Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Germany lordraphael
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by lordraphael »

HYPE
breeze wrote: they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by MCJim »

@Kaiserklein, while I fully agree that we should have fixed the lag after game 1, I do want to write a quick post about why this is just not the right behavior.

We at ESOC are not just here organizing stuff for ourselves, we do it for you. I'd like to bring into attention that we have put a lot of effort into it and therefore you can't just simply quit a semi-finals when the best casters are casting, 250 people are watching, we put it on social media, people donated, we wrote a newspost about it, people really looked forward to the series, etc etc... And you know that. Saying that you don't care and are not playing for the viewers is honest, but very selfish. Right now, it's just too much effort for us, for the casters, for a bad series which you should understand. Imagine if everyone would do it like this? Or imagine this even happening in the finals? The more it happens the more our effort and willing gets lower to be there for you, and for the community. I'd encourage you to change your decision for the next time. I'm sure we could have found a right solution. This is just not how you should end a highly anticipated semi-finals. Thanks for understanding.

-MCJim
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by AOEisLOVE_AOEisLIFE »

MCJim wrote:Saying that you don't care and are not playing for the viewers is honest

no its not.. if you spend half an hour afterwards explaining to random strangers in the chat how much you dont care you probably do care, but honestly the chat is so cancerous, he shouldnt care about most of those people..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by enjoy2play »

"thanks for understanding"

lol
Acergamer wrote:Well, that's it for me fellas haha. Anyways I just want to say good luck to Samwise12 ,and hope he beats Lordraphael since he's basically a piece of shit idiot combination of Garja and Umeu.
N3O_Jerom wrote:and huh the balance is actually pretty good
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by WickedCossack »

WickedCossack wrote:
princeofkabul wrote:they should've done something to lag after g1.... and i dislike community for going full retard if someone says "lag". because aoe almost always lags in tournament setting with 2 casters with their soviet connections and pcs


Yea you're right, we should have changed something after game 1. I was just hoping it was the aztec mirror.

Either way I really don't think it was me, all games went super smooth today including 3v3's.


Yea we played a showmatch with prince/somppu and it was smooth as it had been for me all day.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by iLolicon »

Why do people even bother accusing eachother of lag in streamed games... You can't prove anything by just throwing random accusations at eachother. In situations like this idk why ESOC doesn't just force players and casters to do a speedtest on stream or send a screenshot of one with the date/time to prove it. That way it will be obvious who is the cause of the lag and they can simply disqualify that player or remove the caster. Seems like a whole lot of fuss over nothing.
=
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Gendarme »

Nobody accused anyone of lag. Kaiserklein simply got mad because he lost the second game more or less purely due to lag (the lag was extreme, a lot worse than during the first game; completely unplayable) and rage-quit (logged out and all) after saying that he's not going to play with lag.
Pay more attention to detail.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by iLolicon »

Gendarme wrote:Nobody accused anyone of lag. Kaiserklein simply got mad because he lost the second game more or less purely due to lag (the lag was extreme, a lot worse than during the first game; completely unplayable) and rage-quit (logged out and all) after saying that he's not going to play with lag.
I was referring to the twitch chat. Lot of people were saying it was WickedCossack. Regardless my point still stands. A quick speedtest would have determined who it was and that player could be disqualified.
=
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by enjoy2play »

a speedtest says nothing about who lags.

there so many reasons in aoe for lagspikes
Acergamer wrote:Well, that's it for me fellas haha. Anyways I just want to say good luck to Samwise12 ,and hope he beats Lordraphael since he's basically a piece of shit idiot combination of Garja and Umeu.
N3O_Jerom wrote:and huh the balance is actually pretty good
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by cblack »

iLolicon wrote:
Gendarme wrote:Nobody accused anyone of lag. Kaiserklein simply got mad because he lost the second game more or less purely due to lag (the lag was extreme, a lot worse than during the first game; completely unplayable) and rage-quit (logged out and all) after saying that he's not going to play with lag.
I was referring to the twitch chat. Lot of people were saying it was WickedCossack. Regardless my point still stands. A quick speedtest would have determined who it was and that player could be disqualified.



Not really. There's much more that goes into connection between two players than just their own internet speed. It also depends on their computer and more importantly, their geographical location. Instead of your proposition, I think it's better to just run tests with the players and casters before the tournament game begins. That way, if their is a connection issue, ESOC has enough time to find new casters.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by WickedCossack »

Yea none of us should've clicked into that 2nd game, that was a mistake.

Anyways time to relax by playing some lag free games ... :lol:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by iLolicon »

enjoy2play wrote:a speedtest says nothing about who lags.

there so many reasons in aoe for lagspikes


That's just bullshit and you know it. An occasional lagspike in a long game with tons of units populating the map fine, but even so, players could just tell the admins their computer specs. And you'd have to have pretty horrible specs for that to be the cause rather than your connection (in which case you shouldn't be playing in tournaments anyway) But a speedtest shows how decent your connection is, and if it's poor you are obviously the cause of the lag.
=
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by princeofkabul »

iLolicon wrote:
enjoy2play wrote:a speedtest says nothing about who lags.

there so many reasons in aoe for lagspikes


That's just bullshit and you know it. An occasional lagspike in a long game with tons of units populating the map fine, but even so, players could just tell the admins their computer specs. But a speedtest shows how decent your connection is, and if it's poor you are obviously the cause of the lag.


speedtest doesn't really tell the whole truth. in aoe it's more of the stability of your internet. quoting the legend himself (vici)
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by iLolicon »

princeofkabul wrote:
iLolicon wrote:
enjoy2play wrote:a speedtest says nothing about who lags.

there so many reasons in aoe for lagspikes


That's just bullshit and you know it. An occasional lagspike in a long game with tons of units populating the map fine, but even so, players could just tell the admins their computer specs. But a speedtest shows how decent your connection is, and if it's poor you are obviously the cause of the lag.


speedtest doesn't really tell the whole truth. in aoe it's more of the stability of your internet. quoting the legend himself (vici)


Pause and throw up a speed test multiple times then, every time the lag gets so heavy that its unplayable. If their internet is not stable then their speed will keep dropping. Speedtest will eventually catch whose connection it is.
=
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by pecelot »

Gendarme wrote:more or less purely due to lag

So more or less or purely? :?

Gendarme wrote:(the lag was extreme, a lot worse than during the first game; completely unplayable)

How do you know? :?
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Gendarme »

More or less purely.

The game completely froze several times.
Pay more attention to detail.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Mr_Bramboy »

I think Jim covered it pretty well. We have rules in place for these kinds of circumstances. Kaiserklein chose not to use these rules and instead chose to disappoint hundreds of people. It's his call and I'm sad to see things have gone this way in my absence.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by zoom »

You were sorely missed, Lord Bramboyle.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by HUMMAN »

If anyone to blame its microsoft many people give their passion for this game but there is no support. It would be a shame if DE wont solve these problems.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

@MCJim Yes, it was selfish from me, and I'm sorry about that. I got annoyed that the game was so unplayable, and I kinda lost one game because of that, which is not something that should happen in a tournament. I guess I should have stayed and tried with another caster, but being down 2-0 and tilted by the lag it didn't really make sense. And the chat ofc put some on top, guess I should have ignored that
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by momuuu »

I think the actual truth was that kaiser was tilted from getting outplayed and chose to blame the lag - which did affect the game but in my eyes that game was long lost - to ragequit and save some of his ego from going 0-4 against diarouga.

Either way it was selfish and childish. You get a shot to win money donated by someone that's a big fan of watching tournament games like these and then you have to behave like a spoiled and entitled 12 year old kid. That's just sad. I dont know if theres a 3rd or 4th place price but if I were Iwillspankyou I'd elect not to give you any money.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by WickedCossack »

From what I saw it was unplayable, the more I think about the more I'm amazed we all greened up for a second game xD
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by zoom »

MCJim wrote:@Kaiserklein, while I fully agree that we should have fixed the lag after game 1, I do want to write a quick post about why this is just not the right behavior.

We at ESOC are not just here organizing stuff for ourselves, we do it for you. I'd like to bring into attention that we have put a lot of effort into it and therefore you can't just simply quit a semi-finals when the best casters are casting, 250 people are watching, we put it on social media, people donated, we wrote a newspost about it, people really looked forward to the series, etc etc... And you know that. Saying that you don't care and are not playing for the viewers is honest, but very selfish. Right now, it's just too much effort for us, for the casters, for a bad series which you should understand. Imagine if everyone would do it like this? Or imagine this even happening in the finals? The more it happens the more our effort and willing gets lower to be there for you, and for the community. I'd encourage you to change your decision for the next time. I'm sure we could have found a right solution. This is just not how you should end a highly anticipated semi-finals. Thanks for understanding.

-MCJim
Did anyone make any attempt to communicate with the players while the series was being played? I would have tried to explain some of the above in the moment, instead of ensuring everything is properly ruined first.

Furthermore, ESOC should consider implementing a zero-tolerance policy in blatant cases of this practice. I'd sooner watch Tibia play than allow anyone who's behaved like this back in any tournament.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Mr_Bramboy »

zoom wrote:Did anyone make any attempt to communicate with the players while the series was being played? I would have tried to explain some of the above in the moment, instead of ensuring everything is properly ruined first.

Furthermore, ESOC should consider implementing a zero-tolerance policy in blatant cases of this practice. I'd sooner watch Tibia play than allow anyone who's behaved like this back in any tournament.

What Jim said is common sense. You don't forfeit in the semi-finals of a tournament that was funded solely by one great community member for any reason. Players are responsible for their own environment and are required to know the rules. I haven't watched a minute of this series so I can't speak for other casters or staff members, but from what I understand there was no need for intervention up until Kaiser unexpectedly quit.

I can't promise any disciplinary action. Since our community is so small, we've always been extremely reluctant with long bans, especially in tournaments, and that won't change because of this. We've had far worse things happen in tournaments before.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by momuuu »

zoom wrote:
MCJim wrote:@Kaiserklein, while I fully agree that we should have fixed the lag after game 1, I do want to write a quick post about why this is just not the right behavior.

We at ESOC are not just here organizing stuff for ourselves, we do it for you. I'd like to bring into attention that we have put a lot of effort into it and therefore you can't just simply quit a semi-finals when the best casters are casting, 250 people are watching, we put it on social media, people donated, we wrote a newspost about it, people really looked forward to the series, etc etc... And you know that. Saying that you don't care and are not playing for the viewers is honest, but very selfish. Right now, it's just too much effort for us, for the casters, for a bad series which you should understand. Imagine if everyone would do it like this? Or imagine this even happening in the finals? The more it happens the more our effort and willing gets lower to be there for you, and for the community. I'd encourage you to change your decision for the next time. I'm sure we could have found a right solution. This is just not how you should end a highly anticipated semi-finals. Thanks for understanding.

-MCJim
Did anyone make any attempt to communicate with the players while the series was being played? I would have tried to explain some of the above in the moment, instead of ensuring everything is properly ruined first.

Furthermore, ESOC should consider implementing a zero-tolerance policy in blatant cases of this practice. I'd sooner watch Tibia play than allow anyone who's behaved like this back in any tournament.

- I would guess that the media team members - those that are generally speaking tournament admins - do not have nearly enough time to watch all these games so they were not present when the drama was unfolding. One could maybe add some instructions or a manual to follow when there is lag, some rule that can be appealed to if a player considers the lag beyond acceptable or something which would invoke some sort of response
- Yes, actually this behaviour is the direct result of unwillingness to ever put serious consequences on disrespectful or incorrect behaviour in tournaments, which eventually just leads to more and more people to misbehave or just disregard admins altogether. Kaiser deserves a temporary tournament ban for this in my opinion, just like many others that have done similair stuff.

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