Kaiserklein vs Knuschelbär

[Hazza54321]

Can add abus by that time already though

abus are only useful once knusch leaves his base for res though :p

[Garja]

He switched way later to abus, at that point was fine because they both stabilized and otto build wasn't forcing anymore. Basically he had to switch cause he lost momentum (again because too many huss he got pushed back). There were several moments where the game was almost even while with proper build (2nd rax) in those conditions (was ulhan semi right?) I think it should be one sided from beginning to end.


About the anticipation, again, if you are leading it is up to the opponent to counter. If you already have too much of one unit and keep massing the same unit there is simply no way the opponent will make enough stuff to counter that. Also the logic is that if you stick to the same units you're naturally building more units because you don't have to change macro (no vill walking time) plus you normally do economies with market ups and unit ups.
In this case, however, it is more about the fact that all Germans fortress shipments (except mercs) will have ulhans (plus spare ulhans possibly) so by going abus you're giving something to bite. Also abus don't even counter WW. WWs can powerplay over abus easier than over jans (less hp, minumum range, not even good damage output vs RC for their pop, ecc.). They do fine in combination with jans (and behind them possibly since they're easily to be picked off in front). A point in favor of abus is that it's the only upgradable unit so you kinda want something that is affected by your remaining shipments.

[Kaiserklein]

Like Veni said, only 9 br or a similar mass of wws is really scary tbh. Less than 5 wws or so, and I can just catch them with a big mass of huss, and even get a good trade.

I don't think I overmade huss, I think you anyway need a ton of huss against germany, because 1) Ger anti-cav is shitty 2) Huss can block all those free uhlans 3) Huss give you the snaring potential that you need against kiting compositions 4) Huss can catch raids.
I can't see why I would go double rax jans, they're more useless than abus or huss against ger age 3 composition. You just need enough of them to be safe against uhlans, but both abus and huss do a better job against skirm and wws than jans do. And in age 2, you also want to go heavy on huss anyway, not on jans (at least not heavy enough to motivate a double rax).

Abus are still really strong anyway. And even though it's true that ww tank more than goons vs abus, because they don't have a range resist, abus still do a decent job against them. They're also the only unit to get age 2 upgrades. And they have good dps against any kind of unit, so if you can cover them it's np.
He did a xbow pike semi btw, not uhlan semi.

[Garja]

I'm not talking about dual rax start. I'm just saying aftert 700g 700w 700f I usually stagecoach and drop a 2nd rax cause you need more infantry vs BR or WW, while 50:50 composition gets unbalanced easily and cleaned up with shipments. Also it doesn't work vs straight FF for WW or BR while 75:25 should still work vs that.
Ye you are right he started 5 pikes or something. Btw you lost 2 vills iirc. I normally gather 200w for faster stable (instead of 2nd TP that I drop with 700w). That way you get huss out at 5.10 so can catch first ulhans and also do raid very early. Also you get like 8 huss 5 jan at 6 minutes in his base which is normally too much for Germans w/e they do.

[fei123456]

i don't understand why people love bad shipments like 7 skirm, 8 uhlan etc. 5 dopple is 1000+450 resources, and can kill 15+ hussar np. ofc you can try to kill them with jan abus, but you need 5 shots, which means your uhlan/skirm can deal tons of damage for 15 seconds, while his hussar can only escape.
straight 9 blackrider can also beat ottoman easily.

[Gendarme]

Because skirmishers are almost always good, and uhlans are almost always good. Doppelsöldners are not almost always good.

[Kaiserklein]

I'm not talking about dual rax start. I'm just saying aftert 700g 700w 700f I usually stagecoach and drop a 2nd rax cause you need more infantry vs BR or WW, while 50:50 composition gets unbalanced easily and cleaned up with shipments. Also it doesn't work vs straight FF for WW or BR while 75:25 should still work vs that.
Ye you are right he started 5 pikes or something. Btw you lost 2 vills iirc. I normally gather 200w for faster stable (instead of 2nd TP that I drop with 700w). That way you get huss out at 5.10 so can catch first ulhans and also do raid very early. Also you get like 8 huss 5 jan at 6 minutes in his base which is normally too much for Germans w/e they do.

The thing is I chopped 60w for a tp in age 1, because I had 400w start + 40w treas in base. That's why my batches were a bit late. Then I think I just lost a fb vil, I don't remember losing another one, but idk.

[milku3459]

Because skirmishers are almost always good, and uhlans are almost always good. Doppelsöldners are not almost always good.

literally every game with ger i've seen this tournament ended in amove uhlan...

[Hazza54321]

z move uhlan literally the best strat haha

[Kaiserklein]

literally every game with ger i've seen this tournament ended in amove uhlan...

Yeah that's what happens when people mass skirms for no reason and don't have hand cav to block.
You should watch my game 4 vs soldier (ger mirror) and my game 1 vs knusch (ger vs ports), there was no uhlan attack move

[tedere12]

i don't understand why people love bad shipments like 7 skirm, 8 uhlan etc. 5 dopple is 1000+450 resources, and can kill 15+ hussar np. ofc you can try to kill them with jan abus, but you need 5 shots, which means your uhlan/skirm can deal tons of damage for 15 seconds, while his hussar can only escape.
straight 9 blackrider can also beat ottoman easily.

dopps can get kited by goon skim compositions and musks can easily focus them down so in most cases they are technically useless, unless you manage to get a good pop on the enemy army

[KINGofOsmane]

ger on top again gj

[Kaiserklein]

ger on top again gj

Do you mean ger >> fre? Ger >> ports with 4 atps? Or Ger >> otto? Cause that's all we had in this series

[Mitoe]

i don't understand why people love bad shipments like 7 skirm, 8 uhlan etc. 5 dopple is 1000+450 resources, and can kill 15+ hussar np. ofc you can try to kill them with jan abus, but you need 5 shots, which means your uhlan/skirm can deal tons of damage for 15 seconds, while his hussar can only escape.
straight 9 blackrider can also beat ottoman easily.

But they're not veteran.

[DaRkNiTe1698]

german so broken

[Kaiserklein]

german so broken

Do you mean ger >> fre? Ger >> ports with 4 atps? Or Ger >> otto? Cause that's all we had in this series

[DaRkNiTe1698]

In general they're too strong

[deleted_user0]

Sioux can take on ger i think.
Brits can.
Otto is a fair mu.
India probably does ok
China has chances, though its tough.
Fre has chances but ger probs wins
Ports and spain haves chances but probs ger favored.

Ger is top tier with brits and maybe sioux. To balance these civs out iro needs to become viable in colonial again

[Kaiserklein]

I think spain or ports on atp maps do just fine vs ger. Then we also need to think that on no tp map ger becomes trash, and water is bad for them as well. Its probs a top civ, but only on maps with tps and without a really good stagecoach and without heavy water.
And even then like umeu said, brits otto and sioux do just fine vs ger, and imo france as well. Even japs probs do ok, though again it depends a lot on the map.

[pecelot]

Map pools consist of TP maps in the vast majority of cases