Sirmusket german timing

France Kaiserklein
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Sirmusket german timing

Post by Kaiserklein »

Just posting here 3 records of when I tried the 3sw 5uhlans 2sw 3 dops bo on High Plains. I got consistently 54 pop or so at 8:30, after deleting 5 uhlans.
Also added a record of an actual good build for 8:30 timing, to compare with the other build, and answer some stuff I read in twitch chats/in this thread.
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3x sirmusket build + a good 8:30 timing
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Radix_Lecti »

So Sirmusket claimed he did something in chat and you have shown it to be impossible? I could have told you that, too. :smile:
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Tuvalu gibson
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by gibson »

no he actually did it vs someone, wonder how :hmm: :hmm:
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by gibson »

right here, he has 2 very suspicious bumps in military

viewtopic.php?f=314&t=14087&p=297524#p297524
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by deleted_user0 »

Kaiserklein wrote:Just posting here 3 records of when I tried the 3sw 5uhlans 2sw 3 dops bo on High Plains. I got consistently 54 pop or so at 8:30, after deleting 5 uhlans.

EDIT: look like ESOC is having syntax issues with their sql queries so I can't upload my recs now, will add them when it's fixed


so what? Sirmusket is just better than you. Who cares.
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Kiribati princeofcarthage
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by princeofcarthage »

Honestly he didn't even lose 5 uhlans according to screenshots, maybe 2 at the most, and I could get 96/100 total pop at 8:20, 62 military pop at 8:20, which had 1 3 uhlan batch and 2 4 uhlan batches, the only treasure I had was 20 wood. I also missed the first xp batch, my BO was 2 sw 3 sw 2 sw 8 xbow 5 uhlan, so considering I had perfect macro,and had full uhlan batches, I think it's possible to have 70 military pop at 8:35 or 60 even if u consider deleting 5 uhlans
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by deleted_user0 »

princeofcarthage wrote:Honestly he didn't even lose 5 uhlans according to screenshots, maybe 2 at the most, and I could get 96/100 total pop at 8:20, 62 military pop at 8:20, which had 1 3 uhlan batch and 2 4 uhlan batches, the only treasure I had was 20 wood. I also missed the first xp batch, my BO was 2 sw 3 sw 2 sw 8 xbow 5 uhlan, so considering I had perfect macro,and had full uhlan batches, I think it's possible to have 70 military pop at 8:35 or 60 even if u consider deleting 5 uhlans


well... u did a different bo lol. sending 5 uhlans after 3sw instead of 700w or 2sw is actually quite a big deal. but with good tres, i guess its not impossible to do the same with the 5 uhlan bo
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by princeofcarthage »

Well afaik musket did 3sw 2sw 3 dopp, so kaiser's bo is actually different not mine, and I had no tres, I did on ozarks which can mess with hunts, while kaiser did on Hp which is relatively a better map, also xp is different on both maps, I also missed the first xp batch
Fine line to something great is a strange change.
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by gibson »

Musket cleared chunfirmed!
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Snuden »

Who is Sirmusket?
[Sith] - Baphomet
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Snuden »

I only know one Sir on this forum!
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Radix_Lecti »

gibson wrote:right here, he has 2 very suspicious bumps in military

viewtopic.php?f=314&t=14087&p=297524#p297524


I see... plz do remember I beat him once 2v3 :P
After seeing those screens, I too must now admit that he has become one of the top 3 players, maybe even better than aiz.
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Armenia Sargsyan
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Sargsyan »

Someone wrote no dodge then dodged from bo9 series
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Germany QueenOfdestiny
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by QueenOfdestiny »

Sargsyan wrote:Someone wrote no dodge then dodged from bo9 series

I think he deleted his post
shit juice :hmm:
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by yemshi »

Sargsyan wrote:Someone wrote no dodge then dodged from bo9 series

Yeah he challenged to a bo9 at 15 (?) GMT. NO DODGE! MAKE IT HAPPEN!
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Radix_Lecti »

Sirmusket's ''eat no deers'' strat on Ozarks unbeatable I think.
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Bavaria Gichtenlord
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Gichtenlord »

Why is sirmusket so silent right now? Weird :)
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by KINGofOsmane »

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Sir gibson?
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Italy Garja
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Garja »

It is not hard to get 50ish pop as Germans at 8-9 min. I know for experience by doing ulhan dopp builds. Ulhan and dopps both take 2 pop so they inflate the pop count, plus Germans get about 12 free pop in that time frame. Pop count is stilll somewhat legit and that shows again how strong Germans can be.
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Gafur »

Garja wrote: Pop count is stilll somewhat legit and that shows again how strong Germans can be.

"How strong sirmusket can be"
FTFY
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Kaiserklein »

princeofcarthage wrote:Honestly he didn't even lose 5 uhlans according to screenshots, maybe 2 at the most, and I could get 96/100 total pop at 8:20, 62 military pop at 8:20, which had 1 3 uhlan batch and 2 4 uhlan batches, the only treasure I had was 20 wood. I also missed the first xp batch, my BO was 2 sw 3 sw 2 sw 8 xbow 5 uhlan, so considering I had perfect macro,and had full uhlan batches, I think it's possible to have 70 military pop at 8:35 or 60 even if u consider deleting 5 uhlans

No, you can clearly count 4 uhlans dying on the military graphs. And there's probably a 5th one that doesn't show because some units were popping at the same time. Plus I did it on high plains, which has just way better resources. And I didn't ever get idled/pressured since it was against a comp. I also took a couple treasures (sometimes a 95w, sometimes 50w 60f, etc, + the in base gold treasures). I got nearly perfect xp passes. I also believe I have a better macro than sirmusket. Still I can't match the mass. I'm curious about what I did wrong?

princeofcarthage wrote:Well afaik musket did 3sw 2sw 3 dopp, so kaiser's bo is actually different not mine, and I had no tres, I did on ozarks which can mess with hunts, while kaiser did on Hp which is relatively a better map, also xp is different on both maps, I also missed the first xp batch

No, he did 3sw/units/2sw/units. It's pretty clear in the graphs. So your bo is wrong. I could also change the bo and do 3sw 700w 700g 8 bows and get 70+ military pop at 8:30 easily, but that's not really the point.
On a side note, if you missed the xp and had worse hunts than he possibly had, it's not a legit simulation. It needs to be a best-case scenario.

Garja wrote:It is not hard to get 50ish pop as Germans at 8-9 min. I know for experience by doing ulhan dopp builds. Ulhan and dopps both take 2 pop so they inflate the pop count, plus Germans get about 12 free pop in that time frame. Pop count is stilll somewhat legit and that shows again how strong Germans can be.

We're talking here about 72 pop at least (64 + 4 dead uhlans). Pretty far from 50ish.
I have a ton of experience doing dop cav builds, and I know that it is very possible to get that kind of military pop at 8:30, or even slightly more. However, that's with a legit build. 3sw 5uhlans 2sw 3dops without steel traps simply gives a terrible mass. The 2sw don't even have time to gather anything since they're shipped right before the "timing", if we can even call that a timing. And you need to chop/buy all the wood for houses.


We'll just see when I can finally post the recs (@EAGLEMUT do you know what's going on?), you guys feel free then to explain what went wrong 3 times in a row.
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Radix_Lecti »

You ate the deers prolly. ^_^
Sirmusket doesn't need hunts cuz he too op. gold for food.

This getting boring af. Sirmusket hax--> we talk--> he hax more---> we talk---> he hax some more...

im opting out of this dumb shiet. :arrow:
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Italy Garja
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Garja »

Well 72 pop seems too much. And also ye 2sw is useless card for a timing. Even 3sw if not sent first isn't that great.
However bear in mind that postgame stats can be deciving. It's not always 100% clear how many units die and also it is possible that with a good exp treasure you just get 4th shipment sooner + maybe MM called at some point and then it's 10 more pop than usual. Losing units frees pop space so it makes the remass a bit more easier.
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France Kaiserklein
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Kaiserklein »

Exactly, that's why I deleted 5 uhlans, because it basically gives you an extra 100w for the house. Only in the first rec I forgot to do it I think.
Yes, it's not 100% clear how many units die, but if anything it's more than what it shows. The graph says 4 uhlans died, so it's at least 4 uhlans. Tedere claims it's 5, so I deleted 5. Doesn't make a huge difference either way, only 2 pop.
I considered the mm thing yeah. They cost more or less the same as 2 uhlans (4 pop), and take 6 pop instead. So it's an extra 2 pop there again.
Still don't see how you can reach 72+ units, at the end of the day. Especially with all I mentioned here:

Plus I did it on high plains, which has just way better resources. And I didn't ever get idled/pressured since it was against a comp. I also took a couple treasures (sometimes a 95w, sometimes 50w 60f, etc, + the in base gold treasures). I got nearly perfect xp passes. I also believe I have a better macro than sirmusket.


It just feels weird.
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LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
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Re: Sirmusket german timing

Post by Garja »

I still wouldn't overthink about postgame graphs because there can be lot of inaccuracies and simply unusul good conditions.
For example, steel trap is also probably not ideal for a sub 10 min timing (still worth the trade off with 5 pop or so), time reference on post game graphs is a bit off, might be 10 secs later depending on where you put the cursor and finally Ozarks has one of the very best xp/sec trade routes in the game which definitely make German progression faster than usual.
The most suspicious thing, in the end, is the build which doesn't seem optimal at all. Especially dunno where you get the wood from, even if buying it from gold. I suppose tho, for one thing, that going pure ulhan increases the efficiency slightly, compared to going ulhan dopp. 70ish pop isn't even that strange, everything considered. If ulhan were worth 1.5 pop that would be more like 50 pop which is totally normal considering free ulhans and unit cards.
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