Sir Musket Guide to Germans{ WORD DOC ATTACHED}

[sirmusket]

[attachment id="2109"]

[Kaiserklein]

That's a good try, but the first thing I saw is the deck : no 1k wood, wo 1k gold ? No 3 ww or 5 dops ? That's the biggest flaws. In colonial, either 600w or 600g (or both) would be welcomed, too (instead of bow/skirms upgrade, or team cav attack, maybe).

About the guide himself, imo a lot of things are awkward but it's mainly :
- Germans usually age up with 17 settlers pop, not 16
- If you have 200w start you go TP indeed, but with 100w 100g start you should go market by buying 100 wood. You can even go market with 100w start (like france), without much idle time if you have a good macro
- Only 1 strat ? And what you call a cav rush isn't really what people usually do as german. People almost always semi-ff, because german colonial is weak, except for those early free 2-4 uhlans that matter a lot.
- If you didn't have an early TP, you should chop for it during transition. You can afford 200 extra wood and still get 5 uhlans out.
- 5 uhlans shipment is terrible... It's like 3 uhlans + 2 uhlans. Compare 3 uhlans to russ 5 cos shipment or even 8 bows or anything... It can be useful in some situations, for example if you pop them out of tc and mm trap, but not for a rush. You basically trade 700w (which would be so useful since you have only 40 pop space, instead of buying wood which is a waste of resources + makes mines run out faster) for 3 uhlans. 150f 300g vs 700w, I think you can easily see which one is the best.

Otherwise there are good points in your build, like sending 3 sw first or the mm/bows thing, the fact that you have to raid and take good trades with musks, etc. You should work on it, if you want some advice for an age 2 cav build you can ask

[_venox_]

According to my understanding, carddecks should be a mixture between efficiency (base value of a card), emphasis (on civ strengths), strategy (e.g. cavalry switch), and utility (e.g. 700f on low hunt map). Now Kaiserklein, you are good with Germany: Why do you say that the 5 uhlan shipment is terrible but the 8 uhlan shipment isn't? From 3 uhlans to 5 it is an increase of 300 resources, like it is from a 700 resource shipment to a 1000 resource shipment. Is it because in practice it shows that 5 uhlans can't be used that well because you want to semi ff, but 8 uhlans are nice to overwhelm your opponent with the sheer amount of cavalry you give them to deal with? Aren't you mainly training uhlans from your stables in the fortress age anyways? Do you need 2 big scary pops out of your town centre?

Is a good age 2 cav build something like 2 sw, 3 sw, 700w, 700c, 600c/army?

[yurashic]

According to my understanding, carddecks should be a mixture between efficiency (base value of a card), emphasis (on civ strengths), strategy (e.g. cavalry switch), and utility (e.g. 700f on low hunt map). Now Kaiserklein, you are good with Germany: Why do you say that the 5 uhlan shipment is terrible but the 8 uhlan shipment isn''t? From 3 uhlans to 5 it is an increase of 300 resources, like it is from a 700 resource shipment to a 1000 resource shipment. Is it because in practice it shows that 5 uhlans can''t be used that well because you want to semi ff, but 8 uhlans are nice to overwhelm your opponent with the sheer amount of cavalry you give them to deal with? Aren''t you mainly training uhlans from your stables in the fortress age anyways? Do you need 2 big scary pops out of your town centre?

Is a good age 2 cav build something like 2 sw, 3 sw, 700w, 700c, 600c/army?

Age 2 cav build people use for team games is 2 sw, 3 sw, 700 wood, 2 sw, cavalry hitpoints. From 700 wood you build a second stable, 3 houses and get the second gold upgrade at the market. Or you can just 5-10 cav semi like in 1v1.

[Jaeger]

Or go cav hp instead of 2 SW if you havent lost much cav

[Kaiserklein]

For team cav I do TP while ageing up + placer mines + 125 wood. Then 3 sw, make 3 houses + a stable. 700w for 2nd stable + 2 houses + 2nd gold upgrade + steel traps. Then you ship palatine and you go from 70 to 190 pop space. Waiting for criticism

[gibson]

According to my understanding, carddecks should be a mixture between efficiency (base value of a card), emphasis (on civ strengths), strategy (e.g. cavalry switch), and utility (e.g. 700f on low hunt map). Now Kaiserklein, you are good with Germany: Why do you say that the 5 uhlan shipment is terrible but the 8 uhlan shipment isn''t? From 3 uhlans to 5 it is an increase of 300 resources, like it is from a 700 resource shipment to a 1000 resource shipment. Is it because in practice it shows that 5 uhlans can''t be used that well because you want to semi ff, but 8 uhlans are nice to overwhelm your opponent with the sheer amount of cavalry you give them to deal with? Aren''t you mainly training uhlans from your stables in the fortress age anyways? Do you need 2 big scary pops out of your town centre?

Is a good age 2 cav build something like 2 sw, 3 sw, 700w, 700c, 600c/army?

five uhlan card is bad because any card you send you will get 2 uhlan so it''s basically a 3 uhlan card

[_venox_]

Nice, thanks. Any colonial 1v1 play that is viable?

[Jaeger]

Nobody suggested not shipping 3 SW first

[Jaeger]

Nice, thanks. Any colonial 1v1 play that is viable?

Yeah TP and steel traps in transition, cav start and 3SW 700w (2 raxes) 600w units or 3 SW 700w (1 rax) units ad probably second rax from or right before 600w whenever you ship it. Remember you can also ship 700g/600g anytime for uhlan+dopp spam if for example they go heavy on bows and not a lot of musks, or vs lb pike huss. You can also start rax if you want. Vs aztec for example if your TP is not in your base, you wanna start rax, make 5 pikes, and ship 8 bows 3 SW 700w in order to defend your TP.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Colo play isn't viable in most mu.

[Jaeger]

Colo play isn''t viable in most mu.

Semi ff is generally better, but colo is fine too in a lot of matchups. Ask mitoe/try it yourself if you don''t believe me

[_venox_]

Thanks for all the responses, I will try the cav start into infantry sometime and I should remember to get amalgamation ://.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Colo play isnt viable in most mu.

Semi ff is generally better, but colo is fine too in a lot of matchups. Ask mitoe/try it yourself if you dont believe me

Colo is k vs china, azzy, sioux, iro and russia.
And vs china/sioux a semi or a naked ff is better

[Durokan]

[div style="text-align:center'"][i style="font-size:12pt'"]Sir Musket: Guide to Germans

[/i][/div]Germans by far are one of the strongest civilisations in aoe3, vanilla and TAD. They have access to some of the best cavalry in the game, and in my opinion the best in age 2, and they also have access to crazy shipments like 6 villages and 2 uhlans shipment (10 pop).

Everyone who has played aoe3 long enough will know that Germans have the most cost efficient cavalry in game for age 2 , and even 3. Uhlans cost only 150 resources, 50 less than a hussar and only requires to 2, 3 more to win a fight with good micro against hussars. However uhlans greatest asset is there high attack, which is deadly for taking down villages early on.

Ok now to the strategy, since Germans are such a versatile civ, like British and French, they can do quite a lot, however it is the cavalry rush that you see most of time played by players. This is because by far there best unit in age 2 are uhlans, already receiving 2 with every shipment is a slight edge in early mass and size. Another viable strategy is there semi ff allowing them to pump 7 uhlans and still get to fortress and just under 8 minutes with a shipment ready.
[hr]Cav Rush:

At start send 1 SW to herd others to gather crates, gather all crates except coin crates, que settlers fast and build 1 house, if 200 wood start then chop 100 wood with 2 settlers and build TP at start with explorer. If the map is Great Plains then explorer to gather those coin treasures ASAP.

Keep herding, and stop making vills at 12, ship 2 SW yielding a total of 16 settlers if you have gathered fast and you are already at 680-700 food then those 2 SW put them directly on wood and not food when they arrive. Age up with 400 wood, and in transition immediately put all SW on wood. Now you should have 6 regular settlers left, one to gather the coin crate at start that you didn??t gather, 3 to go out and herd, far hunt, the remaining ones for now go on the old bison??s if food is still left in them. Now it is better to gather early, almost at start straight away so next large hunt is already at your TC but still ok if you start during transition however then need to herd ASAP.

Okay so this is important part, with those 5 SW on wood you need to gather enough wood for market, HD, PM (225 wood) if you found or find a 95 wood treasure or 80 wood treasure, then chop 5 or 20 more wood for house if not, put 5 SW on mines once you know you have gathered enough for those market upgrades, always research PM before HD because uhlans cost much more coin than food. Now you would have aged up, send 1 SW to gather 400 wood, those 3 vills near TC that were gathering from starting hunts send those now to new hunts with other settlers if you haven??t done that already. Build stable in base. Build 2 houses with other 200 wood with the hunting vills for line of sight. Reason I??m not building stable out far is because, you never really need FB for cav and if you going against person making musk, then he can easily siege stable and that??s last thing you want. Now send 3 SW (first shipment in colonial) and start queuing 1 vill and uhlans ASAP. When 2 uhlans arrive from shipment move explorer into their base and get to see where his vills are hunting, you should get 5 uhlans out easily then send all 7 to raid, try to trap vills, go around, blocking there path to tc, this will insure you kill as many as possible, if he is good player like PR35 + he will be very good with building placement e.c.t so it will be hard to kill many vills, however you??re at least stopping him from gathering, delaying his army, economy e.c.t. 3rd shipment is 5 uhlans, if you get popped then buy wood with coin, you will always have lots of coin with Germans. Keep queuing uhlans and villages. Now uhlans can beat musk if the mass is in your favour, e.g. 15 uhlan vs 10 musk, definitely take this as uhlans high attack will kill musk very fast. If he is making pike then ship 8 xbow eventually and keep raiding vills, uhlans are much faster than pikes, so running away when needed won??t be a problem, if starts pressuring your houses/stable with pikes, then send 8 xbow ASAP pop MM and then attack with uhlans,xbow,MM this will clean pike in seconds. Now never stop making vills, if you have done this you should hit 35 vills around 13 min or so, with huge uhlan mass, now it??s up to you from here, you can add rax, make xbow, dop or even just more uhlans, or go fortress. If you do decide to make dop don??t make a lot unless he going cav, and if you fortress then upgrade uhlan ASAP and I like to always ship 1k wood or 9 uhlan, 9 veteran uhlan is crazy shipment as most civ??s only have access to 5 hussar in 3rd age, 9 uhlan is almost double of 5 hussars. Germans have much more strats and I would be willing to share them, however note I am by no means an expert at aoe3 and definitely not with Germans, however I??ve seen this strategy working for me a lot recently and was willing to share.

Abbreviations used:

Vanilla= Original aoe3

TAD= The Asian dynasties

SW= Setter Wagon

TP = Trade Post

TC= Town Centre

PM= Placer Mines

HD= Hunting Dogs

Musk= Musketeer

MM= Minutemen

Dop= Doppelsoldner

Rax= Barracks

The German Deck:

[img]http://i.imgur.com/neKb4um.png[/img]


20th October 2015
Will delete post on request of OP.

[sirmusket]

why delete post?

[sirmusket]

That''s a good try, but the first thing I saw is the deck : no 1k wood, wo 1k gold ? No 3 ww or 5 dops ? That''s the biggest flaws. In colonial, either 600w or 600g (or both) would be welcomed, too (instead of bow/skirms upgrade, or team cav attack, maybe).

About the guide himself, imo a lot of things are awkward but it''s mainly :
- Germans usually age up with 17 settlers pop, not 16
- If you have 200w start you go TP indeed, but with 100w 100g start you should go market by buying 100 wood. You can even go market with 100w start (like france), without much idle time if you have a good macro
- Only 1 strat ? And what you call a cav rush isn''t really what people usually do as german. People almost always semi-ff, because german colonial is weak, except for those early free 2-4 uhlans that matter a lot.
- If you didn''t have an early TP, you should chop for it during transition. You can afford 200 extra wood and still get 5 uhlans out.
- 5 uhlans shipment is terrible... It''s like 3 uhlans + 2 uhlans. Compare 3 uhlans to russ 5 cos shipment or even 8 bows or anything... It can be useful in some situations, for example if you pop them out of tc and mm trap, but not for a rush. You basically trade 700w (which would be so useful since you have only 40 pop space, instead of buying wood which is a waste of resources + makes mines run out faster) for 3 uhlans. 150f 300g vs 700w, I think you can easily see which one is the best.

Otherwise there are good points in your build, like sending 3 sw first or the mm/bows thing, the fact that you have to raid and take good trades with musks, etc. You should work on it, if you want some advice for an age 2 cav build you can ask

ya i agree with you, we can play on eso if you like im active on gameranger more however, eso name is ProPlayer97 gr name is Sir_Musket

[sirmusket]

Thats a good try, but the first thing I saw is the deck : no 1k wood, wo 1k gold ? No 3 ww or 5 dops ? Thats the biggest flaws. In colonial, either 600w or 600g (or both) would be welcomed, too (instead of bow/skirms upgrade, or team cav attack, maybe).

About the guide himself, imo a lot of things are awkward but its mainly :
- Germans usually age up with 17 settlers pop, not 16
- If you have 200w start you go TP indeed, but with 100w 100g start you should go market by buying 100 wood. You can even go market with 100w start (like france), without much idle time if you have a good macro
- Only 1 strat ? And what you call a cav rush isnt really what people usually do as german. People almost always semi-ff, because german colonial is weak, except for those early free 2-4 uhlans that matter a lot.
- If you didnt have an early TP, you should chop for it during transition. You can afford 200 extra wood and still get 5 uhlans out.
- 5 uhlans shipment is terrible... Its like 3 uhlans + 2 uhlans. Compare 3 uhlans to russ 5 cos shipment or even 8 bows or anything... It can be useful in some situations, for example if you pop them out of tc and mm trap, but not for a rush. You basically trade 700w (which would be so useful since you have only 40 pop space, instead of buying wood which is a waste of resources + makes mines run out faster) for 3 uhlans. 150f 300g vs 700w, I think you can easily see which one is the best.

Otherwise there are good points in your build, like sending 3 sw first or the mm/bows thing, the fact that you have to raid and take good trades with musks, etc. You should work on it, if you want some advice for an age 2 cav build you can ask

ya i agree with you, we can play on eso if you like im active on gameranger more however, eso name is ProPlayer97 gr name is Sir_Musket

However may i point out you say, germans always age with 17 pop and than say 100 wood start build market and than chop more wood for house, wont this make your age up super slow, ik when i age with 16 pop and build house with 100 wood start and waste no seconds on wood or coin early that my age up even then isnt as fast as dutch,french, well even british seeing as they age by 4:30

[sirmusket]

And for those who say colo play isnt viable, me personally think it certainly is, maybe semi ff is better but uhlans are just such a strong unit, most cost efficient cav, and can raid vills all day, even there siege damage is good considering they have the same stats of a musketeer - 20 siege damage.

[Kaiserklein]

ya i agree with you, we can play on eso if you like im active on gameranger more however, eso name is ProPlayer97 gr name is Sir_Musket

However may i point out you say, germans always age with 17 pop and than say 100 wood start build market and than chop more wood for house, wont this make your age up super slow, ik when i age with 16 pop and build house with 100 wood start and waste no seconds on wood or coin early that my age up even then isnt as fast as dutch,french, well even british seeing as they age by 4:30

4:30-35 is the time you should age with 17 vils as german... And brits/dutch most often age up in 4:05-10

[Kaiserklein]

And for those who say colo play isnt viable, me personally think it certainly is, maybe semi ff is better but uhlans are just such a strong unit, most cost efficient cav, and can raid vills all day, even there siege damage is good considering they have the same stats of a musketeer - 20 siege damage.

Yeah but musks are kinda the best unit in colonial, because they are so polyvalent and many civs have no counter for them in colonial except bows (which aren''t really a counter). The fact that germany lacks musks make them lose to a musk/cav composition, they just can''t counter that in colonial

[Wuangaga]

And for those who say colo play isnt viable, me personally think it certainly is, maybe semi ff is better but uhlans are just such a strong unit, most cost efficient cav, and can raid vills all day, even there siege damage is good considering they have the same stats of a musketeer - 20 siege damage.

Just massing cav doesn''t work in the long run in a 1v1, you get outmassed and countered by musks, pikes any heavy inv or light cav actually.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Normal age up is 17v or even 18v. I know Mitoe ages with 18v when he has a food start, that way he can market or tp.

[purplesquid]

I often age up with 18 vills on a food start if I dont get op treasures. On a coin start I go market but I still sometime need to go 18 vills with that as well. . .

[yemshi]

[div style="text-align:center'"]
[/div]
The German Deck:

[img]http://i.imgur.com/neKb4um.png[/img]


who made this Deck without 1k wood/coin and hakkapells and Germatown Farmers? Any why no HC?