India age 3 shipments

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China fei123456
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India age 3 shipments

Post by fei123456 »

Seems that india has too many great age 3 shipments. Some of them even worth 1000+(and I didnt mention the extra vill):
9 sepoy: 1080
9 zam: 1080
6 sowar: 1080
2 siege elephant: 1000

These shipments lhas less than 1000, but still great:
7 urumi: 900
2 mahout/2 howdah/3 mahout: 950
8 gurkha: 960
intervention: 900 (9 auto-upgraded redcoat with 10% extra hp/attack, and can send when popped)

So what should i put into my deck? They are all too good that I can't even decide :hmm:
Also i don't quite understand why many players have 7 gurkha 8 zamburak in their decks. These are good cards too, but nothing special compared with the shipments above. So why?
Age 3 battles are mainly between goons+skirms, but I believe that a well-rounded unit composition>simple goon skirm. So why 7 gurkha 8 zam>9 redcoat 9sepoy? :ohmy:
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by WickedCossack »

6 Sowar is 960 btw.

But I agree that 7 Gurkhas isn't really worth it considering how many amazing age 3 cards they have. 8 Zams is ok though, I don't have a problem with that really.

Redcoats are just flat out worse than sepoy in age 3 so intervention isn't worth it if you're going Brit Cons. 9 Sepoys is MU dependant, it's good against civs that don't main goon/skirm compositions basically (though ofc most civs do, but I still use decks with it in.)
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by Worldeater »

I never use 9 sepoys, 6 sowars or intervention. In age III I use mainly mahouts, gurkha, zamburaks, siege elephants and otto hussars, so there's no reason to send muskets. And sowars just suck. IMO 8 zambs is a good shipment since you can get a big number of zambs quite fast by sending 9 and 8 zambs. Aside from the shipments India has also great upgarde cards in age III like the two elphant cards (which no one seems to use but me), east india company and the gurkha upgrade, which makes them do more damage against heavy inf.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by howlingwolfpaw »

I use the 2-3 maout, 2 seige ele, sepoy upgrade card, elephant upgrade card. and maybe a couple others. I put 1000 coin card but I actually dont use it much.

for most civs i fight with like 10 gurka, 5 mahout, 2 seige ele and lots of sepoy. works very nice.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by lemmings121 »

The hp+att upgrade card for sepoy sowars and gurkas is nice too
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by forgrin »

7 Gurk is still useful because of India's comp. Their goons can't tank so they have to be even/ahead in skirm mass all the time, and 7 gurk allows you to recover or catch up.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by sirmusket »

forgrin wrote:7 Gurk is still useful because of India's comp. Their goons can't tank so they have to be even/ahead in skirm mass all the time, and 7 gurk allows you to recover or catch up.

wow forgrin still alive <3 come play one day man -_-"
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by yemshi »

India wins games just with their shipments. People who have 7 gurkhas and 8 zams arr just flat out boring and try to make the perfect skirm goon comp without realizing that they don't play France.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by momuuu »

I actually think many of those shipments are not really good. Elephants and sowars are kinda mediocre units, not really worth their cost. Sepoys and intervention musks are musks which suck, and in fortress wars gurkha are the best unit you can make. Although india does often have 2 barracks (or well, a barracks and an agra) so I guess maybe 8 zambs > 7 gurkha if I had to chose.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by deleted_user0 »

when i do a semi ff i prefer to send 8+7 ghurka in a row, just to catch up with the skir war asap. And zambs are so good you generally dont need more than 25-30 of them.

Imo you should make 2 or even 3 decks, 7+8 ghurka and urumi are standard. Then you should have 1 deck based on ghurka sepoy combo which ofc needs 9 sepoy but doesnt really need camel cards so would probably include mahouts and seige elephants. Then you should have one ghurka zamb deck, which would have 9 zambs and maybe 8 zambs or 6 sowar. Musk or intervention wouldnt be needed in that case. And you can have one elephant deck, which would have all the elephant cards and intervention and maybe 9 sepoy. Mahout sepoy can be useful in some cases.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by kami_ryu »

Interesting!

When do you go for Gurhka/Sepoy over Gurhka/Zamb? It depends on the civilization you're facing, correct?
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by deleted_user0 »

yea it depends on the civ and also what wonder you opened with. if you semi ff with sepoy then you can do sepoy ghurka. would make more sense vs a civ that has more melee units, such as spain or china. while ghurka zamb is better vs more mobile cav heavy civs. Also vs sioux I would include some sepoy, just to be safe. You can use sepoy vs germany, its a matter of style i guess
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by kami_ryu »

Thanks. What would you recommend vs Otto's Jan/Abus?

I played a few games vs that and it was tough. Gurhka/Sowar is what I ended the game with, but I feel I won with eco more than units or micro.

here is the vod for reference: http://www.twitch.tv/kami_ryu/v/114960064?sr=a&t=0
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by forgrin »

kami_ryu wrote:Thanks. What would you recommend vs Otto's Jan/Abus?

I played a few games vs that and it was tough. Gurhka/Sowar is what I ended the game with, but I feel I won with eco more than units or micro.

here is the vod for reference: http://www.twitch.tv/kami_ryu/v/114960064?sr=a&t=0


Gurk/Sowar is correct. Gurkha actually beat Jan and Abus with good kiting, and sowar are there to slam into the abus once you whittle down the Jan count enough. Jans actually have quite low damage against cav, so sowar are safer than usual. If Otto is pushing into your base you can add some sepoy to tank abus shots, but mostly gurk mass should win the game.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by kami_ryu »

Hey guys. I have two new cards available and I was wondering whether or not the card "Royal Green Jackets" was a good one to have. You get Gurhka with consulate shipments which is nice, but I'm more interested in adding +1 to the multiplier vs Heavy Infantry. Is this a good card?

@umeu thanks for the tips by the way. I sent the Sawmills card as a placeholder until I got the first wood trickle and it seems to have worked out for me.

However I'm now hitting a snag. I played a few games yesterday, 1 against Germany and 2 against Brits. I kept getting out-massed pretty hard. Granted, my play wasn't perfect, but I feel that it wasn't too bad either. I got schooled by my good friend @sircallen in this regard. Still, I want to ask, how can I improve my resource efficiency? In team games as well, I hardly ever gather the most, luckily my team mates gather well for me.

My most up to date build is doing a 10/10 Karni mata, send wood trickle as first shipment and 600w as second shipment. During transition, I get some housing, constant villager production and all the market upgrades. When I age up, I use the crates from Karni to get all the second tier market upgrades. Maybe I should go for the French consulate? They have +5% gathering. I could use some pointers here.

Shameless self plug, here is the stream where I get destroyed hard: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAYk1ycWPSo
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by drsingh »

Intervention with otto consulate should give 5 gardner. or it used to i think. but at 4 it is a waste. Also india mostly never needs redcoats since it has zamburak and sepoy.

I feel 1000w and 1000g need to be mentioned. more imp as compared to other civ. If you are not expecting immediate pressure, they are always better. India's hunts last longer, you can put everyone on food and use 1000g to mass more than with other shipments. 1000w will always be used up fast as india. the extra xp is the real bonus here. xp=vill

India has lot of mele focused units, techs and upgrades. urumi, mahout, rajput, drwaidian martial arts, dukha suffering, taj mahal power, tigers, TOV speed boost(?). i wonder if someone could combine them for a cheesy 1v1 strategy. late game range always wins.. :(
Mahouts need to boost speed too.

Green jackets only good in treaty with a good faith build.
Elephant upgrades ok if team. not in 1v1 unless u mass howdah :P

Gurkha sepoy should work on small maps if u are the one attacking first. I wonder if the british east india combo (sowar, sepoy, gurkha) is actually ever used?

Also what do you guys think about the native upgrade which gives +40% hp +10%speed. i used to use it on maps with warrior elephant. but that was long back and single player...
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by deleted_user »

kami_ryu wrote:Hey guys. I have two new cards available and I was wondering whether or not the card "Royal Green Jackets" was a good one to have. You get Gurhka with consulate shipments which is nice, but I'm more interested in adding +1 to the multiplier vs Heavy Infantry. Is this a good card?

@umeu thanks for the tips by the way. I sent the Sawmills card as a placeholder until I got the first wood trickle and it seems to have worked out for me.

However I'm now hitting a snag. I played a few games yesterday, 1 against Germany and 2 against Brits. I kept getting out-massed pretty hard. Granted, my play wasn't perfect, but I feel that it wasn't too bad either. I got schooled by my good friend @sircallen in this regard. Still, I want to ask, how can I improve my resource efficiency? In team games as well, I hardly ever gather the most, luckily my team mates gather well for me.

My most up to date build is doing a 10/10 Karni mata, send wood trickle as first shipment and 600w as second shipment. During transition, I get some housing, constant villager production and all the market upgrades. When I age up, I use the crates from Karni to get all the second tier market upgrades. Maybe I should go for the French consulate? They have +5% gathering. I could use some pointers here.

Shameless self plug, here is the stream where I get destroyed hard: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAYk1ycWPSo


I didn't school you :p I barely managed to win that second game. You played it very well I thought and I most likely would have lost had you had that 1k coin you had mismacro'd into units for the big fight for those two critical hunts in mid. The first game I killed the agra vill with the incan treasure nat on aracania. It's virtually impossible to come back after that.

Now I'm going to talk a bit about stuff I know little about so bear with me and take it all with a grain of salt.

While "all resources gathered" is an important post game stat and metric, note it will not always, nor should it always, be the same for two separate civilizations (to a certain extent). Brits, for instance, will have one of the greatest early-mid game ecos simply because of how the civ works. Similary, germany is nothing to scoff at for eco either as they get, essentially, a 4 villager age 1 shipment and a 6 villager age 2 shipment and often research amalgamation on their way to age 3. Meanwhile, "eco india" often takes awhile to get the ball rolling with required trickle cards to be sent, a consulate, 300 export and a certain wonder. India, in the paraphrased words of My Big Toe, seem to get good "after 5 or 6 cards have been shipped." Note I do not play india at all so whether this is true at all I do not know. Mitoe, though importantly, likes to play greedy which might be contradictory to India's largest strength, which is exploiting sepoys early. That is how we often see them played in tournaments. Generally, I think public opinion places India as an average civ on RE, while Germany is considered borderline OP and Brits are never bad.

So back to the resource line: civs like china and russia are often very competitive despite almost always falling behind economically. India for instance has slight advantages like a skirm/goon combo in age 2 and consulate options and the sepoy unit that can help them bridge that gap vs a civ like Brits. Brits, since they have such a quick early eco with so many villagers, are almost on a clock to gain map control before their hunts run out. They want to hit this timing if they are being contained. India wants to contain with the agra and apply pressure to prevent the timing from being very strong.

Variances in the all resources gathered statistic are expected in aoe 3 whereas in SC2 I'd imagine (i've never played the game lul) that the few civs are all very close in almost all aspects.

So don't get too hung up on it.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by kami_ryu »

Yeah honestly that's a fair enough assessment. A lot of what you say echoes what I've discussed with mitoe (who granted me a few games, thanks man). I also learned about some inefficiencies in my play which I'll try to iron out.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by Worldeater »

kami_ryu wrote:Hey guys. I have two new cards available and I was wondering whether or not the card "Royal Green Jackets" was a good one to have. You get Gurhka with consulate shipments which is nice, but I'm more interested in adding +1 to the multiplier vs Heavy Infantry. Is this a good card?


I use it sometimes against civs that usually have a lot of heavy inf like Japan or Ottoman because of the better multiplier, but in most games it's not very useful, since many civs go skirm/goon or skirm/hussar in fortress age.
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by lemmings121 »

kami_ryu wrote:Yeah honestly that's a fair enough assessment. A lot of what you say echoes what I've discussed with mitoe (who granted me a few games, thanks man). I also learned about some inefficiencies in my play which I'll try to iron out.


You are realy new in the game and got pr30 in a month? Omg you are an alien, just like uhlan. Welcome tho :p
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by kami_ryu »

Worldeater wrote:
kami_ryu wrote:Hey guys. I have two new cards available and I was wondering whether or not the card "Royal Green Jackets" was a good one to have. You get Gurhka with consulate shipments which is nice, but I'm more interested in adding +1 to the multiplier vs Heavy Infantry. Is this a good card?


I use it sometimes against civs that usually have a lot of heavy inf like Japan or Ottoman because of the better multiplier, but in most games it's not very useful, since many civs go skirm/goon or skirm/hussar in fortress age.


Yeah, that makes sense.

lemmings121 wrote:
kami_ryu wrote:Yeah honestly that's a fair enough assessment. A lot of what you say echoes what I've discussed with mitoe (who granted me a few games, thanks man). I also learned about some inefficiencies in my play which I'll try to iron out.


You are realy new in the game and got pr30 in a month? Omg you are an alien, just like uhlan. Welcome tho :p


I come from starcraft, but honestly I'm still very clueless. ty though <3. In uhlan's case, he was grandmaster (me I'm just gold-plat-diamond). so if i'm an alien, uhlan would be the alien
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by lemmings121 »

kami_ryu wrote:
Worldeater wrote:
kami_ryu wrote:Hey guys. I have two new cards available and I was wondering whether or not the card "Royal Green Jackets" was a good one to have. You get Gurhka with consulate shipments which is nice, but I'm more interested in adding +1 to the multiplier vs Heavy Infantry. Is this a good card?


I use it sometimes against civs that usually have a lot of heavy inf like Japan or Ottoman because of the better multiplier, but in most games it's not very useful, since many civs go skirm/goon or skirm/hussar in fortress age.


Yeah, that makes sense.

lemmings121 wrote:
kami_ryu wrote:Yeah honestly that's a fair enough assessment. A lot of what you say echoes what I've discussed with mitoe (who granted me a few games, thanks man). I also learned about some inefficiencies in my play which I'll try to iron out.


You are realy new in the game and got pr30 in a month? Omg you are an alien, just like uhlan. Welcome tho :p


I come from starcraft, but honestly I'm still very clueless. ty though <3. In uhlan's case, he was grandmaster (me I'm just gold-plat-diamond). so if i'm an alien, uhlan would be the alien


Well i was diamond in starcraft.... Still pr30 after about 10 years here.hahahha

We should play sometime tho, you probably have some crazy good mechanics
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by evilcheadar »

2 seige ele pretty good value, when you consider that to get them without a shipment you'd have to build the siege building which isn't too cheap and costs vill seconds to build
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by lemmings121 »

evilcheadar wrote:2 seige ele pretty good value, when you consider that to get them without a shipment you'd have to build the siege building which isn't too cheap and costs vill seconds to build


Sure but they are worse then 2 falcos at everything but killings falcos. Like you are forced to send them just to kill the 2 falcos, then you have a useless unit with so many tags that it is countered by almost all units in game. lol lol
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Re: India age 3 shipments

Post by evilcheadar »

lemmings121 wrote:
evilcheadar wrote:2 seige ele pretty good value, when you consider that to get them without a shipment you'd have to build the siege building which isn't too cheap and costs vill seconds to build


Sure but they are worse then 2 falcos at everything but killings falcos. Like you are forced to send them just to kill the 2 falcos, then you have a useless unit with so many tags that it is countered by almost all units in game. lol lol

i disagree, they are better against buildings than falconets are, and can move around much faster. They also can sponge some decent damage.
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