China vs France

[Jaeger]

Yes I can test this with you lol and we record, I think bow pike can win if its max like 15 unit pop but otherwise musk hus rapes. Add me on ESO Ovi12 Ill be on in like 7-8 hours from now and also tomorrow the whole day.

ill be in bed in that time

ill be on tmrw the whole day

[zoom]

He does make it right so its preferable. I want to watch H2Os china recs against france. Anybody has them?

well i dunno if it is preferable... the only reason it works for him is coz he is _H2O... i dunno if any other player would be able to face that pressure as him.... if you see his stream he fights a lot with villagers only losing 1 or 2 in the process... if you can fight with 20 musks and 10 huss using villagers like him then go for it :p the game i am referring to is _H2O vs acergame on tibet

Acergame played terribly strategically speaking in that game. He really let the Chinese player off the hook.

[Garja]

In relatively small numbers bow/pike actually beat musk/huss. It's not something you can do for a whole game of course.

[deleted_user0]

Bow pike offensive is also vulnerable to raids.

[Jaeger]

Bow pike offensive is also vulnerable to raids.

If you get raided you just kill vills yourself with bows and kill a house tho?

[deleted_user0]

No cuz mm tc fire some walls and vils do fine to defend vs the first few units

[mnogud]

well i dunno if it is preferable... the only reason it works for him is coz he is _H2O... i dunno if any other player would be able to face that pressure as him.... if you see his stream he fights a lot with villagers only losing 1 or 2 in the process... if you can fight with 20 musks and 10 huss using villagers like him then go for it :p the game i am referring to is _H2O vs acergame on tibet

Acergame played terribly strategically speaking in that game. He really let the Chinese player off the hook.

K

[Papist]

Bow pike offensive is also vulnerable to raids.

If you get raided you just kill vills yourself with bows and kill a house tho?

They dont have enough hp - tc fire and mm kill them really fast.

[_DB_]

Ouch. I just lost to a random France noob with China tower FF

He didn't hurt me a single time till I aged. So I was sure he's either gonna semi FF or FF himself.

At exact time I aged up, he pushed in with A LOT OF MUSK(almost 25-30) + 8 XBOWS + few hussars.

I lost my TC and a lost lot of my vils but still managed to hold the push and outnumbered his military. Slowly, I remassed, almost outscored him with half killed eco. At some point I sent refugee card and got many vils back and managed to get 3 TCs with a nice mass. The tower really helped me a lot keeping up with my eco.

WTF, he sent the TEAM early skirm card and kept kiting with skirm + musk + hussars. He soon aged up, then he got cuirassiers + hussars + vet musk + skirms + goons + 2 falcs.
Meh, I had nothing other than mass skirms, changdao and 9 manchu and few cav. I just lost.

it's unfair match up '(

PS: Anybody has some nice recs of this MU, and anybody has the full stream/rec of BS vs sam china vs france? I watched that but it's cut-off at the moment bs is in age 3.

[Mimsy for President]

I doubt everyone can age with the Porcelain Tower.

[WickedCossack]

Ouch. I just lost to a random France noob with China tower FF

He didn''t hurt me a single time till I aged. So I was sure he''s either gonna semi FF or FF himself.

At exact time I aged up, he pushed in with A LOT OF MUSK(almost 25-30) + 8 XBOWS + few hussars.

I lost my TC and a lost lot of my vils but still managed to hold the push and outnumbered his military. Slowly, I remassed, almost outscored him with half killed eco. At some point I sent refugee card and got many vils back and managed to get 3 TCs with a nice mass. The tower really helped me a lot keeping up with my eco.

WTF, he sent the TEAM early skirm card and kept kiting with skirm + musk + hussars. He soon aged up, then he got cuirassiers + hussars + vet musk + skirms + goons + 2 falcs.
Meh, I had nothing other than mass skirms, changdao and 9 manchu and few cav. I just lost.

it''s unfair match up '(

PS: Anybody has some nice recs of this MU, and anybody has the full stream/rec of BS vs sam china vs france? I watched that but it''s cut-off at the moment bs is in age 3.

Lol there''s only one person who plays like that as france. (rofl)

They also play china too. It''s a smart tactic tbh to just make a huge timming later on.

It''s still heavily china favoured though. Ranged inf semi is the best vs china. 5 skirms / 5 musk.

[zoom]

Chinese win, obviously...

[_DB_]

Chinese win, obviously...

Ever played vs a French captain or colonel or something as China? It isnt easy.

Its still heavily china favoured though. Ranged inf semi is the best vs china. 5 skirms / 5 musk.

Lol, the topic is about how to beat France as china, not how to beat china as france. I see no reason for it to be heavily in Chinas favor. Anything vs France is just too hard.

[adderbrain5]

"on paper"

RI/HI is the answer to HI/Cav

musks kind of break the rule since they have good ranged attack, and xbows are a very mediocre unit, however that rule still applies. why are you hitting cavalry with your xbows when you should be manually targeting musketeers? the pikes just move around to protect the hussars from getting into contact to the bows.

throw in cover mode for pikes and i there''s your answer to musk huss.

Yeah musks are HI in official AoE terms I guess. They aren''t really, they are their own unit type. But yeah RI+HI > HI+cav and yes musks break the rule cause musks aren''t really HI. They are a somewhat in between making them a very good unit for (especially early) colonial wars, you need to counter them with your own musks or a 3 unit comp. Everything else just loses including bow pike. Even with perfect cover mode micro a musk huss with mediocre micro would probably still win.

in real life gren halbredier dopp were teh real heavy inf but yea musks are th standard HI for gemmechanics

[britishmusketeer]

Ouch. I just lost to a random France noob with China tower FF

He didnt hurt me a single time till I aged. So I was sure hes either gonna semi FF or FF himself.

At exact time I aged up, he pushed in with A LOT OF MUSK(almost 25-30) + 8 XBOWS + few hussars.

I lost my TC and a lost lot of my vils but still managed to hold the push and outnumbered his military. Slowly, I remassed, almost outscored him with half killed eco. At some point I sent refugee card and got many vils back and managed to get 3 TCs with a nice mass. The tower really helped me a lot keeping up with my eco.

WTF, he sent the TEAM early skirm card and kept kiting with skirm + musk + hussars. He soon aged up, then he got cuirassiers + hussars + vet musk + skirms + goons + 2 falcs.
Meh, I had nothing other than mass skirms, changdao and 9 manchu and few cav. I just lost.

its unfair match up '(

PS: Anybody has some nice recs of this MU, and anybody has the full stream/rec of BS vs sam china vs france? I watched that but its cut-off at the moment bs is in age 3.

The stream of BS china vs Sam france is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8HQN0rXoP4

[mongobillione]

700w 700g semiff may be better.
or 5-10 hussars hurts your eco.

+1

[_DB_]

Ouch. I just lost to a random France noob with China tower FF

He didnt hurt me a single time till I aged. So I was sure hes either gonna semi FF or FF himself.

At exact time I aged up, he pushed in with A LOT OF MUSK(almost 25-30) + 8 XBOWS + few hussars.

I lost my TC and a lost lot of my vils but still managed to hold the push and outnumbered his military. Slowly, I remassed, almost outscored him with half killed eco. At some point I sent refugee card and got many vils back and managed to get 3 TCs with a nice mass. The tower really helped me a lot keeping up with my eco.

WTF, he sent the TEAM early skirm card and kept kiting with skirm + musk + hussars. He soon aged up, then he got cuirassiers + hussars + vet musk + skirms + goons + 2 falcs.
Meh, I had nothing other than mass skirms, changdao and 9 manchu and few cav. I just lost.

its unfair match up '(

PS: Anybody has some nice recs of this MU, and anybody has the full stream/rec of BS vs sam china vs france? I watched that but its cut-off at the moment bs is in age 3.

The stream of BS china vs Sam france is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8HQN0rXoP4

It is not full stream. I watched that very early. I actually want to watch the previous part of it, from where it is cut-off.

[Marco1698]

China ff op. As France player I can tell you if a player uses China there is no way to win that MU. You can try with semi ff but still very hard

[zoom]

China ff op. As France player I can tell you if a player uses China there is no way to win that MU. You can try with semi ff but still very hard

That''s more to do with you being outplayed than the match-up being Chinese-favored, from my experience.

[_venox_]

I think at least on ESOC maps it's china favoured but on most RE maps it's even. If China is able to defend they will just have too big of a mass in mid fortress to deal with.

[yurashic]

As French you should scout what wonder Chinese are aging with. In any case you should start cav and send 4v -> 700 wood.

If you scout confucian academy, build tps from 700 wood, make 10 cav to kill 8 arqu from age-up and then ship 700 gold and age up, mass cuirassiers. Like in this video.

youtube.com/watch?v=249oOwtzRdI

If you scout tower, build 2 raxes from 700 wood, make 20 muskets, ship 3 huss and timing push, Chinese do not have many units early on with tower age-up.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Lol, France wins that MU.

[iNcog]

France wins vs china?

musk:huss timing?

[britishmusketeer]

99% sure china wins

[momuuu]

As French you should scout what wonder Chinese are aging with. In any case you should start cav and send 4v -> 700 wood.

If you scout confucian academy, build tps from 700 wood, make 10 cav to kill 8 arqu from age-up and then ship 700 gold and age up, mass cuirassiers. Like in this video.

youtube.com/watch?v=249oOwtzRdI

If you scout tower, build 2 raxes from 700 wood, make 20 muskets, ship 3 huss and timing push, Chinese do not have many units early on with tower age-up.

this seems to be what I lose to when I play as china in this mu (not much experience the other way around). It seems really accurate tbh.

Can china hold off a french musk huss timing without having OP vill micro if you age with tower?