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France iNcog
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Post by iNcog »

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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

abt why feminism is bs and an orchestred economy boost? I read enough of Simone de Beauvoir to figure it out (who is with Jean paul Sartre a shameful writer who collaborated with Nazis and changed their mind right after ww2 when it wasnt worth it anymore, since apparently many american tend to worship her books)
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France iNcog
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Post by iNcog »

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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

and you think politican come from nowhere, they aren't finance in the first place by anyone? They manage to seduce millions of people with nice speech, thats it?
People have some power, but I believe they have much less than what they think they have, simply because the characters that are presented to them in the first place are already selected. and even if they end up being able to chose someone who wasn't already selected, he will never win because mass marketing and money always win.
I'm impressed by people like you who have such a faith in humanity tbh, but I mean srsly, how can you think you have any influence when one of your meaningful vote will get destroyed by 10 other who will vote for obama became the marketing around him is hype. I was in the US when he was elected, the average obama voter I talked was a complete ignorant. but same for the video you linked abt hillary I believe few days ago. the average voter will vote only because of who has enough money to market him, that's it, and you can't do anything abt that
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France iNcog
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Post by iNcog »

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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

I don't want to despise you (tbh I find what you said really disconnected from reality) cuz I find it honorable and we need people who believe in the system (I guess?), but I don't really believe that its right if you consider the average voter and how influencial people are
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

and then again, it's much harder to influence someone who is educated than someone who isnt --> importance of education and going to hs/college
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

Sure the voter has (illusional?) power, what i'm saying is that the power he has is in reality all influenced by mass marketing and controlled by the ones who have money, such as lobbies for example
I might be wrong with this pessismistic view but that's pretty much reality for me
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

I mean hillary for example, without this she is nothing. thousands of people would be more qualified than her, but she has this, so she wins
https://www.opensecrets.org/politicians ... Career&amp'cid=N00000019&'type=I
Yes, unless she fucks up at some point, hillary has already won. she is the next president
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

money always win, that's a general rule I assume
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
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Post by Jam »

But but butt money is free speech benj.
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

drlegend wrote:No I''m pretty sure that the only thing that matters is votes. Anybody with basic access to books or the Internet can learn enough about philosophy and economics and other political issues to decide which candidate is best suited for the political office. The fact that people aren''t usually interested in anything other than identity politics or the current state of the economy doesn''t mean there is a secret group controlling everything behind the scenes and picking winners and losers.
damn you have trouble to get my point :p.
I''m not saying vote doesn''t matter, I''m saying they are instrumentalized, it''s an illusion.
lol so you believe people can do research on their own:
the point is very few does (and considering they do, educating yourself with your own research is quiet hard), and the research people do are limited to: I read an article abt hillary saying she was racist so I vote obama. I read mccain is for rich people and obama for poor people, Im poor too so I vote obama. In reality, that''s how decision are made by the average voter.
my point isn''t that its not possible to have education thought internet, it''s that in reality very few does, and when you compare those very few to the 99% who don''t, it''s useless

Common sense: the fact that people aren''t interested in politics means that they are influenceable, that''s it. And those group are secret only for you, any educated person is aware of this. the fact that you reduce it to some illuminati speculation says it all
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

freedom of speech is an illusion to, look what happens in france :)
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

oh, and to determine which candidate is best suited for an office, it requires way more research and knowledge that what the average citizen can get.
actually the theory behind the vote for everyone is related to the invisible hand (which is why to understand politic you have to understand economy, cf Adam smith), which has nothing to do with the your unrealistic view that the average voter will gather enough information to make a reasonable choice, but it's based on the fact that if everyone complain about it's own issues, it will regulate itself to a reasonable vote, which doesn't happen in politics because money comes into the equation
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
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Post by Jam »

So hard working wealth-creators should not have more influence in how the nation is run? Do they not have more at stake, and more contribution to society? Do they not deserve the fruit of their labour? All I hear is the same old marxist propaganda, everyone must be equal, all votes must be equal, all politicians must have a fair and equal opportunity, and the government must use it's monopoly on force to impose this ideology. I'm not not being, but also trying to try to not also stop not trying to be sarcastic.
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

i never mentionned moon landing.
9/11 I find it quiet absurd, yet I haven't done any serious research on it.
ISIS, I haven't done enough research to have a definitive idea, but it's definitely not all that black/white view that media spreads.
It's bilderberg group, and I precised that it's influnced tend to be extrapolated since people tend to like those type of stuff, and no one really knows what is really decided there. We just know it exists, rest is speculation.
What does it has to do with what I'm saying the fact that the vote for everyone is the norm?
I'm just giving my point of view, and telling you the average citizen is uneducated and the power he wish to have behind his vote is an illusion, all this is decided by money. (everything, what voter "trully want" is all influenced by which candidate will have enough money to spread his speech and charisma)
As I said the fact you defend this is respectable, I just find it disconnected. I might be wrong and be a sad pessimistic too!
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

yeah soz couprider I'm out of this :)
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France iNcog
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Post by iNcog »

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Reason: on request (off-topic bulk delete)
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/incog_aoe
Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
France benj89
Howdah
Posts: 1509
Joined: Mar 11, 2015

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Post by benj89 »

I exagerate to make a point because otherwise you always find a way to use illusionistic rhetoric in your advantage. the average voter is instrumentalized and has very limited knowledge if not no knowledge about who would be better for him, if you don't share my views on that, at least I expressed mine
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France benj89
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Post by benj89 »

ok
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham
France iNcog
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Post by iNcog »

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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Netherlands Goodspeed
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Post by Goodspeed »

Lol anything you say, while you have the right to say it, still has the potential to piss some people off. How does that make freedom of speech an illusion?
It's like if I call someone an asshole and he punches me in the face as a reponse. I'm still free to say whatever I want, he's the one in the wrong for punching me. Freedom of speech does not mean you can say whatever you want and expect everyone to be okay with it, it just means you can say whatever you want and have the law on your side.
France iNcog
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Post by iNcog »

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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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China fei123456
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Post by fei123456 »

what the hell are you talking about? omg

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