spain water bo

[agrondergermane]

recently i startet playing spain a bit on nilla.
playing on land works well, but if i play rdm maps and have a water map i dont have a good bo for that case.
so whats a good spain water bo if u have to defend some early pressure?

[yemshi]

3v, schooners, tower age up, 700w,600w, 700c, (rendering plant).
Gather 320w before 700w arrives and build a dock and three fishing ships.
Build a second dock, get some market upgrades and some musketeers/xbows/dogs and age with the 700c.
Ideally you'd have something like 18 boats and 26ish vills. Not quite enough for a real sea boom but enough to counter the opponent ( who probably just aged as well and has less eco).

If you want some real sea boom just build more docks and walls. Spain's seaboom is not the best as you lose a lot of Spain's strength : the Fast Fortress.

[agrondergermane]

3v, schooners, tower age up, 700w,600w, 700c, (rendering plant).
Gather 320w before 700w arrives and build a dock and three fishing ships.
Build a second dock, get some market upgrades and some musketeers/xbows/dogs and age with the 700c.
Ideally you'd have something like 18 boats and 26ish vills. Not quite enough for a real sea boom but enough to counter the opponent ( who probably just aged as well and has less eco).

If you want some real sea boom just build more docks and walls. Spain's seaboom is not the best as you lose a lot of Spain's strength : the Fast Fortress.

thx yemshi, i will try this today.

[Garja]

3v, schooners, 700g 700w. Just squeeze a dock instead of a TP and leave like 3-4 vills on wood for constant fish boat production. Eventually those repay in food so your FF time is almost the same.
You can drop a TP with 700w. XP count shoudn't suffer too much either because boat production does give some XP. Can also squeeze 5v if you start with a TP or get good XP from treasures.

[yemshi]

You'd have to age 16 or 17 then. If you expect a rush you cannot afford a naked schooner FF, especially without a TP. 700w will come in late, you will be short on houses and military for the first push. Question is whether to naked FF without TP and 15v/14v+cows or whether to stay in age II long enough to hold all the pressure and get some sea eco.
Not having the Exiled Prince is a problem then but since you'll have some eco and shipments you can commit under your TC with MM,vills ,TC fire, the ageup units (4 hussars, 8 pikes), 5dogs, a shipment (7 rodeleros, 8 pikes) and the 15ish musketeers you have.

[Garja]

16v is the standard for Spain. You shouldnt' be short on houses if you macro properly. Of course a fish boom means you need more eco in the long term, otherwise just FF with 5v which is about same eco early on.
You can also do some colo strats with sea but that's most for the lolz.

[pecelot]

I mostly do what yemshi described. I like to add a TP as it makes the build smoother and 200w is not that big of a deal if you chop for boats or send 700w 600w consecutively. Usually after those I send 5 vills as it's too early to age with 700c and it's just a good card, but I assume it can be a bit greedy, or you can choose the Rendering Plant shipment instead. Make use of walls, vs aggression start producing crossbowmen with wood you have, later switch to muskets for a good age-3 push.

[yemshi]

It is about being under pressure.
Think of california where the sea is miles away from your TC. You can constantly gather with at least 10 boats and hold the push. After that you age.

I agree that 16v FF with 5 and TP is better. But is doesn't hold rushes and allows yourself to counterpush afterwards.

Staying in age II until minute ten ain't a "strat for the lolz" either.

[Kaiserklein]

Honestly most civs can't rush spain anyway. It's just so hard to pressure a base with tc fire + tower + mm + dogs + a units shipment. Ofc if the guy is otto or sth then he can try to rush you, but obviously you won't go water boom in this kind of mu anyway.
I think the problem if you do this kind of strat is more against fortress civs or a big colo timing when you age up for example

[yemshi]

Should you play according to my BO on amy standard sea map you'll face the following Matchups and outcomes.

Iro: Prolonged colonial = lose. Should FF yourself.
Sioux: If it's a sea map it's an easy win.
Aztec: FF or lose.
Japan: You'll win vs a cons rush and lose vs standard play.
India: Can hold the Sepoy rush. Should FF vs prolonged colonial.
China: Loses vs colonial. Loses with sea boom. Equal pathing if both FF.
Otto: Loses vs Jan rush. Wins vs FF.
Dutch: Easy win, no matter what.
Brit: Wins vs the Musk rush. Loses if standard play. Should FF yourself.
French: -||-
Port: Wins vs musk rush. Loses vs FF. You win if you FF.
Russia: Holds the all in. Loses the prolonged colonial.
Spain: Loses vs the FF. Should FF yourself.
Germany: Viable in any case.

[Garja]

Honestly on TAD you are probably going to lose anyway vs pretty muc any civ.

[tedere12]

Na spain destroys port ff

[sebnan12]

Na spain destroys port ff

yes approved msg