China options in age 4 after esoc Old Han nerf

[Atomiswave]

Now after han has been nerfed considerably in esoc, what should China train in age 4? Same age 3 hammer/fail/arquebuster/changdao/crow combo or still stick to nerfed han composition?

[fei123456]

if you don't go reform, why do you go age 4? :)

[Atomiswave]

if you don't go reform, why do you go age 4? :)

Lets say I am playing prolonged team game. Also, maybe han nerf is too harsh, in my opinion it should have been 25%, not 50% hp and dam reduction.

[mongo10]

if you don't go reform, why do you go age 4? :)

Lets say I am playing prolonged team game. Also, maybe han nerf is too harsh, in my opionon it should have been 25%, not 50% hp and dam reduction.

yeah, but if people don't like china and lose against them, they tend to nerf them to the ground.

[Atomiswave]

if you don't go reform, why do you go age 4? :)

Lets say I am playing prolonged team game. Also, maybe han nerf is too harsh, in my opionon it should have been 25%, not 50% hp and dam reduction.

yeah, but if people don't like china and lose against them, they tend to nerf them to the ground.

Herdables fattening rate and army train points nerf is understandable, but so steep Han nerf is questionable. Currently Han is not even worth sending.....

[IP Man]

Old Han reforms is still kinda OP. You get imperial units in indusrial for 1000 food. (that is 8k resources for imperial age). basically china has a card in industrial worth 8000-1000=7000 resources. The cost increase for units is basically irrelevant because you are going to send that card after you get big mass anyways.

[mongo10]

Show hidden quotes

if you don't go reform, why do you go age 4? :)

Lets say I am playing prolonged team game. Also, maybe han nerf is too harsh, in my opionon it should have been 25%, not 50% hp and dam reduction.

yeah, but if people don't like china and lose against them, they tend to nerf them to the ground.

Herdables fattening rate and army train points nerf is understandable, but so steep Han nerf is questionable. Currently Han is not even worth sending.....

Well, the army train point nerf makes no sense actually, herdables might be okay, but that already kinda implies how china atm is, only viable on lifestock maps and now even struggling more against eco semi ffs, while they struggeled against that before already.

[Atomiswave]

Show hidden quotes

if you don't go reform, why do you go age 4? :)

Lets say I am playing prolonged team game. Also, maybe han nerf is too harsh, in my opionon it should have been 25%, not 50% hp and dam reduction.

yeah, but if people don't like china and lose against them, they tend to nerf them to the ground.

Herdables fattening rate and army train points nerf is understandable, but so steep Han nerf is questionable. Currently Han is not even worth sending.....

Well, the army train point nerf makes no sense actually, herdables might be okay, but that already kinda implies how china atm is, only viable on lifestock maps and now even struggling more against eco semi ffs, while they struggeled against that before already.

Bear in mind that China also has unit creation wonders, so having rack that trained faster than other civs racks was a bit unbalanced.

Biggest issue is China got nothing to compensate for 3 nerfs that are not so small in practice.

[sudmakmak]

uninstall game or patch esoc. I go play civ 6. very happy.
I read every day and watch every tournament . but I don't answer. I can't chat at my phone.
goodbye all stupid logic(noob)

[Diarouga]

I don't think it's worth to send old han now.
In age 4, you would want at least a 30% attack and HP at least for free.
Now you have to pay for the shipment and your units are more expansive, and it only upgrades shit units (because bow/pike sucks).
Honestly old han was fine, just don't let china age to the 4th, it's really easy.

[Atomiswave]

I don't think it's worth to send old han now.
In age 4, you would want at least a 30% attack and HP at least for free.
Now you have to pay for the shipment and your units are more expansive, and it only upgrades shit units (because bow/pike sucks).
Honestly old han was fine, just don't let china age to the 4th, it's really easy.

What are alternative cards now? Manchu combat and western reforms along with largest changdao/fail/hammer/arquebuster/2 inf crow shipments?

[pecelot]

In age 4, you would want at least a 30% attack and HP at least for free.

Because other civs get it

[Diarouga]

I don't think it's worth to send old han now.
In age 4, you would want at least a 30% attack and HP at least for free.
Now you have to pay for the shipment and your units are more expansive, and it only upgrades shit units (because bow/pike sucks).
Honestly old han was fine, just don't let china age to the 4th, it's really easy.

What are alternative cards now? Manchu combat and western reforms along with largest changdao/fail/hammer/arquebuster/2 inf crow shipments?

Honestly the alternative is just don't age 4
In late game I'd probably still send old han but that's only if I'm almost 200/200 with bows.