COMPSTOMP

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Poland pecelot
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

Imperial Noob wrote:Hell of a post bro @pecelot :smile:

We have some more builds to test, including Sioux and Aztecs... :hmm:
Stay tuned, bois!
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by Nathan_Drake98 »

Thank you, it's really interesting to know how to beat comps!
I've always wanted to have a good players' opinion about it.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by silky »

pecelot wrote:
Imperial Noob wrote:Hell of a post bro @pecelot :smile:

We have some more builds to test, including Sioux and Aztecs... :hmm:
Stay tuned, bois!


Sioux build = spam BR, **** comp up the ass.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

I'd rather Cetan their asses up!
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by vaso413 »

Today I played on Deccan where I saw for the first time Advenced Church, AC units and walls. Also, when I started massing goons, the enemy(Dutch) conveniently had 70 skirms to deal with it. Has there been an AI update?
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

Not at all. Any mods?
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by super_wok44 »

I don't know if you have already mentioned or shared this video, but this is Aklak 1v7 100% handicap

phpBB [video]


Think it might be helpful
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

It abuses walls and is on nilla... I did the same with Sioux DS box, later on I can do a little write-up on that.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by vaso413 »

pecelot wrote:Not at all. Any mods?

No, and that's the weird part.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

Test it a bit more, show screens, perhaps it was just a coincidence with the army composition.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by vaso413 »

pecelot wrote:Test it a bit more, show screens, perhaps it was just a coincidence with the army composition.


I played a 1v1 (Brit vs Dutch) on Painted Desert for testing purposes, and massed different units 5 times in random order. Here are the compositions the enemy used - [imgur]http://imgur.com/a/r8DFP[/imgur]. Forgot to take screens, but the things I saw can't be a coincidence (I'm certain of it).
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

For one, the AI allegedly tries to counter your composition, but their means are either mediocre, extreme or bizarre :? The FP updated CPU does a better job at it — presumably :!:
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by EAGLEMUT »

pecelot wrote:CPU doesn't upgrade most of its units, even in the Imperial Age. That's why you can see at 40 minutes unupgraded crossbowmen, pikemen and such. Sometimes it does, though.

Yeah, I noticed this when working on my vanilla AI and actually found it hard to fix. Perhaps I was going at it the wrong way but I just couldn't get them to consistently do their damn techs.

pecelot wrote:For one, the AI allegedly tries to counter your composition, but their means are either mediocre, extreme or bizarre :? The FP updated CPU does a better job at it — presumably :!:

This one is pretty easy to improve in the AI code, just need to define what proper counters they should make. The original AI chooses rather horrible unit compositions so I wouldn't doubt any patch can make it significantly better.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

The first part is actually tricky, you can oftentimes find yourself fighting against crossbowmen shooting next to imperial field guns, or either veteran cuirassier or imperial gendarme — depending on the game, in almost identical circumstances (100% handicap given, resources aren't a problem) :?
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

Some more tipsh of mine:
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=12240
:flowers:
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by silky »

Have you ever seen anyone hack in a comp stomp? A couple days ago I saw some guy get up to 80 vills as Japan by about 10 minutes, then he had 8 falcs out of the consulate by about 11 or 12 minutes. What's the point? May as well host and play with cheats on.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by pecelot »

No, I haven't — I agree, it's utterly pointless, though.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by tnors »

old thread but hopefully i can find some answers. i am getting my rear end destroyed by expert ai with me having a 20% handicap playing as france. the three i am having trouble with are gall, dutch and fred. i have tried rush, ff, semi ff and even turtle. i have tried all combos of infantry/cavalry.

gall - his cavalry and infantry and absolutely impervious to my attacks. they are wicked tough. i can greatly outnumber him and he will eliminate my army in less than a minute - with my troops behind 2 layers of defensive walls and a nontrivial number of artillery units. i have on occasion been able to hold him off for a while and make it to age 3 but, he brings another huge wave of troops as soon as i repair the walls and i haven't had time to replace troops. it's astonishing how many troops he can bring so quickly and he slices through my wall like it's not even there. game over.

dutch - they are the toughest. the town has a tight formation surrounded by towers. the settlers are gathering behind the towers so i can't get to them. early on, my troops are not strong enough to bring down the towers/buildings in a timely fashion, he scales up, sends cavalry/infantry and i'm wiped out. i can rush but my troops get picked off by the towers and the tc.

fred - just scales up well and brings artillery early. game over.

i have watched plenty of videos and i am scratching my head every time because the ai treat them differently than they do me. the whole time i'm wondering where the hell enemy is!!! they're just letting the player scale up and then launch an attack on their town. one exception i have noticed is that on some occasions, interjection will build barracks near the enemy town, attack the opponent and just abandon his own town. however, he also has 2 tc's which is not available to me.

totally baffled
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by Plantinator »

tnors wrote:old thread but hopefully i can find some answers. i am getting my rear end destroyed by expert ai with me having a 20% handicap playing as france. the three i am having trouble with are gall, dutch and fred. i have tried rush, ff, semi ff and even turtle. i have tried all combos of infantry/cavalry.

gall - his cavalry and infantry and absolutely impervious to my attacks. they are wicked tough. i can greatly outnumber him and he will eliminate my army in less than a minute - with my troops behind 2 layers of defensive walls and a nontrivial number of artillery units. i have on occasion been able to hold him off for a while and make it to age 3 but, he brings another huge wave of troops as soon as i repair the walls and i haven't had time to replace troops. it's astonishing how many troops he can bring so quickly and he slices through my wall like it's not even there. game over.

dutch - they are the toughest. the town has a tight formation surrounded by towers. the settlers are gathering behind the towers so i can't get to them. early on, my troops are not strong enough to bring down the towers/buildings in a timely fashion, he scales up, sends cavalry/infantry and i'm wiped out. i can rush but my troops get picked off by the towers and the tc.

fred - just scales up well and brings artillery early. game over.

i have watched plenty of videos and i am scratching my head every time because the ai treat them differently than they do me. the whole time i'm wondering where the hell enemy is!!! they're just letting the player scale up and then launch an attack on their town. one exception i have noticed is that on some occasions, interjection will build barracks near the enemy town, attack the opponent and just abandon his own town. however, he also has 2 tc's which is not available to me.

totally baffled
I have found that the AI doesnt rly react weil to raids (either they react late or not at all or they idle like 30 vill at once)
I would therefore recommend a 5/10 hus semiff
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by wardyb1 »

For any Euro civ, just kill the fort wagon while it is on its way to set up. The AI becomes so clueless and slow after losing the fort it is pretty much a won game.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by ǝɯɐuɹǝsn »

if you try vs ai with 100% handicap, just don't spam wall and play on water map, or it's as hard as playing on a normal map vs a normal or hard comp ^^

aztec and india (when it's not bugged) are kinda hard to beat, aztec because they mass hard and non stop (aztec always reach 150-180 mil pop at a certain time) and india do a lot of urumy early when you're not really ready
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by aligator92 »

Just sit in base and boom with musks and falcs (also make culvs if the bot makes cannons). Let him waste his stuff vs this until you feel confident to push out and then you can usually steam roll him. If he has a fort don't attack it with less than 5 falcs, otherwise you might take too much time or waste too many units. If this doesn't work, you need to work on your macro (herd better, have a better build order for booming, balance your income better)
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by tnors »

wardyb1 wrote:For any Euro civ, just kill the fort wagon while it is on its way to set up. The AI becomes so clueless and slow after losing the fort it is pretty much a won game.
they definitely try to control the center of the board. one thing frustrating to me about this is that i have sent a contingent just for this very purpose only to find out they let the thing roll up and start building. they don't attack it like they do enemy troops and once the foundation is started, you're not going to destroy it short of artillery so even when i catch the wagon getting into position, i'm sometimes too late to start attacking. you have to just sit there and watch nonstop and hope you can attack it early enough.

the same is true with the dutch defensive towers. i figured what i would do is send a couple of groups to the outskirts of their town while they are gathering, attack, they retreat, keep them bottled up and then outscale their build. as soon as i attack, they send a settler to plant a tower. sometimes i can catch that settler but, they send others. i can't watch the entire town the entire time and while i am, they are building barracks/stable, spawn troops and then counter. i'm easy to defeat in that scenario because i haven't been able to take my eyes off of their town for my own troops or build

as far as the build order, i've tried just about every combo i can think of. having said that, i haven't bothered with marketplace/steel traps/etc because i have read in some threads there's no need. i speed to age 2. from there, i've tried rushing the ai, massing defensive troops, ff, semi ff, defensive walls, etc. again, dutch, gall and fred are the 3 i can't beat with me having a 20% handicap

i've tried to counter gall's infantry/cavalry combo with musk which get wiped out. then if i try cavalry/infantry combo, cavalry is more expensive and therefore take longer so i can't spawn up enough of them compared to gall. he can outpace me easily. his troops are insanely tough. so my problem with dutch is tactical whereas my problem with gall is a matter of force and scale. with isabella, i can survive her initial attack and then she just gets passive. i can outscale and attack with artillery and crush the town. with hiawatha or cuautemoc, i can just build walls, get artillery, pick them off and then counter. akbar, sul and toku just don't present formidable opposition forces. usually i semi ff them.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by wardyb1 »

tnors wrote:
wardyb1 wrote:For any Euro civ, just kill the fort wagon while it is on its way to set up. The AI becomes so clueless and slow after losing the fort it is pretty much a won game.
they definitely try to control the center of the board. one thing frustrating to me about this is that i have sent a contingent just for this very purpose only to find out they let the thing roll up and start building. they don't attack it like they do enemy troops and once the foundation is started, you're not going to destroy it short of artillery so even when i catch the wagon getting into position, i'm sometimes too late to start attacking. you have to just sit there and watch nonstop and hope you can attack it early enough.

the same is true with the dutch defensive towers. i figured what i would do is send a couple of groups to the outskirts of their town while they are gathering, attack, they retreat, keep them bottled up and then outscale their build. as soon as i attack, they send a settler to plant a tower. sometimes i can catch that settler but, they send others. i can't watch the entire town the entire time and while i am, they are building barracks/stable, spawn troops and then counter. i'm easy to defeat in that scenario because i haven't been able to take my eyes off of their town for my own troops or build

as far as the build order, i've tried just about every combo i can think of. having said that, i haven't bothered with marketplace/steel traps/etc because i have read in some threads there's no need. i speed to age 2. from there, i've tried rushing the ai, massing defensive troops, ff, semi ff, defensive walls, etc. again, dutch, gall and fred are the 3 i can't beat with me having a 20% handicap

i've tried to counter gall's infantry/cavalry combo with musk which get wiped out. then if i try cavalry/infantry combo, cavalry is more expensive and therefore take longer so i can't spawn up enough of them compared to gall. he can outpace me easily. his troops are insanely tough. so my problem with dutch is tactical whereas my problem with gall is a matter of force and scale. with isabella, i can survive her initial attack and then she just gets passive. i can outscale and attack with artillery and crush the town. with hiawatha or cuautemoc, i can just build walls, get artillery, pick them off and then counter. akbar, sul and toku just don't present formidable opposition forces. usually i semi ff them.
It really sounds like you just need to work on your mechanics and what not. With 20% handicap you should be demolishing any ai you play. You should be able to ff and outmass the ai easily. All in all, I'd recommend just having a closer look at your macro and micro and being a bit more critical of your own play.
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Re: COMPSTOMP

Post by tnors »

It really sounds like you just need to work on your mechanics and what not. With 20% handicap you should be demolishing any ai you play. You should be able to ff and outmass the ai easily. All in all, I'd recommend just having a closer look at your macro and micro and being a bit more critical of your own play.
i see in videos that on expert, the ai is easily outpacing the player, such as interjection. you can watch the numbers in the top right. in fact, by the time he gets to his first attack, the ai has nearly double the points. for some reason, his attacks are more powerful. for example, he's able to take down a building. it's baffling to me. i can have 10-15 musketeers going at a building, such as stable or marketplace, the enemy sends troops and i get wiped out wayyyyy before i make any headway on the building. in some instances i have exactly copied the build in videos and it just doesn't work in real life. i don't know why the ai is weak and lets them have free reign whereas when i play, it's totally different.

i definitely have examined my build order and the only thing i haven't tried that has been suggested in past threads is marketplace/steel traps. however, others said they were able to get to the enemy before they really needed anything like that. take dutch for example, when i have tried to rush them, i explained in a prior post what happens. that's way before any build order becomes a problem. you speed to age 2, build barracks, spawn up some units, go attack, get wiped out. the only other thing to do is not rush (ff, semi, defensive) and that hasn't worked for me either.

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