Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by zoom »

Mr_Bramboy wrote:
zoom wrote:Did anyone make any attempt to communicate with the players while the series was being played? I would have tried to explain some of the above in the moment, instead of ensuring everything is properly ruined first.

Furthermore, ESOC should consider implementing a zero-tolerance policy in blatant cases of this practice. I'd sooner watch Tibia play than allow anyone who's behaved like this back in any tournament.

What Jim said is common sense. You don't forfeit in the semi-finals of a tournament that was funded solely by one great community member for any reason. Players are responsible for their own environment and are required to know the rules. I haven't watched a minute of this series so I can't speak for other casters or staff members, but from what I understand there was no need for intervention up until Kaiser unexpectedly quit.

I can't promise any disciplinary action. Since our community is so small, we've always been extremely reluctant with long bans, especially in tournaments, and that won't change because of this. We've had far worse things happen in tournaments before.
Indeed – and about that exact point I am trying to ask a very simple question. You don't seem to realize my point: if anyone at all had tried, at all, to communicate at the time of the incident, it might have actually avoided the situation altogether. In passing, please also understand that whether Jim's post is conveying what you or i would consider "common sense", that's no more an argument against it now than it would have been then. The only difference is that the common sense is of little use. You clearly aren't using common sense when making that point...

The community is not nearly too small to handle a few stuck-up kids who will come crying back once their fit of arrogance and entitlement abruptly ends. Your current respone is, by contrast, actually incredibly harmful to the community.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by MCJim »

Kaiserklein wrote:@MCJim Yes, it was selfish from me, and I'm sorry about that. I got annoyed that the game was so unplayable, and I kinda lost one game because of that, which is not something that should happen in a tournament. I guess I should have stayed and tried with another caster, but being down 2-0 and tilted by the lag it didn't really make sense. And the chat ofc put some on top, guess I should have ignored that

I really appreciate this message, thank you Kaiser. Let's hope for a better ending next time!
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Mr_Bramboy »

zoom wrote:You don't seem to realize my point: if anyone at all had tried, at all, to communicate at the time of the incident, it might have actually avoided the situation altogether.

Captain hindsight is always right. Nothing we can do about that now and nothing we can do in the future to avoid this situation.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Papist »

So after stalling this series for a week and a half, Kaiser ragequits after the second game. What a disappointing end to a highly anticipated series. You expect better from a player who makes it to the semifinals, but here we are.

The one saving grace is that diarouga was going to win anyway.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by benj89 »

I wonder how irl goes for ppl who "tilt" over such incidents, at the risk of offending many esocians that's a pretty childish behavior. You can be mad but that's not a reason to ragequit. However I don't think disciplinary actions would bring anything good here.
Game 1 lags then switch casters or just play without and they will cast the recs later, better this than a series that ends that way. Also I think some rules should be implemented so that before each important series there is a "test" with casters and players to check any lag.
Too bad those could have been very nice games.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Hazza54321 »

benj89 wrote:I wonder how irl goes for ppl who "tilt" over such incidents, at the risk of offending many esocians that's a pretty childish behavior. You can be mad but that's not a reason to ragequit. However I don't think disciplinary actions would bring anything good here.
Game 1 lags then switch casters or just play without and they will cast the recs later, better this than a series that ends that way. Also I think some rules should be implemented so that before each important series there is a "test" with casters and players to check any lag.
Too bad those could have been very nice games.

when a game lags like shit and you stuck there watching it happen i just wanna get away from my computer and workout and go for a run or whatever so i dont blame kaiser for quitting early, imo they should reschedule the 2nd half of the series with different casters.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by bwinner »

Calm down guys seriously, especially for thoose like @momuuu who add salt for nothing, that's not more clever than what kaiser did... It's not up to you at all to give a sentence to kaiser, so just stop this seriously, he already get the penalty from loosing a serie that he really prepared and I am sure he isn't proud of this. I understand his desapointment. @MCJim post one message to explain the situation, he appologized, so that's fine for me, no need to make provocation in this tread...
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by benj89 »

Hazza54321 wrote:
benj89 wrote:I wonder how irl goes for ppl who "tilt" over such incidents, at the risk of offending many esocians that's a pretty childish behavior. You can be mad but that's not a reason to ragequit. However I don't think disciplinary actions would bring anything good here.
Game 1 lags then switch casters or just play without and they will cast the recs later, better this than a series that ends that way. Also I think some rules should be implemented so that before each important series there is a "test" with casters and players to check any lag.
Too bad those could have been very nice games.

when a game lags like shit and you stuck there watching it happen i just wanna get away from my computer and workout and go for a run or whatever so i dont blame kaiser for quitting early, imo they should reschedule the 2nd half of the series with different casters.

yea you do that when you're playing an unrated series with your mate. Not when 200+ people are watching, ESOC worked for these games to happen and money is involved, otherwise I'm concerned about your sense of ethics too. There is a difference between what you want to do and what you should do, kinda what separates a kid from an adult
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by lordraphael »

Jerom wrote:I think the actual truth was that kaiser was tilted from getting outplayed and chose to blame the lag - which did affect the game but in my eyes that game was long lost - to ragequit and save some of his ego from going 0-4 against diarouga.

Either way it was selfish and childish. You get a shot to win money donated by someone that's a big fan of watching tournament games like these and then you have to behave like a spoiled and entitled 12 year old kid. That's just sad. I dont know if theres a 3rd or 4th place price but if I were Iwillspankyou I'd elect not to give you any money.

Its certianly not a stretch to say that if those 2 games had been closer we wouldnt have seen a ragequit. Regardless of him quitting after g2 or playing the series out the result would be the same. Sompuu already had predicted that this was going to happen beforehand.
The first 2 games were pretty clean victories for diarouga altho kaiser certainly could have won g 1 had he made the right decisions ingame, but g 2 was just a decisive win from start to finish and lag, while certainly affecting the gameplay of both players, had less of an impact than the fact that diarouga simply had the superior strategy and executed it without major mistakes.

Also before a player leaves because of lag theres plenty of options to take before doing what kaiser did, that includes reducing the the number of casters, switching the casters or even play the games without casters.
I think the fear of getting sweeped was pretty big and played a major role when the decision was made to forfeit the series. Getting sweeped is not a very nice experience as i can tell out of experience and getting sweeped by diarouga is probably the worst.

I mean Kaiser could have also asked for a 1 hour break, while that is a bit unfair to diarouga, part of a series is also that its being played in one go to see how players deal with tilt and having to decide the series on-the-fly. Im sure no one would have denied him that request, there are just so many options that can be taken that the lag excuse really seems a bit artificial.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Aizamk »

Just got off the plane, on a train, checked esoc forums, disappointing news but meh, somppu is always right so it wasn't too surprising. Just a bit miffed that I now have to deal with superwarchief strats.
oranges.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Dolan »

I thought a lagtest was part of preparing the match with the casters. If it lags, then test with one caster, if it still lags, test without casters, etc. Until it works.
If players are to blame for lag, I think there is some rule for that? If a player can't have a proper playing setup, he can't compete.

Just set up a proper protocol for this kind of situation and stick to it, imo.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by KoenigRother »

How about rematch? :3
We all knew about the tilt and still let it happen and were amused and all, but that was death to the series. If diarouga agreed(agrees) to re at 1:0 for him (which would grant him a noble peace Price), then we could still have a nice series. But it is propably too late and i am just naive.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by fei123456 »

they're both french players so why dont they buy a train ticket and play LAN games?
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

lordraphael wrote:Its certianly not a stretch to say that if those 2 games had been closer we wouldnt have seen a ragequit. Regardless of him quitting after g2 or playing the series out the result would be the same. Sompuu already had predicted that this was going to happen beforehand.
The first 2 games were pretty clean victories for diarouga altho kaiser certainly could have won g 1 had he made the right decisions ingame, but g 2 was just a decisive win from start to finish and lag, while certainly affecting the gameplay of both players, had less of an impact than the fact that diarouga simply had the superior strategy and executed it without major mistakes.

Also before a player leaves because of lag theres plenty of options to take before doing what kaiser did, that includes reducing the the number of casters, switching the casters or even play the games without casters.
I think the fear of getting sweeped was pretty big and played a major role when the decision was made to forfeit the series. Getting sweeped is not a very nice experience as i can tell out of experience and getting sweeped by diarouga is probably the worst.

I mean Kaiser could have also asked for a 1 hour break, while that is a bit unfair to diarouga, part of a series is also that its being played in one go to see how players deal with tilt and having to decide the series on-the-fly. Im sure no one would have denied him that request, there are just so many options that can be taken that the lag excuse really seems a bit artificial.

For the record, I was actually winning game 1, until I just decided to mass the wrong unit. So it's not like that game was not close. About game 2, it's true I aged too late, but lag cost me a lot of goons. And we all know what a mams + mm pop can do, right?

Anyway, the lag was a problem between wicked and me. So I should have stayed to play with another co-caster after game 2. But I was so tilted to lose my goons and mm in lag that I didn't want to play anymore. Would have needed to let us replay game 2 to make me want to finish that series, but obviously I don't think that would happen. So it's not really the "fear", more like that I knew I was tilted + it was lagging. I don't think I would get sweeped btw, diarouga would be forced into bad match ups at some point. Ah and once again, I didn't forfeit, idk where everyone read that lol.

And yeah I didn't think about asking for a big break because it's not something that people do in tourneys usually. At that point I just didn't care anymore, also because I basically didn't prepare that series, and decided to just go off.
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

KoenigRother wrote:How about rematch? :3
We all knew about the tilt and still let it happen and were amused and all, but that was death to the series. If diarouga agreed(agrees) to re at 1:0 for him (which would grant him a noble peace Price), then we could still have a nice series. But it is propably too late and i am just naive.

Yeah I would definitely play that, or even at 2-0, even though game 2 lag was really unfair for me (and I think there's now a rule about lag that I should be able to call). Provided that this time it doesn't lag, of course. I also think people would like to see the end of that series. But it's up to the admins to decide if they give diarouga the admin win or not, I btw didn't get any clear answer on that point so far.
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by jiraya35 »

let's do the end of the serie .
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by aqwer »

@Kaiserklein :Stop making yourself a complete joke by repeatedly offering to play the series. Didn't you already got enough from almost everybody. Are you that stupid that you don't understand that you have lost it. Grow up and if you have then behave accordingly.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

aqwer wrote:@Kaiserklein :Stop making yourself a complete joke by repeatedly offering to play the series. Didn't you already got enough from almost everybody. Are you that stupid that you don't understand that you have lost it. Grow up and if you have then behave accordingly.

I never said "I forfeit" and the admins never explicitly said they give diarouga the admin win, so how do you know I lost?
Oh yeah, I got enough from people in the cancer twitch chat. Don't think that's anywhere near relevant though.
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by aligator92 »

I am pretty sure everyone considers it a forfeit or disqualification but you are right, admins should make it official and start scheduling Diarouga and Aiz
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by look »

XeeleeFlower wrote:(9/10/17 for us Americans and other sane people who date stuff properly)


day month year (You Americans like to change things to feel better and different!) on the other hand, your country is very good ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by aqwer »

@Kaiserklein : I watched the whole game or whatever that was. Yes, there was some lag in game-1 and game-2 is experiencing from lag spikes from the start(around 2:30m). In my opinion, WickedCossak & Interjection could have restarted the game or check for lag or pause as they the authority to do so but they didn't, they did best what they thought, can't blame them. I have genuine sympathy for you, a player like you din't just lose 5 Dragoons or call MM after enemy is halfway across the map. But, instead of finding a solution together, you just quit in rage. You said " I didn't forfeit", what does that suppose to mean? And after a while you came back on twitch and abused to viewers. I want to ask you , who the hell do you think you are? You can't handle 200 people gathered here to watch you what will happen if you became a celebrity (God forbid ) of some sort. After all that done and said , you commented again and again that "I want to finish the series". Now the series is already late for about a month and in that month, 2 weeks especially because of you. As I already said, "Stop making yourself a joke". And have some self respect, whats done is done. Normally, I would hate to give someone advice without asking but hot temper never benefit someone.


P.S. I have never seen you or met you or know you. But as I can predict , you are a nerd whose has a gf that you met on probably via this very game. And being away from girls for too much time makes you almost never leave the honeypot (you know what i mean). This makes you dull and brain is devoid of blood and one makes bad decisions. It looks like being good AOE3 player is the only achievement that you have under your belt(your gf maybe a distant second), thats why you are so hot about it. After all, its just a game, take it lightly. No offense intended.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Gendarme »

aqwer wrote:No offense intended.

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Pay more attention to detail.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Gichtenlord »

#Realtalk
r]
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by XeeleeFlower »

aqwer wrote:you are a nerd whose has a gf that you met on probably via this very game. And being away from girls for too much time makes you almost never leave the honeypot (you know what i mean). This makes you dull and brain is devoid of blood and one makes bad decisions


:ohmy: :shock: :cry:

@Goodspeed

On topic: What's done is done. There's no need to continue flaming and trying to shame other people here. If it must be done, please use the "private message" function. I understand that it's fun to publicly humiliate people, but it's not usually fun for the other person. Let's try to respect each other! Let's look forward to future games. Instead of pointing out mistakes continually, let's try to learn from the mistakes so that we can all be better individuals and a better community. :flowers:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by KoenigRother »

@aqwer why is Kaiserklein making a joke of himself by offering something? He obviously regrets what he did. I disagree on hating on him just because he raged. from my POV you cant think as rational when you are a playing a game that takes so much concentration and is as provocating as aoe3 and if diarouga decides to agree on a rematch, why shouldnt there be another try (apart from scheduling issues and more delay ofc)?
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