[RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

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[RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

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Post by _NT_sven »

Hi all! I am new to the forum.

I played an interesting match just now. It is basically a Chinese FF countering Spanish FF, but after we aged up things started to go oddly. I produced Apache cavalries to raid his villagers, while at the same time I ran out of natural resources. The fight started rather in the late game.

I am trying this build because I really love Apache cavalries for their high raiding efficiency! But I think I can apply this build (refugee - 700G - 700W - Native Craft) to other maps as well, if they have good tribes of course. We normally expect native craft to produce 600 exports, and that is quite incredible for a Age III card.

Although I won this not because of producing native warriors, as I just made a few of them, but for Apache raiding. And my micro is extremely bad (I missed many chances to kill more villagers). Still, I would say it is an interesting one!
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[RE SP] _NT_sven[CH] vs BoJackHorseman[SP] - Painted Desert.age3yrec
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Painted Desert
Painted Desert
Rules: Supremacy (1v1)
Version: Official Patch (Legacy)
Length: 20 minutes
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by CelticCrusader »

Thanks for the record. I will take a look. I also love the Apache !
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by deleted_user0 »

if you think about it tho, 600 xport for 400w (need to make 2 tp's) and 1 card (worth 1000 resources) is rather underwhelming. In fact, it's not even enough for the 2nd tier army in itself, you need to have 200 xport stacked. And, if you are allied with brits, which you should be, you get 8 redcoats + 1 falc. Basically, if you consider 400xport for 6 redcoats, the card is worth 9 redcoats. Aka, it's like intervention, but you need to pay 400 too. It's really not a great card honestly. I would use it only if i'd need export for something else then units, such as the russian factory or fort wagons etc. But in that case, GFA is probably a better card to send.
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

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Post by pecelot »

Apaches are always worth it :chinese:

[spoiler=spoiler]Image

Image

:kinggreen: :mrgreen: :ugly: :uglylol: :maniac:[/spoiler]
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by _NT_sven »

umeu wrote:if you think about it tho, 600 xport for 400w (need to make 2 tp's) and 1 card (worth 1000 resources) is rather underwhelming. In fact, it's not even enough for the 2nd tier army in itself, you need to have 200 xport stacked. And, if you are allied with brits, which you should be, you get 8 redcoats + 1 falc. Basically, if you consider 400xport for 6 redcoats, the card is worth 9 redcoats. Aka, it's like intervention, but you need to pay 400 too. It's really not a great card honestly.


Yes I have calculated as such. But I still think this could be a great card under some circumstances. First, if you will produce natives after building a TP, 400W is not wasted then (like this match, I wasted 200W for Navajo, but not that 200W for Apache); secondly, when you just age up you should have around 300 exports, which are not enough to spawn redcoats to deal with an imminent threat. In this case we usually send intervention which gives 9 redcoats. However if we get 600 exports we can get 12 redcoats immediately, though the actual values are the same. So I think if you can use at least one TP for production, and you are in a danger of being pushed, then 600 exports are actually better than 9 redcoats (and you also have the choice of 1 cannon!).

Also, consider that 9 redcoats are already sort of beyond the normal value of Age III cards...
Plum blossoms fall below the steps like whirling snow;
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by _NT_sven »

umeu wrote:if you think about it tho, 600 xport for 400w (need to make 2 tp's) and 1 card (worth 1000 resources) is rather underwhelming. In fact, it's not even enough for the 2nd tier army in itself, you need to have 200 xport stacked. And, if you are allied with brits, which you should be, you get 8 redcoats + 1 falc. Basically, if you consider 400xport for 6 redcoats, the card is worth 9 redcoats. Aka, it's like intervention, but you need to pay 400 too. It's really not a great card honestly. I would use it only if i'd need export for something else then units, such as the russian factory or fort wagons etc. But in that case, GFA is probably a better card to send.


And what is the value of 600 exports, actually? In age II you got 300 exports and 700 resources, if you double the amount then it becomes 600 to 1400. Even if you waste 400 W only for building TP you are still sending a decent card! (ofc in reality we are always in a shortage of woods, so this couldn't be risked as the first choice of Age III) Or is this method faulty? According to this then 9 redcoats actually are worth 1400 resources??? It's super OP then!
Plum blossoms fall below the steps like whirling snow;
They cover me still though brushed off a while ago.

-Tune: "Pure Serene Music", Li Yu (937-978 AD), the Last Lord of Southern Tang Dynasty
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by deleted_user0 »

Yes, 9 redcoats is a good card to send, tho 9 musketeers in itself isn't that much value, its the unit, the redcoat, that makes it quite good. However, with batches, you can't send half a batch. This makes the 600xport card a bit underwhelming for units.

that said, on some maps, where natives have good techs or good units, it might indeed make for an interesting semi ff into mass redcoats. u get the 12 + 9 from intervention and have a strong fast push maybe
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by Jaeger »

umeu wrote:Yes, 9 redcoats is a good card to send, tho 9 musketeers in itself isn't that much value, its the unit, the redcoat, that makes it quite good. However, with batches, you can't send half a batch. This makes the 600xport card a bit underwhelming for units.

that said, on some maps, where natives have good techs or good units, it might indeed make for an interesting semi ff into mass redcoats. u get the 12 + 9 from intervention and have a strong fast push maybe

Wait there is a 600 export card? Why not just send it when you already have 200 export?
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by deleted_user0 »

its not 600xport. its 300xport for every native tribe youre allied with.

and you don't send it for that reason, china usually can't spare the wood to build 2 tps anyway. and 300/600xport is awkward. cuz on it's own, it gives you exactly nothing :/ the same is kinda true for 300xport, but that atleast also cheapens making relations, so it's basically a 375 xport card, which is why its worth it.
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Re: [RE] _NT_sven (China 29) vs BoJackHorseman (Spain 34)

Post by S86 »

i just watched ,it is truely interesting though it's a controvercial build among top players above.
first your rival has to worry about how to cover his arse before pushing forward while Apaches are rading around his hunting ground. secondly i could get a canon plus redcoats.I could not say it is the best build (my math test often got zero mark at school),but I iwll give it a go when I play china next time .

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