Dutch - 7 Black riders vs 12 Swiss Pikes and More

[_DB_]

Hi,
I'm confused what card is better to have in your deck. I've saw many people using 12 swiss pikes, but 7 black riders must be overall better IMO.

What is better one to have in your deck?

[momuuu]

7 Black riders is nice when you're stuck in your TC only getting bank gold vs some all in musk huss push. Thats their main use I think.

12 swiss pikes are interesting to round out your army a little bit, but its hard to save up the 1000 gold imo.

[yurashic]

[strike]Dont play dutch [/strike]

Swiss pikemen are much better. As dutch it is good to have some hand units to block stuff like cuirs, uhlans, meteor hammers while ranged units do damage.

Black riders are not as useful because you already have ruyters.

Or do not use mercenaries at all.

[_H2O]

Both are terrible. If you want anti cav that costs mostly coin make ryters. You'll thank me later.

[iNcog]

Isn't it 9 black riders?

[yurashic]

Isn''t it 9 black riders?

Germans have 9 because of their civ bonus (no free uhlans but more mercs), dutch and french have 7.

[momuuu]

I really do like the 7 br card against colonial timings. Those things just destroy colonial armies. They have won me numerous games.

But really other than that, the 1000 coin shipping cost is a big con. Hard to macro that correctly. Even if you want to send mercs, youll probably want to consider doing the church card and getting the stradiots (+ extra banks ). They complement the dutch army much better.

[Jaeger]

Both are terrible. If you want anti cav that costs mostly coin make ryters. You''ll thank me later.

Don''t you think they''re good to have in your deck when you are in fortress vs a colonial army and have only a few pop and all vills in TC?

[rsy]

Both are terrible. If you want anti cav that costs mostly coin make ryters. Youll thank me later.

Dont you think theyre good to have in your deck when you are in fortress vs a colonial army and have only a few pop and all vills in TC?

do u think h2o is ever gonna have all vills in his tc?

[iNcog]

I think that part of the strength of mercenary shipments isn't as much that the units are particularly cost-efficient or anything. Well, they ARE, but that's not the point of mercenary shipments.

It's that they're so big in terms of the power they bring to the table, in a single shipment, that they give the player a power-spike which can turn the tide of the game if a fight occurs relatively soon.

[fei123456]

swiss pikemen can do some siege work. and they kill cavs (or even infantries) easily with your own hussars slowing them down.
black rider are not better than mass ruyter. but swiss are much better than halberd.

[Einfein]

in a single shipment, that they give the player a power-spike which can turn the tide of the game if a fight occurs relatively soon.

I completely agree with this. That said, I think 9/7 ruyter cards are much better options and the coin can be spent on more units/upgrades.

@op
7 BR is not a good card for dutch. Swiss are very situational, but I''ve seen them do work when timed right.

[Marco1698]

Dont you think theyre good to have in your deck when you are in fortress vs a colonial army and have only a few pop and all vills in TC?

do u think h2o is ever gonna have all vills in his tc?

ahahah +1

[princeofkabul]

I think Yurashic was spot on with his comment.

[_DB_]

Thanks for all the replies.

It appears that you honestly don't always need mercenaries to win.

I've one more sub question-
Do you need 1000 food and 1000 coin card? Do you need both, or one or neither?

[fei123456]

1000w is a must. 1000f is not. 1000g is available.
holland has banks but 1000g can help you mass 20-30 ruyters in 2-3 batches, or spam a huge wave of mecenaries.

[[Armag] diarouga]

1000f is a waste, 1000c is k but you won't need it or can't send it in a real game

[Mr_Bramboy]

I have 1k food in deck in case I run out of food, since both ruyters and skirms cost few food and banks will generate enough coin.

[[Armag] diarouga]

I have 1k food in deck in case I run out of food, since both ruyters and skirms cost few food and banks will generate enough coin.

imo when you run out of food you have to push for mapcontrol=>' send a unit shipment.

[Mr_Bramboy]

I have 1k food in deck in case I run out of food, since both ruyters and skirms cost few food and banks will generate enough coin.

imo when you run out of food you have to push for mapcontrol=> send a unit shipment.

By the time youre going to send 1k food youve most likely sent all significant unit shipments anyways.

[_DB_]

Okay. It appears 1000food isn't a significant shipment.

Next question:
Do you need refrigeration or royal mint card? Either, neither or any one?

[Mr_Bramboy]

Okay. It appears 1000food isn''t a significant shipment.

Next question:
Do you need refrigeration or royal mint card? Either, neither or any one?

@jerom

[momuuu]

Okay. It appears 1000food isn''t a significant shipment.

Next question:
Do you need refrigeration or royal mint card? Either, neither or any one?

Well, if you have 50 vills, your gonna have like 20 food, 20 coin and 10 wood. So these cards give you ~5 vills. Thats not a good fortress shipment, even in a best case scenario.

Maybe it is still decent late fortress, but Id consider the skirm attack and defense cards before it. Maybe another mediocre card (like 4 huss) is going to be useful in a higher percentage of games.

[fei123456]

dutch has fewer vills than other civs. so refrigeration or royal mint are bad. i prefer age 1 bank limit cards.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Okay. It appears 1000food isn''t a significant shipment.

Next question:
Do you need refrigeration or royal mint card? Either, neither or any one?

Hum,
Well, sometimes you can have 30vills on food so refrigeration gives you 6vills, that''s good. Even if you only have 20v on food it might be good.
Royal mint card is bad, just send an age 1 bank shipment instead.