adding a stable and making the huss. Iro don't have that problem, much quicker for iro to do it.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by fei123456 »

but now you don't have a start tp :sad:
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by lordraphael »

fei123456 wrote:
lordraphael wrote:Early rush with 4 kanya and like 15 toma into age 3. You siege some houses kill a few vills,go for stagechoach if possible.basically You should so some dmg age up to 3 before dutch. Do some dmg again and then any eco dutch had should ne nulified and iros strongerr units will win

but does 4 kanya 15 toma really hurt dutch a lot? If you're playing french, do you think you can do mass damage with 4 hussar 15 musk? (and 4 hussar>4 kanya, 15 musk>15 toma)
dutch can even try to play age 2 with ep iro, and it's not easy to deal with hussar+skirm+8 pikes, backed up by 3 banks' eco.

its about the speed iro can have that mass like 1 min earlier than fre so obviously it does a lot more dmg
breeze wrote: they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by Googol »

What do you do as french then ? Try to hold with mosk semi and poke and do 8 bow semi ?
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Post by deleted_user0 »

8 bow semi? and mosks? now thats a new one!
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Last time I tried to build a mosque as the French I got deported
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by Pseudo-ku »

I know this debate is getting milked out but here's my 2c, assuming this is EP:

Dutch are really good against pretty much every significant civ out there. They cripple against really weird/less popular civs because of timings. Spain can rush the banks, Ports can out-eco them, with a little pressure. Japan are generally pretty strong anti-meta, so they can beat Dutch. As a result I think Iro *could* beat Dutch, but they would have to be lucky, and impede dutch before they get 4-5 banks up.

Germs are just strong against everything. Predictable civ, but would completely outclass iros with 2 uhlan raiding and significant general unit power - on top of a competent SW eco system, which easily outclasses options at the Fire Pit. Best option imo.

France are just weak against everything. I would rather you play Sioux than France. Although their (bad) eco is on par, and not worse, than iro's, French units are generally, on the whole, garbo. Their shipments are uncompetitive (like Iro) and units are fairly limited and predictable.

So yeah, germs all the way.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by deleted_user0 »

Lol how does fre have garbage eco and units!?!?!?
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by JakeyBoyTH »

Pseudo-ku wrote:I know this debate is getting milked out but here's my 2c, assuming this is EP:

Dutch are really good against pretty much every significant civ out there. They cripple against really weird/less popular civs because of timings. Spain can rush the banks, Ports can out-eco them, with a little pressure. Japan are generally pretty strong anti-meta, so they can beat Dutch. As a result I think Iro *could* beat Dutch, but they would have to be lucky, and impede dutch before they get 4-5 banks up.



Looks like EP Dutch need buff @Googol
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Post by Kaiserklein »

It seems very easy to win as ger vs iro. Tomahawks are usually a better anti cav than musks, but in fact vs uhlans, even with wc aura, they need the same amount of hits as musks to kill/get killed. Plus iro cant really mix so much cav, since kanyas cost a lot of wood, and they lose to uhlans. If iro tries to rush you, you can just hold in colonial, like you would do vs russ or otto for example, and then timing push the fb in colo or fort. You dont need so much anti cav which is nice for ger, since iro wont mass tons of cav usually.

As france I think you lose, iro is just faster than you. Best bet against the 4 kanya + tomas semi is a musks semi, but then you age up later than iro and I feel like it's hard to hold their early skirms mass. You would need to be able to stay in your base for long enough to mass from your better eco, to compensate for the fact that his units are stronger, but usually you run out of food and need to push out before that.

As dutch you probably lose on good stagecoach maps, but I think you win otherwise, because you can stay in your base for so long, and also iro without stagecoach is kinda low eco.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by Pseudo-ku »

JakeyBoyTH wrote:
Pseudo-ku wrote:I know this debate is getting milked out but here's my 2c, assuming this is EP:

Dutch are really good against pretty much every significant civ out there. They cripple against really weird/less popular civs because of timings. Spain can rush the banks, Ports can out-eco them, with a little pressure. Japan are generally pretty strong anti-meta, so they can beat Dutch. As a result I think Iro *could* beat Dutch, but they would have to be lucky, and impede dutch before they get 4-5 banks up.



Looks like EP Dutch need buff @Googol


Nah tbh Dutch being hard countered by Japan, Otto or below is fair, because all of those civs drop off in effectiveness anyway.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by NekoBerk »

What is your PR @Pseudo-ku ?
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Post by tedere12 »

NekoBerk wrote:What is your PR @Pseudo-ku ?

what's yours?
Pseydo did some great stats analysis of the past tourney and his info is legit. It's not a matter of PR
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by Kaiserklein »

Nerkoberk why you always ask people their pr?
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by Gendarme »

It is a fetish of his - nothing personal.
Pay more attention to detail.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by momuuu »

lordraphael wrote:
fei123456 wrote:Dutch and german>>>iro in current meta

a well played iro wins vs dutch. Im 90 % certain of that.

What BO should iro use? Just out of curiosity. If you dont wanna share on forums bevause of tournament pm maybe, Im not playing in it and will keep my mouth shut.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by lordraphael »

Jerom wrote:
lordraphael wrote:
fei123456 wrote:Dutch and german>>>iro in current meta

a well played iro wins vs dutch. Im 90 % certain of that.

What BO should iro use? Just out of curiosity. If you dont wanna share on forums bevause of tournament pm maybe, Im not playing in it and will keep my mouth shut.

ask diarouga i dont play iro.We played that mu a few months ago and we both agreed that iro wins it. He did some sort of 4 kanya 15 toma pressure into age 3 iirc. I guess its sth like 4 kanya 600 wood 600 gold. I dont really know its been a while. I dont play in the tourney btw :)
breeze wrote: they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by NekoBerk »

tedere12 wrote:
NekoBerk wrote:What is your PR @Pseudo-ku ?

what's yours?
Pseydo did some great stats analysis of the past tourney and his info is legit. It's not a matter of PR


k boy, but i still wanting to know his PR.

Kaiserklein wrote:Nerkoberk why you always ask people their pr?


What's the problem? why do you care about it? it would be as bad as if I ask you why did you break up with queen?
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Post by Gendarme »

NekoBerk is relentless!
Pay more attention to detail.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by deleted_user0 »

lordraphael wrote:ask diarouga i dont play iro.We played that mu a few months ago and we both agreed that iro wins it. He did some sort of 4 kanya 15 toma pressure into age 3 iirc. I guess its sth like 4 kanya 600 wood 600 gold. I dont really know its been a while. I dont play in the tourney btw :)


pretty sure iro can just do whatever tbh. but i think vs the 4 kanya 15 toma build a dutch rush might actually cause some problems. but it would have to be tested.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by momuuu »

lordraphael wrote:
Jerom wrote:
lordraphael wrote:a well played iro wins vs dutch. Im 90 % certain of that.

What BO should iro use? Just out of curiosity. If you dont wanna share on forums bevause of tournament pm maybe, Im not playing in it and will keep my mouth shut.

ask diarouga i dont play iro.We played that mu a few months ago and we both agreed that iro wins it. He did some sort of 4 kanya 15 toma pressure into age 3 iirc. I guess its sth like 4 kanya 600 wood 600 gold. I dont really know its been a while. I dont play in the tourney btw :)

Ah thats enough information. I don't know if I'm up to the task of communicating with diarouga. Thanks anyways. I assume he did slow age up to age 2 then?

Also I have no idea what the tournament is about and who's playing in it.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by tedere12 »

4 kanya 5 vill 600g and then the 1.2k crates, ageup with wise woman then fast
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

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Post by Kaiserklein »

NekoBerk wrote:What's the problem? why do you care about it?

Everytime someone talks about aoe, you ask him what his pr he is, as though it was important... I just want to know why. Is it because low pr people can't give their opinion? Because if that's the case, you might as well stop posting yourself.

NekoBerk wrote:it would be as bad as if I ask you why did you break up with queen?

I don't see the fucking link with what we were saying?
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by _RDX_ »

Kaiserklein wrote:I just want to know why. Is it because low pr people can't give their opinion? Because if that's the case, you might as well stop posting yourself.

A perfect way to express a real man's generosity, its right there.
oranges.
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Re: best civ out of these 3 against iros

Post by NekoBerk »

Kaiserklein wrote:
NekoBerk wrote:What's the problem? why do you care about it?

Everytime someone talks about aoe, you ask him what his pr he is, as though it was important... I just want to know why. Is it because low pr people can't give their opinion? Because if that's the case, you might as well stop posting yourself.

NekoBerk wrote:it would be as bad as if I ask you why did you break up with queen?

I don't see the fucking link with what we were saying?


Don't put words in my mouth that i didn't say, a player with high PR like you can be wrong too (but if that's the case, then you supposedly stop playing at min 5 :uglylol: and start to troll mysteriously the rest of the game :maniac: ) the link with what we were saying is clear and simple, how can't you understand that?, what i meant is that you shouldn't care about what i do as simple as i don't about the things that you do. If i want to know about someone's PR is my goddamn problem and the problem of the person who i'm asking for, not yours, but i see that ask him in public was a mistake, i should have asked him in private because people go to far and likes to create drama where it isn't
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