Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by AOEisLOVE_AOEisLIFE »

Papist wrote:..and told the viewers he doesn't care what they think.


to be fair some of the viewers threatend to "find him and kill him"
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Papist »

AOEisLOVE_AOEisLIFE wrote:
Papist wrote:..and told the viewers he doesn't care what they think.


to be fair some of the viewers threatend to "find him and kill him"


1) Those weren't serious threats as you well know, and 2) a couple assholes in the chat hardly speak for the 200+ viewers.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Goodspeed »

@aqwer You may disagree with the man's actions but your posts have been attacking him on a personal level. Is that necessary?
No offense intended
:hmm:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by deleted_user0 »

Still shouldnt tolerate people like that, papist.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by deleted_user0 »

Shouldve gone for coinflip @Kaiserklein
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Papist »

umeu wrote:Still shouldnt tolerate people like that, papist.


Who said we should?
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kommander »

This thread is just repeating itself now.

One side thinks A.
The other thinks B.
Some think C and D.

Can we just end this now? There's no point in us debating this. The top ESO-C guys should handle this among themselves. Not in a thread. But this is just my 2 cents.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by aqwer »

Goodspeed wrote:@aqwer You may disagree with the man's actions but your posts have been attacking him on a personal level. Is that necessary?
No offense intended
:hmm:


@Goodspeed: Just an honest guess, imo. @Kaiserklein should know the system works in both ways, he is not the only hot head here. And to be honest, I think he took my advice rather than offended by it.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by NyxAchlys9 »

Kommander wrote:This thread is just repeating itself now.

One side thinks A.
The other thinks B.
Some think C and D.

Can we just end this now? There's no point in us debating this. The top ESO-C guys should handle this among themselves. Not in a thread. But this is just my 2 cents.


Yeah but this is ESOC. It is such a shame to see this lovely thread being spoilt by it. This is what happens when you build up the hype only to be bitterly disappointed by a player. This has happened before but to be honest - the things Kaiser said before and after (i'm not sure maybe during) the match made it very insulting and inexcusable. Every player has their moments and there is often a lot of drama. The difference this time is Kaiser - and Kaiser has a bit of personality you could say. I think my view on this matter is pretty clear if you have read my posts about Kaiser before so I will leave it be.

It's still a lovely write-up by Xeelee and thanks again to @spanky4ever :love:

Hopefully we get better games from now on - and people will learn from this mistake :flowers:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by KoenigRother »

@Papist i dont say it was brilliant of kaiserklein to rage. But as far as i know it is the first time he ragequit and due to lag in a French mirror (lol), but it would have been the best Option to solve it by asking both Players to re and just continue the game. Thereby we would gain more IMO.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by deleted_user »

I'm so out of the loop lol but this is such a joocy thread I wish I could contribute to the dramas
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

EAGLEMUT wrote:Wow, I gotta say the irony of these Kaiser quotes put together is pretty damn high right now.
One day he calls out players like me for not resigning quick enough for his tastes and how very disrespectful that is, not a month later he quits in the middle of a highly anticipated semi-finals stream watched by hundreds of people and proceeds to proudly say he doesn't give a shit about any of them, literally "least" of his concerns.

The difference being, I actually quit because I was mad. I didn't do it for fun. And then I apologized.

pecelot wrote:Twitch chats are definitely much looser in terms of rules and ethics in general, unfortunately, but as soon as things get out of hand, we try to step in — however, we're just humans and some things may just not be spotted — sorry for the inconvenience then, we'd appreciate any forms of constructive criticism and feedback.

I mean, a ton of people were insulting me, if not threatening me. Was just impossible to not see it, stop kidding.

pecelot wrote:
Kaiserklein wrote:Ah and once again, I didn't forfeit, idk where everyone read that lol.

And yeah I didn't think about asking for a big break because it's not something that people do in tourneys usually. At that point I just didn't care anymore, also because I basically didn't prepare that series, and decided to just go off.

These are contradictory.

I don't see anything contradictory here. I was pissed and went off, didn't forfeit.

pecelot wrote:
Kaiserklein wrote:And if people insult me and I flame back, it's as much my fault as theirs. Iirc you were one of those guys hating in the chat. Well, you're as much responsible for the flame war as I am.

This is not mature.

Yeah it's obviously not. I don't think anyone here was thinking it is. Still, those guys are responsible too, and no mod was doing anything in the chat.

Papist wrote:He's not being punished. He's experiencing the logical consequences of his actions. If you "storm out" in the middle of an event, it's ridiculous to assume that you can just walk back in and take up where things left off when you tilted. That is entitlement at its finest.

I am literally being punished lol. Quoting bramboy: "...though the tournament admins will discuss any further punishment later this week."
Anyway, as I said multiple times, I was just waiting for the admin decision to be made. Nothing else. Now it's done, I don't think you heard me complaining. So where's the entitlement?

Papist wrote:I find it curious that you and others here are trying to brush off someone forfeiting (yes, storming off in the middle of an event is in fact a forfeit) the semi finals as "no big deal". Harm was done to the person who funded the tournament, and to the viewers. If Kaiserklein couldn't stand to lose, he shouldn't have participated in the first place. There are plenty of mature players ready to take his place and give the viewers a good experience, I assure you.

I didn't forfeit, I quit halfway through the series. I've seen other series be split in 2 parts before. It could have been decided that I have a warning and we just finish the series later, for example. Obviously that didn't happen, but it still doesn't mean I forfeited. Btw if that's what you call "harm", you should probably go out a little bit more often. Oh and people threatening to find me and kill me, or w/e other bullshit in the chat, is actually more harmful than what I did, but of course there was no mod to keep the chat clean... Or actually there maybe were, but they did nothing. Quoting papist about those threats: "1) Those weren't serious threats as you well know, and 2) a couple assholes in the chat hardly speak for the 200+ viewers."; this just shows how much you guys care about that.
As you may know (or maybe not, since you don't seem to be really involved in aoe), it's the first time I quit a tourney series. So why should I have not participated? If you think it's better, then just get me banned from all esoc tourneys.

Papist wrote:If you had any doubts at all about Kaiser's motives for quitting, him offering to play the series if he gets to replay Game 2 should allay them. That proves that Raphael's analysis was spot on - he just couldn't bear the idea of getting swept. Everything else is just an excuse.

You probably didn't even watch the series, but of course again you bring your insane knowledge. It was unplayable and I was pissed to lose 1 game on the lag. I think it was quite obvious that the lag made this series not competitive. Oh and btw, I also offered to play the series from 2-0, so you're wrong. Now you can speculate for the sake of humiliating if you want, I don't really care.

Papist wrote:Yeah, he apologized...then proceeded to blame everything and everyone else for his behavior, and told the viewers he doesn't care what they think. You can tell he feels really bad about what he did.

Dude, I was answering to some guy telling me that I'm ridiculous, that I never did anything of my life, that I'm a nerd, etc. How do you expect me to answer? With flowers? Your job would maybe be to actually tell that guy to stop personal attacks, instead of bringing your useless grain of salt in this thread... Btw I'd like you to tell me where I blamed everything and everyone else. And yes, I do feel bad about what I did.


Anyway, it's funny how any thread would get locked when it reaches this point. But when some mods want to post in it, of course it stays open.
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by NyxAchlys9 »

Look, having rage quitted—ESOC Mods are a terrible judges and bad and sad, Papist at ESOC; deletes posts, flames people, OK, very silly, the ESOC Media Team, very dumb, very crooked—you know, if you’re a age of empires III player, if I were a high pr player, if, like, OK, if I ran as a friend off the staff, they would say I'm one of the best, kindest players anywhere in the world—it’s true!—but when you're a random player they try—oh, do they do a number—that’s why I always start off: Went to ESOC, was a good player, went there, went there, did this, built a fan base—you know I have to give my like PR all the time, because we’re a little disadvantaged—but you look at the casting deal, the thing that really bothers me—it would have been so easy, and it’s not as important as these players are (casting is powerful; my ESOC Casting Guide explained that to me many, many years ago, the power and that was 35 years ago; it would explain the power of what's going to happen and it was right—who would have thought?), but when you look at what's going on with the four thread accusations—now it used to be three, now it’s four—but when it was three and even now, I would have said it's all in the messenger; community team, and it is community team because, you know, they don't, they haven’t figured that the media team are smarter right now than the mods, so, you know, it’s gonna take them about another 150 years—but the random smurfs are great negotiators, the ESOC mods are great negotiators, so, and they, they just flamed me, they just flamed me. - Trumpklein 2017
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by spanky4ever »

I have not posted in these threads, cos I think its not usefull at all. I admit I was very disapointed the way the semi turned out. I even called @Kaiserklein a bad looser in the chat, before I had the full picture of what was causing his anger and leaving the game. I said I am sorry for that salty remark, cos its not helpfull to anyone.

Yes, I was disapointed, I had been looking forward to the games with these very good players, for some time.

I guess we should learn something from this, maybe make sure the game is not lagging before streaming? Run some tests, and make sure that the UI are installed, etc etc? And maybe the streamers and players could prepare for this in advance, say you meet up one hour before stream starts to make the nessasary adjustments? I would suggest this, espesially in quarterfinals, semifinals and ofcourse the FINALs.

When all this is said, I have been enjoying the games enourmously, and thanks to all who participated to make this happen, and I will not let this overshadow the many GG we had. I am very much looking forward to the FINAL now, and soon all this will be forgotten.

If this was an event ppl enjoyed, and would want to see happening again, maybe with a few adjustments? I would be happy to fund another one, and maybe up my donations for it aswell.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by aqwer »

Kaiserklein wrote:The difference being, I actually quit because I was mad. I didn't do it for fun. And then I apologized.


Come on @Kaiserklein, making excuses of a mistake/wrongdoing is worst than the mistake itself. Didn't you learn anything in life?

Kaiserklein wrote:I don't see anything contradictory here. I was pissed and went off, didn't forfeit.


When you did quit, you didn't even talk to them(Wicked/Inter) about this. And when they finally got an indirect msg from you that you are unavailable then they announced the series is ended. After that you came to twitch chat like a hero. What would you call this? It is practically a forfeit.

Kaiserklein wrote:
And if people insult me and I flame back, it's as much my fault as theirs. Iirc you were one of those guys hating in the chat. Well, you're as much responsible for the flame war as I am.


I agree with you on this. You have every right to defend yourself. Actually, I was a little sad when you didn't posted anything last night. Good to have you back. P.S. I am coming to realization that maybe you are a fun person after all. Especially when you are mad. :biggrin:

Kaiserklein wrote:I am literally being punished lol. Quoting bramboy: "...though the tournament admins will discuss any further punishment later this week."
Anyway, as I said multiple times, I was just waiting for the admin decision to be made. Nothing else. Now it's done, I don't think you heard me complaining. So where's the entitlement?


You don't need any further punishment, you already had enough.

Kaiserklein wrote:Dude, I was answering to some guy telling me that I'm ridiculous, that I never did anything of my life, that I'm a nerd, etc. How do you expect me to answer? With flowers? Your job would maybe be to actually tell that guy to stop personal attacks, instead of bringing your useless grain of salt in this thread... Btw I'd like you to tell me where I blamed everything and everyone else. And yes, I do feel bad about what I did.


Just let it go.
Specially for you: (Enjoy)

Let it go, let it go!
Can't hold it back any more.
Let it go, let it go!
Turn away and slam the door.
I don't care what they're going to say.
Let the storm rage on.
The cold never bothered me anyway. :smile:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by momuuu »

An apoligy means something when it comes with the intention to not show the same behaviour again or to improve on that behaviour. Quite frankly, I think kaiser is not apoligizing but just saying an empty sorry.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Garja »

It's bad show but there is no rule that force players to complete the series. Of course once you forfeit you can't go back :dry:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

Jerom wrote:An apoligy means something when it comes with the intention to not show the same behaviour again or to improve on that behaviour. Quite frankly, I think kaiser is not apoligizing but just saying an empty sorry.

You really think I would do it again?
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by momuuu »

Kaiserklein wrote:
Jerom wrote:An apoligy means something when it comes with the intention to not show the same behaviour again or to improve on that behaviour. Quite frankly, I think kaiser is not apoligizing but just saying an empty sorry.

You really think I would do it again?

without hesitation.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

Jerom wrote:
Kaiserklein wrote:
Jerom wrote:An apoligy means something when it comes with the intention to not show the same behaviour again or to improve on that behaviour. Quite frankly, I think kaiser is not apoligizing but just saying an empty sorry.

You really think I would do it again?

without hesitation.

Well you're wrong
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by P i k i l i c »

So, from what I've seen so far, developing theories about other people's flaws brings more negativity than posting a cheating accusation with evidence :hmm:
Consider not the one who speaks the truth, but the truth that is said

:hmm: AoE logic :hmm:
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Kaiserklein »

P i k i l i c wrote:So, from what I've seen so far, developing theories about other people's flaws brings more negativity than posting a cheating accusation with evidence :hmm:

Ofc it does. But they're not gonna lock since the mods enjoy posting in this thread
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by gibson »

Come on guys, the man made a mistake and apologized. Move on.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by pecelot »

Kaiserklein wrote:
EAGLEMUT wrote:Wow, I gotta say the irony of these Kaiser quotes put together is pretty damn high right now.
One day he calls out players like me for not resigning quick enough for his tastes and how very disrespectful that is, not a month later he quits in the middle of a highly anticipated semi-finals stream watched by hundreds of people and proceeds to proudly say he doesn't give a shit about any of them, literally "least" of his concerns.

The difference being, I actually quit because I was mad. I didn't do it for fun. And then I apologized.

The real difference here is that you seem to miss the point about the choice of the main focus of tournaments: participants or spectators.

Kaiserklein wrote:
pecelot wrote:Twitch chats are definitely much looser in terms of rules and ethics in general, unfortunately, but as soon as things get out of hand, we try to step in — however, we're just humans and some things may just not be spotted — sorry for the inconvenience then, we'd appreciate any forms of constructive criticism and feedback.

I mean, a ton of people were insulting me, if not threatening me. Was just impossible to not see it, stop kidding.

I was speaking for myself, frankly. I just left the stream as I was watching it with my friend and we decided to do something more productive.

Kaiserklein wrote:
pecelot wrote:
Kaiserklein wrote:Ah and once again, I didn't forfeit, idk where everyone read that lol.

And yeah I didn't think about asking for a big break because it's not something that people do in tourneys usually. At that point I just didn't care anymore, also because I basically didn't prepare that series, and decided to just go off.

These are contradictory.

I don't see anything contradictory here. I was pissed and went off, didn't forfeit.

That's your point of view, objectively it is reasonable to claim the opposite.

Kaiserklein wrote:
pecelot wrote:
Kaiserklein wrote:And if people insult me and I flame back, it's as much my fault as theirs. Iirc you were one of those guys hating in the chat. Well, you're as much responsible for the flame war as I am.

This is not mature.

Yeah it's obviously not. I don't think anyone here was thinking it is. Still, those guys are responsible too, and no mod was doing anything in the chat.

Indeed, this is something we should work on, thanks for bringing it up. We'll try to make sure it never happens again in the future, a mistake was on our part here.

Kaiserklein wrote:
Papist wrote:He's not being punished. He's experiencing the logical consequences of his actions. If you "storm out" in the middle of an event, it's ridiculous to assume that you can just walk back in and take up where things left off when you tilted. That is entitlement at its finest.

I am literally being punished lol. Quoting bramboy: "...though the tournament admins will discuss any further punishment later this week."

Here I think the confusion might have arisen from other understanding of being punished. Furthermore, I wouldn't call a possible penalty in the future being literally affected by it.

Kaiserklein wrote:
Papist wrote:I find it curious that you and others here are trying to brush off someone forfeiting (yes, storming off in the middle of an event is in fact a forfeit) the semi finals as "no big deal". Harm was done to the person who funded the tournament, and to the viewers. If Kaiserklein couldn't stand to lose, he shouldn't have participated in the first place. There are plenty of mature players ready to take his place and give the viewers a good experience, I assure you.

I didn't forfeit, I quit halfway through the series. I've seen other series be split in 2 parts before. It could have been decided that I have a warning and we just finish the series later, for example. Obviously that didn't happen, but it still doesn't mean I forfeited. Btw if that's what you call "harm", you should probably go out a little bit more often. Oh and people threatening to find me and kill me, or w/e other bullshit in the chat, is actually more harmful than what I did, but of course there was no mod to keep the chat clean... Or actually there maybe were, but they did nothing. Quoting papist about those threats: "1) Those weren't serious threats as you well know, and 2) a couple assholes in the chat hardly speak for the 200+ viewers."; this just shows how much you guys care about that.
As you may know (or maybe not, since you don't seem to be really involved in aoe), it's the first time I quit a tourney series. So why should I have not participated? If you think it's better, then just get me banned from all esoc tourneys.

Kaiserklein wrote:Dude, I was answering to some guy telling me that I'm ridiculous, that I never did anything of my life, that I'm a nerd, etc. How do you expect me to answer? With flowers? Your job would maybe be to actually tell that guy to stop personal attacks, instead of bringing your useless grain of salt in this thread... Btw I'd like you to tell me where I blamed everything and everyone else. And yes, I do feel bad about what I did.

You complained about aqwer taking it to the personal level, so at least don't bring any negativity of such a kind in regards to Papist yourself. „You don't even play the game" et cetera — that's not going to help anyone. Furthermore, we've been here before, when you questioned my position in the staff, remember? Now it's all gone and explained, but a wise lesson taken from this might be to not judge superficially with too little knowledge. It naturally applies to any side of the argument.

Kaiserklein wrote:
Jerom wrote:
Kaiserklein wrote:You really think I would do it again?

without hesitation.

Well you're wrong

He cannot be wrong here, but he might be in the future.

Kaiserklein wrote:
P i k i l i c wrote:So, from what I've seen so far, developing theories about other people's flaws brings more negativity than posting a cheating accusation with evidence :hmm:

Ofc it does. But they're not gonna lock since the mod enjoy posting in this thread

If you have any concerns regarding moderation, then you know what to do. Further posts of such a kind will be deemed off-topic and eventually removed. It's not about us being happy to write here, there's just no reason to lock this as long as things don't get out of hand, which they haven't yet, from what I've seen. We might be forced to do so in the future, but we'll try to maintain the discussion civil.
In fact, as you can read above, we can still draw useful conclusions from this discussion, which is definitely what we should focus on from now on.
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Re: Kaiserklein vs Diarouga!

Post by Papist »

@Kaiserklein
I am literally being punished lol. Quoting bramboy: "...though the tournament admins will discuss any further punishment later this week."
Anyway, as I said multiple times, I was just waiting for the admin decision to be made. Nothing else. Now it's done, I don't think you heard me complaining. So where's the entitlement?

You're complaining about the prospect of further punishment for ruining the semis right now. But I was responding to the guy who said you not being able to finish the series you walked out on was "punishment".

I didn't forfeit, I quit halfway through the series. I've seen other series be split in 2 parts before. It could have been decided that I have a warning and we just finish the series later, for example. Obviously that didn't happen, but it still doesn't mean I forfeited. Btw if that's what you call "harm", you should probably go out a little bit more often.

You refused to finish the series after losing 2 games back to back. But you didn't forfeit of course - the admins forced you out. When has a series in a tournament of any sort been picked back up days later when one player ragequit in the middle of it? How could someone destroying the semifinals NOT been harmful to the community? But hey, maybe I would understand if I "went out more".

Oh and people threatening to find me and kill me, or w/e other bullshit in the chat, is actually more harmful than what I did, but of course there was no mod to keep the chat clean... Or actually there maybe were, but they did nothing. Quoting papist about those threats: "1) Those weren't serious threats as you well know, and 2) a couple assholes in the chat hardly speak for the 200+ viewers."; this just shows how much you guys care about that.

Yeah, some immature kids making death threats in the chat (I'm sure you are seriously afraid for your life right now) are more damaging that you destroying the semis. And why were you in the chat anyway? Why did you need to explain yourself if you did nothing wrong?

As you may know (or maybe not, since you don't seem to be really involved in aoe), it's the first time I quit a tourney series. So why should I have not participated? If you think it's better, then just get me banned from all esoc tourneys.

You're right, since this is the first time you have ruined the tournament semifinals, the Media Team should really cut you a break.

You probably didn't even watch the series, but of course again you bring your insane knowledge. It was unplayable and I was pissed to lose 1 game on the lag. I think it was quite obvious that the lag made this series not competitive. Oh and btw, I also offered to play the series from 2-0, so you're wrong. Now you can speculate for the sake of humiliating if you want, I don't really care.

You don't care, but you still take the time to respond to every single point I made. Sounds legit. I watched the series live; if lag was such a problem, you should have refused to green up until it was resolved. But instead you played the second game, lost (it was pretty obvious you were going to lose, lag or no lag), and blamed the lag after.

Dude, I was answering to some guy telling me that I'm ridiculous, that I never did anything of my life, that I'm a nerd, etc. How do you expect me to answer? With flowers? Your job would maybe be to actually tell that guy to stop personal attacks, instead of bringing your useless grain of salt in this thread... Btw I'd like you to tell me where I blamed everything and everyone else. And yes, I do feel bad about what I did.

Once again, you "don't care" about my opinion but still take the time to respond to it. And how do I expect you to answer? How about by coming right out and saying "I'm sorry. I know what I did was immature and that I let the community down, and I will accept the consequences of my actions." Leave it at that, and stop making excuses (blaming the lag when you didn't do anything about it when the games were actually being played, insinuating that it is Media's fault if the series doesn't get played because you're "willing to finish if they let me", etc.). Don't be surprised that people are pissed at you for ruining a major event - remember that you're the one who slammed Jakey, pecelot, and EAGLEMUT for "disrespectful" play in past events.
The function of man is to live, not to exist.

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