User avatar
Italy DaRkNiTe1698
Lancer
Posts: 617
ESO: Marco1698

10 Jan 2017, 19:54

_H2O wrote:My view is that skill goes down over time but that rating decay also goes down faster at the absolute top. Meaning sure I'm only able to get pr 41 now but I am surely pr 47+ still.

I don't think I'm as good as I was when I played hours a day though.

Basically I'm just riding my own decay against the communities to remain on top :D
What's your top shape? You probably know that. WCG era? Pk clan era? Spring championship vs blackstar or what else?
A day without laughter is a day wasted

Charlie Chaplin
User avatar
No Flag r4go
Howdah
Posts: 1269

10 Jan 2017, 21:06

lordraphael wrote:
r4go wrote:
Show hidden quotes

umhh garja was more active, young at that time. Garja from that day as decay.

thats a poor excuse. I dont think garja was better than he is now honestly. Also i dont think that players really get worse the older they get. Maybe thats the case if youre like older than 30 but im quite sure that players skills dont decrease in their 20s.

how old are you rapha??
Pizza, spaghetti, maccheroni, mandolino e tua mamma :flowers:
Germany lordraphael
Howdah
Posts: 1657

10 Jan 2017, 21:11

umeu wrote:he was definitely better at the time. h2o was ofc the best and he was going to win the tournament after he eliminated his only real competitor which was inshape nagayumi. But Garja was actually consistently taking games off h2o at the time, in practice and real games too. Now he's getting sweeped 5-0 by ryan. And ryan wasnt even at his peak now, while I he was definitely gearing up for his peak during pk4. He played so many games at that time. Definitely much more than he did for these last 2 tournaments.

you think ? I played vs garja from 2011-12 and from 2015- now. Unless he had a sudden skill spike in 2013 when pk was going on, which can be true ofc but i kinda doubt it, I can say that in my opinion garja has been playing on the same level, at least every time I played vs him and hes one of the players i actually played relatively often ( im not saying that level is low or anything ).

and yea H2o would have won ez. He just cruised through that tournament. Also helped him alot that most games where mirrors (iirc) where hes undoubtedly the best.
breeze wrote:they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
Germany lordraphael
Howdah
Posts: 1657

10 Jan 2017, 21:13

r4go wrote:
lordraphael wrote:
Show hidden quotes

thats a poor excuse. I dont think garja was better than he is now honestly. Also i dont think that players really get worse the older they get. Maybe thats the case if youre like older than 30 but im quite sure that players skills dont decrease in their 20s.

how old are you rapha??

im 23 and If i compare myself at the age of 18-20 ( the supposedly prime of gamers) with myself now, then i have no doubt which one is the better player. Not only in aoe but also in other games.
breeze wrote:they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
User avatar
Italy Garja
ESOC Maps Team
Donator 01
Posts: 4567
ESO: Garja

10 Jan 2017, 21:35

You do get worse as you age ahah
If anything because you can't commit as much as before.
User avatar
Australia VooDoo_BoSs
Crossbow
Posts: 17
ESO: VooDoo_BoSs
Location: Australia

10 Jan 2017, 21:53

I think the shift in meta has certainly improved the average player. Eco /xp play is far more developed than it ever was before 2011 ish. I honestly think a player ranked 10-30 in 1v1 ELO today would be ranked top 5 in 2010,11.

It's quite similar to chess, top 100 players today would have been easily number 1 in 1950 due to the community collectively improving play over time. For example, schooners and age 1 TPs are incredibly common nowadays but was extremely rare in the past.
User avatar
No Flag ovi12
Jaeger
Posts: 3830

10 Jan 2017, 22:09

VooDoo_BoSs wrote:I think the shift in meta has certainly improved the average player. Eco /xp play is far more developed than it ever was before 2011 ish. I honestly think a player ranked 10-30 in 1v1 ELO today would be ranked top 5 in 2010,11.

It's quite similar to chess, top 100 players today would have been easily number 1 in 1950 due to the community collectively improving play over time. For example, schooners and age 1 TPs are incredibly common nowadays but was extremely rare in the past.

But the question people are arguing is like, if the chess players from 1950 were given a few years to catch up with current strategies, would they still lose to the current players?
last time i cryed was because i stood on Lego
User avatar
Italy Garja
ESOC Maps Team
Donator 01
Posts: 4567
ESO: Garja

10 Jan 2017, 23:05

You just can't catch up with 50 year theory of chess in few years. A whole lifetime probably wouldn't be enough for a person that wasn't born in the computer era. Not to compete with those who grow learning that theory atleast. So no, top 1950 players would still get trashed by current top players, except for maybe 2-3 world Champions.
Maybe a player like Kasparov who played more recently and also has immense talent could give current top players hard time if he was able to train seriously for atleast one year. He actually won some blitz games couple months ago in exhibition matches. But aging still sucks for such competitive game.

As for AOE3 the game just has less theory and players tend to uniforme to one meta because they can't spend enough time on researching side strats or refined builds to innovate.
So ye, a good old player with up to date knowledge and a bit of training to catch up would still be competitive with other current top players.
No Flag umeu
Gendarme
Posts: 6773

10 Jan 2017, 23:32

lordraphael wrote:
umeu wrote:he was definitely better at the time. h2o was ofc the best and he was going to win the tournament after he eliminated his only real competitor which was inshape nagayumi. But Garja was actually consistently taking games off h2o at the time, in practice and real games too. Now he's getting sweeped 5-0 by ryan. And ryan wasnt even at his peak now, while I he was definitely gearing up for his peak during pk4. He played so many games at that time. Definitely much more than he did for these last 2 tournaments.

you think ? I played vs garja from 2011-12 and from 2015- now. Unless he had a sudden skill spike in 2013 when pk was going on, which can be true ofc but i kinda doubt it, I can say that in my opinion garja has been playing on the same level, at least every time I played vs him and hes one of the players i actually played relatively often ( im not saying that level is low or anything ).

and yea H2o would have won ez. He just cruised through that tournament. Also helped him alot that most games where mirrors (iirc) where hes undoubtedly the best.


He didnt cruise, he dropped more games in that tournament before the finals than in any other. 3 vs nagayumi and 2 or 3 vs garja. And ryan himself is saying hes getting worse, not better.

Anyway this discussion is always the same, and it never goes anywhere :/ might aswell end it
I kissed a girl and I liked it
Popped her cherry with my chapstick
I kissed a girl just to try it
I hope my wife don't mind it
It felt so wrong, it felt so right
Don't mean I'm in love tonight
I kissed a girl and I liked it
I liked it
No Flag umeu
Gendarme
Posts: 6773

10 Jan 2017, 23:39

lordraphael wrote:
r4go wrote:
Show hidden quotes

how old are you rapha??

im 23 and If i compare myself at the age of 18-20 ( the supposedly prime of gamers) with myself now, then i have no doubt which one is the better player. Not only in aoe but also in other games.


Well, when it comes to winning games, i think now i would beat myself 4 years ago, but thats because i have a deeper understanding of the game. However i dont have that raw apm or skill that i had back then when i could use 9 control groups and manually micro alot of units at the same time. If i wouldve known the things i know now back then, i wouldnt lose to my current form ever, not 1 game. Part of it is age, part of it is too that i played nilla back then and nilla requires more apm.
I kissed a girl and I liked it
Popped her cherry with my chapstick
I kissed a girl just to try it
I hope my wife don't mind it
It felt so wrong, it felt so right
Don't mean I'm in love tonight
I kissed a girl and I liked it
I liked it
User avatar
Great Britain WickedCossack
Retired Contributor
Posts: 1361

10 Jan 2017, 23:41

umeu wrote:
Well, when it comes to winning games, i think now i would beat myself 4 years ago, but thats because i have a deeper understanding of the game. However i dont have that raw apm or skill that i had back then when i could use 9 control groups and manually micro alot of units at the same time. If i wouldve known the things i know now back then, i wouldnt lose to my current form ever, not 1 game. Part of it is age, part of it is too that i played nilla back then and nilla requires more apm.


Bullshit, you a blimming octopus brah??? 7 or 8 .... ok I get ... but all 9???
No Flag umeu
Gendarme
Posts: 6773

10 Jan 2017, 23:43

I still use all 9, but when the game gets chaotic i no longer can keep up and i often mess up my groups. Often i would forget to hotkey my rax or stable, so now i just bypassed that by setting the hotkey directly to the building.
I kissed a girl and I liked it
Popped her cherry with my chapstick
I kissed a girl just to try it
I hope my wife don't mind it
It felt so wrong, it felt so right
Don't mean I'm in love tonight
I kissed a girl and I liked it
I liked it
User avatar
United States of America giveuanxiety
AoE:O Team
Posts: 881
ESO: GiveUAnxiety

11 Jan 2017, 01:20

I think a lot of that is more with time played rather than age. I've heard the whole age thing before but for the most part I dont like it and I dont agree with it. For one example, counter strike recently started getting more popular. They had the esports on national tv and I caught a little bit of it. That is a really old game also and the announcers were saying that the players that started playing the game when it first came out and are probably around 30 years old now are still the ones dominating the competitive scene. Probably largely due to their increased knowledge of the game compared to the younger guys.
Follow my stream @ twitch.tv/giveuanxiety
Germany lordraphael
Howdah
Posts: 1657

11 Jan 2017, 01:29

Garja wrote:You do get worse as you age ahah
If anything because you can't commit as much as before.

but that has nothing to do with age lol. Every player,regardless of the age , will get worse if he has to reduce his gaming time by a significant amount.
breeze wrote:they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
Tuvalu gibson
Gendarme
Posts: 6012
Location: USA

11 Jan 2017, 01:52

I refuse to believe that people get worse due to age before midish thirties or so.... if Kobe bean Bryant can go out and score 60 points at 37 against the best athletes in the world you can god damn click a mouse 100 times per minute
I kissed a girl and I liked it
The taste of her cherry chap stick
I kissed a girl just to try it
I hope my boyfriend don't mind it
It felt so wrong, it felt so right
Don't mean I'm in love tonight
I kissed a girl and I liked it
I liked it
Germany duckzilla
Crossbow
Posts: 34

11 Jan 2017, 06:48

The causal effect is not age itself. Rather, age can be used as a dummy variable because it is highly correlated with variables such as "does not have the time to commit" or "has developed some illness". Of course this is not a perfect correlation. There may be some people around who are in their late 30s and still play as good as they did when they were early 20. But the general tendency is that you get worse by age.
"To counter the pike-boom, you must become the pike-boom." - Karl V. (HRE)
User avatar
No Flag r4go
Howdah
Posts: 1269

11 Jan 2017, 08:27

lordraphael wrote:
r4go wrote:
Show hidden quotes

how old are you rapha??

im 23 and If i compare myself at the age of 18-20 ( the supposedly prime of gamers) with myself now, then i have no doubt which one is the better player. Not only in aoe but also in other games.

Well you are young, me and garja are 29. At this age there are a lot of things that don't allow you to nerd on videogames. Unfortunately man/woman lost thier skills for something they do when you are young. For example is sc2 all the pro stopped to play at 23 years old, in acrobatic dance its the same. Videogames are a new world where scientist know few things about his relationships whit the uman's life. But one of the thing they know is that you start to decay your skills as player when you are near 24_25
Pizza, spaghetti, maccheroni, mandolino e tua mamma :flowers:
User avatar
No Flag r4go
Howdah
Posts: 1269

11 Jan 2017, 08:30

lordraphael wrote:
Garja wrote:You do get worse as you age ahah
If anything because you can't commit as much as before.

but that has nothing to do with age lol. Every player,regardless of the age , will get worse if he has to reduce his gaming time by a significant amount.

Life brings you to reduce it, force you. You can stay allthe time whit the pc playing. You need to work, take care of your parents.maybe you will marry and have a child (the end of your life as player)
Pizza, spaghetti, maccheroni, mandolino e tua mamma :flowers:
User avatar
No Flag r4go
Howdah
Posts: 1269

11 Jan 2017, 08:32

ovi12 wrote:
VooDoo_BoSs wrote:I think the shift in meta has certainly improved the average player. Eco /xp play is far more developed than it ever was before 2011 ish. I honestly think a player ranked 10-30 in 1v1 ELO today would be ranked top 5 in 2010,11.

It's quite similar to chess, top 100 players today would have been easily number 1 in 1950 due to the community collectively improving play over time. For example, schooners and age 1 TPs are incredibly common nowadays but was extremely rare in the past.

But the question people are arguing is like, if the chess players from 1950 were given a few years to catch up with current strategies, would they still lose to the current players?

They will not lose vs current players. You can learn strategy, but talent his your. Personally i'm agree whit h20, this meta has a major skills
Pizza, spaghetti, maccheroni, mandolino e tua mamma :flowers:
User avatar
Singapore milku3459
Howdah
Posts: 1015
ESO: jamescheif100
Location: in your base, killing your dudes

11 Jan 2017, 09:18

MY PR UPDATED A FEW MINUTES AGO
1/5/17
Image
User avatar
Switzerland sebnan12
Howdah
Posts: 1057
ESO: Hazza5413|Hazza54321
Location: dat earth doe

11 Jan 2017, 10:06

gibson wrote:I refuse to believe that people get worse due to age before midish thirties or so.... if Kobe bean Bryant can go out and score 60 points at 37 against the best athletes in the world you can god damn click a mouse 100 times per minute

yes!
Team Daniele Caria! _Riot
Switzerland bobabu
Lancer
Posts: 766

11 Jan 2017, 10:14

r4go wrote:
lordraphael wrote:
Show hidden quotes

im 23 and If i compare myself at the age of 18-20 ( the supposedly prime of gamers) with myself now, then i have no doubt which one is the better player. Not only in aoe but also in other games.

Well you are young, me and garja are 29. At this age there are a lot of things that don't allow you to nerd on videogames. Unfortunately man/woman lost thier skills for something they do when you are young. For example is sc2 all the pro stopped to play at 23 years old, in acrobatic dance its the same. Videogames are a new world where scientist know few things about his relationships whit the uman's life. But one of the thing they know is that you start to decay your skills as player when you are near 24_25


Aoe is not competitive enough for it to actually start mattering. However, it is true what you are saying it just doesn't apply as much to aoe as other games.
User avatar
No Flag r4go
Howdah
Posts: 1269

11 Jan 2017, 10:42

milku3459 wrote:MY PR UPDATED A FEW MINUTES AGO

it's simply elorating not working. Pr is working dude
Pizza, spaghetti, maccheroni, mandolino e tua mamma :flowers:
User avatar
No Flag r4go
Howdah
Posts: 1269

11 Jan 2017, 10:44

VooDoo_BoSs wrote:I think the shift in meta has certainly improved the average player. Eco /xp play is far more developed than it ever was before 2011 ish. I honestly think a player ranked 10-30 in 1v1 ELO today would be ranked top 5 in 2010,11.

It's quite similar to chess, top 100 players today would have been easily number 1 in 1950 due to the community collectively improving play over time. For example, schooners and age 1 TPs are incredibly common nowadays but was extremely rare in the past.

2010-11 is not the old meta, old meta is 2005-09
Pizza, spaghetti, maccheroni, mandolino e tua mamma :flowers:
User avatar
Italy Garja
ESOC Maps Team
Donator 01
Posts: 4567
ESO: Garja

11 Jan 2017, 11:07

lordraphael wrote:
Garja wrote:You do get worse as you age ahah
If anything because you can't commit as much as before.

but that has nothing to do with age lol. Every player,regardless of the age , will get worse if he has to reduce his gaming time by a significant amount.

Motivation.
I spent last 3 years on AOE mostly playing for addiction or for fun. Back then I used to optimize time much better. It did also help that I could stick on a good 20-30 games routine when I needed to. Nowadays you just cant embark on such learning process.

Forum Info

Return to “General”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests