Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

No Flag deleted_user
Ninja
Posts: 14364
Joined: Mar 26, 2015

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by deleted_user »

Jerom wrote:
deleted_user wrote:I took the liberty to put my Auto CAD skills to use and drew up a quick illustration of building rotater abuse:
Image
As you can see, the red thingy is longer than the black thingy and this means you can abuse the rectangular nature of buildings' foundations by creating seemingly longer paths for units to traverse. Imagine these are two block houses or banks. Note, a similar effect can be achieved with a cheap wall, though the rotated buildings provide a rather nice "pocket" for ranged units to sit in and greatly protects ranged infantry from cav. Pushing two rotated blockhouses is much more difficult than two non-rotated blockhouses.

Pathing is such a large part of aoe it makes sense not to allow it.

Its also not going to matter in 99%+ of all games. I feel like rotating a random wall pillar midmap just to protest it.

(I could not quote this entire thing but I worked really hard on that picture I want everyone to see it.)

Idk man, a lot of games come down to one large fight and whoever wins it is sitting pretty. These fights typically happen at some sort of infrastructure location whether that be a mid map fb or a defensively fortified tc. I just think rotater is giving the defensive position a non-negligible advantage when all else is equal. But that advantage can also be and will be negligible in an arguable amount of circumstances.

Purely from a tournament hosting view point it makes the most sense just not to fuck with it.
Netherlands momuuu
Ninja
Posts: 14237
Joined: Jun 7, 2015
ESO: Jerom_

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by momuuu »

I find it arbitrary that the minimal effect is negative, you might aswell say its a positive thing. Its just a small deal overall.

The problem is that some muppet is going to use it in a tournament game.
No Flag ssaraf
Dragoon
Posts: 208
Joined: Jun 19, 2015
ESO: robinhood_xing

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by ssaraf »

deleted_user wrote:I took the liberty to put my Auto CAD skills to use and drew up a quick illustration of building rotater abuse:
Image
As you can see, the red thingy is longer than the black thingy and this means you can abuse the rectangular nature of buildings' foundations by creating seemingly longer paths for units to traverse. Imagine these are two block houses or banks. Note, a similar effect can be achieved with a cheap wall, though the rotated buildings provide a rather nice "pocket" for ranged units to sit in and greatly protects ranged infantry from cav. Pushing two rotated blockhouses is much more difficult than two non-rotated blockhouses.
Pathing is such a large part of aoe it makes sense not to allow it.


Call me dirty , but who here like me thought why he has drawn square boobs :uglylol:

P.S : building rotator does give unfair advantage to defensive civs like dutch , TAD civs (Wonders). I like it that the rule related to its use is clearly mentioned.
User avatar
United States of America n0el
ESOC Business Team
Posts: 7068
Joined: Jul 24, 2015
ESO: jezabob
Clan: ķŒ€ ķ•˜ģš°ģŠ¤

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

  • Quote

Post by n0el »

Keep an eye out on AgeofEmpires official Facebook and Twitter tomorrow!
mad cuz bad
Netherlands momuuu
Ninja
Posts: 14237
Joined: Jun 7, 2015
ESO: Jerom_

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by momuuu »

ssaraf wrote:
deleted_user wrote:I took the liberty to put my Auto CAD skills to use and drew up a quick illustration of building rotater abuse:
Image
As you can see, the red thingy is longer than the black thingy and this means you can abuse the rectangular nature of buildings' foundations by creating seemingly longer paths for units to traverse. Imagine these are two block houses or banks. Note, a similar effect can be achieved with a cheap wall, though the rotated buildings provide a rather nice "pocket" for ranged units to sit in and greatly protects ranged infantry from cav. Pushing two rotated blockhouses is much more difficult than two non-rotated blockhouses.
Pathing is such a large part of aoe it makes sense not to allow it.


Call me dirty , but who here like me thought why he has drawn square boobs :uglylol:

P.S : building rotator does give unfair advantage to defensive civs like dutch , TAD civs (Wonders). I like it that the rule related to its use is clearly mentioned.

Ep gives an unfair advantage to ports and spain. Should be banned too. Or is the usage of unfair here completely subjective?
No Flag deleted_user
Ninja
Posts: 14364
Joined: Mar 26, 2015

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by deleted_user »

Jerom wrote:
ssaraf wrote:
deleted_user wrote:I took the liberty to put my Auto CAD skills to use and drew up a quick illustration of building rotater abuse:
Image
As you can see, the red thingy is longer than the black thingy and this means you can abuse the rectangular nature of buildings' foundations by creating seemingly longer paths for units to traverse. Imagine these are two block houses or banks. Note, a similar effect can be achieved with a cheap wall, though the rotated buildings provide a rather nice "pocket" for ranged units to sit in and greatly protects ranged infantry from cav. Pushing two rotated blockhouses is much more difficult than two non-rotated blockhouses.
Pathing is such a large part of aoe it makes sense not to allow it.


Call me dirty , but who here like me thought why he has drawn square boobs :uglylol:

P.S : building rotator does give unfair advantage to defensive civs like dutch , TAD civs (Wonders). I like it that the rule related to its use is clearly mentioned.

Ep gives an unfair advantage to ports and spain. Should be banned too. Or is the usage of unfair here completely subjective?


Yeah I suppose it's almost entirely subjective but that's half my point: it has never been a staple of the game so why even dabble in it? Players are responsible for not having the feature enabled in the launcher. There is no real way of activating building rotater accidentally in-game unless the player actively attempts to do so.
Netherlands momuuu
Ninja
Posts: 14237
Joined: Jun 7, 2015
ESO: Jerom_

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by momuuu »

My point is that just because it matters occasionally balance wise does not mean its bad. But supposedly for reasons I dont understand it makes base building less strategic or sth.

Its mostly an irrelevant thing to me but im gonna be sad about the upcoming rotator incident.
No Flag deleted_user
Ninja
Posts: 14364
Joined: Mar 26, 2015

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by deleted_user »

People are for the most part reasonable. If an opponent rotates vs me I will most likely allow it unless I felt it really did jeopardize the game. If it is as irrelevant as you say I would be willing to bet any rotater incident will be swept aside by both parties as, "shit happens."
No Flag ssaraf
Dragoon
Posts: 208
Joined: Jun 19, 2015
ESO: robinhood_xing

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by ssaraf »

Jerom wrote:Its mostly an irrelevant thing to me but im gonna be sad about the upcoming rotator incident.


I would be really happy when some retards use the mod and lose or even get disqualified. NO MATTER, how good a player are you, if u are illiterate and cannot abide by the rules of the tournament, U DESERVE to get punished. xD
No Flag kami_ryu
Retired Contributor
Posts: 2196
Joined: Jan 2, 2017

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by kami_ryu »

n0el wrote:Keep an eye out on AgeofEmpires official Facebook and Twitter tomorrow!


me like post vry much
User avatar
Australia wardyb1
Retired Contributor
Donator 01
Posts: 1507
Joined: Sep 20, 2016
ESO: wardyb1
Location: Australia

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by wardyb1 »

ssaraf wrote:
Jerom wrote:Its mostly an irrelevant thing to me but im gonna be sad about the upcoming rotator incident.


I would be really happy when some retards use the mod and lose or even get disqualified. NO MATTER, how good a player are you, if u are illiterate and cannot abide by the rules of the tournament, U DESERVE to get punished. xD

It's not that people are illiterate, it's that they turn the mod off because they remember they aren't allowed it. They then turn it back on because they use it normally. They remember again to turn it off in the RO64. They then turn it back on and play with it on for another 2/3 weeks before their next match. Then they play RO32 match and they've forgot to turn it back off because its now been 3 weeks since last match, and then out of habit they rotate 1 bank.

Do they deserve to lose the match or entire set because they've forgotten to turn it off once?

It's not that people can't abide by tourney rules, it's that they are forgetful, and in competitive scenes and high class play, habits are what wins games. Good habits are what separates good players, from great players. So to try and break a beneficial habit isn't easy. If the rotator is always going to be banned, the EP team should just remove it from EP. Solve the whole issue.
ā€œTo love the journey is to accept no such end. I have found, through painful experience, that the most important step a person can take is always the next one.ā€
No Flag ssaraf
Dragoon
Posts: 208
Joined: Jun 19, 2015
ESO: robinhood_xing

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by ssaraf »

wardyb1 wrote:Do they deserve to lose the match or entire set because they've forgotten to turn it off once?

The rule says once = warning , twice = lost that game , thrice = disqualified (i m pretty sure things wont be that harsh unless its been repeated many times). So, stay focused and remember to do things like downloading the map set , knowing the maps, checking hotkeys, and other settings etc. This is like a basic preparation for tourney games. We all have shouted at ESOCTV casters when they forget to 'remove the overlay' , 'mic not working' , 'poor quality stream' bla bla. Why only the casters present for the show and not the players?

Also, "Rotator mod as a good habit" --> that's debatable.
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
ECL Reigning Champs
Posts: 13597
Joined: May 4, 2015
Location: USA

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by gibson »

ssaraf wrote:
wardyb1 wrote:Do they deserve to lose the match or entire set because they've forgotten to turn it off once?

The rule says once = warning , twice = lost that game , thrice = disqualified (i m pretty sure things wont be that harsh unless its been repeated many times). So, stay focused and remember to do things like downloading the map set , knowing the maps, checking hotkeys, and other settings etc. This is like a basic preparation for tourney games. We all have shouted at ESOCTV casters when they forget to 'remove the overlay' , 'mic not working' , 'poor quality stream' bla bla. Why only the casters present for the show and not the players?

Also, "Rotator mod as a good habit" --> that's debatable.
I feel like a warning for the first time could be abused. I mean if I'm playing japan vs an aggressive civ im gonna rotate my big shrine for sure and take the warning.
User avatar
United States of America n0el
ESOC Business Team
Posts: 7068
Joined: Jul 24, 2015
ESO: jezabob
Clan: ķŒ€ ķ•˜ģš°ģŠ¤

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by n0el »

gibson wrote:
ssaraf wrote:
wardyb1 wrote:Do they deserve to lose the match or entire set because they've forgotten to turn it off once?

The rule says once = warning , twice = lost that game , thrice = disqualified (i m pretty sure things wont be that harsh unless its been repeated many times). So, stay focused and remember to do things like downloading the map set , knowing the maps, checking hotkeys, and other settings etc. This is like a basic preparation for tourney games. We all have shouted at ESOCTV casters when they forget to 'remove the overlay' , 'mic not working' , 'poor quality stream' bla bla. Why only the casters present for the show and not the players?

Also, "Rotator mod as a good habit" --> that's debatable.
I feel like a warning for the first time could be abused. I mean if I'm playing japan vs an aggressive civ im gonna rotate my big shrine for sure and take the warning.


* = If the rotator mod is game breaking, by for example rotating your buildings to wall off your base, this will lead to a map loss immediately without any preceding warning.
mad cuz bad
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
ECL Reigning Champs
Posts: 13597
Joined: May 4, 2015
Location: USA

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

  • Quote

Post by gibson »

n0el wrote:
gibson wrote:
Show hidden quotes
I feel like a warning for the first time could be abused. I mean if I'm playing japan vs an aggressive civ im gonna rotate my big shrine for sure and take the warning.


* = If the rotator mod is game breaking, by for example rotating your buildings to wall off your base, this will lead to a map loss immediately without any preceding warning.
that just seems a bit subjective imo. I think it should be either straight up banned and people get kicked out for using it or it's okay, not any of this wishy washyness
User avatar
France bwinner
Howdah
Donator 01
Posts: 1292
Joined: Mar 14, 2016
ESO: bwinner

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by bwinner »

Talking about rules, is the explorer glitch allowed (with aztec) ? Because it seem's far more game deciding than building rotator (entire strategies are based on this shit) and it's basicly the same cheat as using alt+D for me...
Ik it can be removed on ep, so will this be done next patch ?
Image
No Flag tedere12
Jaeger
Posts: 3449
Joined: Jun 8, 2015

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

  • Quote

Post by tedere12 »

alt+D is a game feature...
User avatar
Denmark crjensen4
Dragoon
Donator 07
Posts: 216
Joined: Feb 26, 2015
ESO: crjensen4

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by crjensen4 »

I think this is really great and am looking forward to some awesome vods! Could you make the prize pool 1400 - and use the last 100 to get Edeholland a better mike? He does a GREAT job, but the sound could use some care :)

Will there be group stages?

Oh and nothing happens when I attempt to signup....
User avatar
Czech Republic EAGLEMUT
ESOC Dev Team
Donator 05
Posts: 4513
Joined: Mar 31, 2015
ESO: EAGLEMUT
Clan: WPact

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

  • Quote

Post by EAGLEMUT »

crjensen4 wrote:I think this is really great and am looking forward to some awesome vods! Could you make the prize pool 1400 - and use the last 100 to get Edeholland a better mike? He does a GREAT job, but the sound could use some care :)

Will there be group stages?

Oh and nothing happens when I attempt to signup....


Ede's mike is not that bad :P
Yes, there will be group stages.
There is currently a problem with signing up for people without any team games recorded on JP ELO. I'm working on a fix, hopefully it will be out sometime today.
Image
momuuu wrote: ā†‘theres no way eaglemut is truly a top player
Netherlands momuuu
Ninja
Posts: 14237
Joined: Jun 7, 2015
ESO: Jerom_

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by momuuu »

crjensen4 wrote:I think this is really great and am looking forward to some awesome vods! Could you make the prize pool 1400 - and use the last 100 to get Edeholland a better mike? He does a GREAT job, but the sound could use some care :)

Will there be group stages?

Oh and nothing happens when I attempt to signup....

or we could get umeu a 1080p screen so he can actually stream in more than 800x600 haha. Or just give 100 bucks to interjection.
No Flag tedere12
Jaeger
Posts: 3449
Joined: Jun 8, 2015

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by tedere12 »

or give 100 $ to the basement for next level entertainment
User avatar
No Flag fightinfrenchman
Ninja
Donator 04
Posts: 23505
Joined: Oct 17, 2015
Location: Pennsylvania

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by fightinfrenchman »

tedere12 wrote:or give 100 $ to the basement for next level entertainment


I would suggest saving your money for the next Telethon, there will be some exciting rewards!
Dromedary Scone Mix is not Alone Mix
Image
User avatar
Poland pecelot
Retired Contributor
Donator 03
Posts: 10459
Joined: Mar 25, 2015
ESO: Pezet

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by pecelot »

deleted_user wrote:Yeah I suppose it's almost entirely subjective but that's half my point: it has never been a staple of the game so why even dabble in it? Players are responsible for not having the feature enabled in the launcher. There is no real way of activating building rotater accidentally in-game unless the player actively attempts to do so.

How has it not been? :hmm:
Also isn't it all irrelevant because of 3D game engine? :roll:
User avatar
Austria Permanschlager
Musketeer
Posts: 69
Joined: Apr 17, 2016
ESO: Permanschlager
Location: Austria

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

Post by Permanschlager »

MCJim wrote:
iwillspankyou wrote:Is it winner takes it all?
Or do 2nd and 3rd get some of the prize??

First place $1000, second place $400 and third place $100.


Wow...thats huge...
- I swear to drunk,

I'm not god! -
User avatar
Kyrgyzstan AOEisLOVE_AOEisLIFE
Lancer
Posts: 548
Joined: Apr 23, 2016
ESO: dats my secret
Location: Ze King in Zeken's House of Zekers

Re: Announcing the ESOC Spring Championships 2017! ($1500)

  • Quote

Post by AOEisLOVE_AOEisLIFE »

Jerom wrote:I feel like rotating a random wall pillar midmap just to protest it.

Image
love that comment. what a rebel.
lets all join the silent protest and rotate your banks 180Ā°.
nobody will notice anything if there isnt anything to notice.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

Which top 10 players do you wish to see listed?

All-time

Active last two weeks

Active last month

Supremacy

Treaty

Official

ESOC Patch

Treaty Patch

1v1 Elo

2v2 Elo

3v3 Elo

Power Rating

Which streams do you wish to see listed?

Twitch

Age of Empires III

Age of Empires IV