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China fei123456
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16 Feb 2017, 18:40

So why should india go semiff? Sometimes your opponent will go age 3 while you may not stop him. French is the best example, and ottoman may ff too.

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QQ截图20170217155054.jpg
QQ截图20170217155054.jpg (44.9 KiB) Viewed 1081 times

Build order:
Age 1
Send trickle first. Age up 14p/15p. Build agra near tc.
Put 3 vills on agra, chop a lot during transition for a TP (important!).
If you have 400w start you can try to build a start TP too, but it's better to get some wood/food treasure so that you won't age up too late.
Age 2
Send 2nd wood trickle first, and train a batch of sepoy to deal with the potent cav raid.
With two wood trickles you can build a market for a few upgrades, but dont delay your age up.
Send 600g then, age up with chaminata gate (not TOV!). Build with 4-8 vills (depends).
Train sepoy during transition, and with a tp you can send 600w too: consulate (ally with brit), 2nd rax.
Age 3
Usually you will send 350f 2mahout shipment first. But intervention/9sepoy/7urumi/2 siege elephant are good too.
Upgrade your sepoy, keep training them from two buildings. You will have to keep 8+ vills on wood. Don't forget mansabdar sepoy!
The next shipment can be 1000f 3mahout, by which time you will have 400e for 6redcoat too. Push!
If he kites you with some skirm/goon, you just go directly into his base, kill his tc and vills. Even if you didn't win the fight you should have better eco then, build 2 stables asap, train sowar/zam etc, and don't forget mansabdar units again.

Tips:
Why go sepoy instead of zamburak/gurkha etc?
1. You'll have to upgrade two units if you go zam/gurkha, and you have to age up with tower then.
2. Gurkha is nothing special (they have 19 range only), and zamburak without 30% attack card isn't OP either. However, sepoy is the best musk in the game, and sepoy with discipline, brit allience, and mansabdar aura are MONSTERs.
3. Sepoy+mahout combo has excellent siege ability, while gurkha+zam don't. You can easily destroy your opponent's buildings after a fight, and stop some turtle building/fi/revolt etc.
4. Upgraded sepoy can even kill 2 cannons withou losing much, while gurkha can't.
5. No micro! Ignore lag! Skirm has the same speed as sepoy so they can't really kite them, and even if he does so, fully upgraded sepoy are still difficult to kill.

Why do I age up with gate instead of tower?
1. A mahout can be useful if your opponent tries a timing push, while 800w can't.
2. You only need to upgrade 1 unit, so you'll need less wood.
3. Age 3 sepoy has insane hp/atk already, but mansabdar will make them even stronger. As you'll take fights against unit counter table (sepoy vs skirm/goon), you'll need these extra hp/attack.

Why do i send 3+2+1 mahouts?
To kill skirms of course! They have incredible hp, and can tank tons of damage from anything (even from goons), and your sepoy can fire at will.
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
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China fei123456
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16 Feb 2017, 18:47

Against ottoman:
600w-600g-2cannon may be faster, but trickle-600g-600w-2cannon should be available too (with a tp, and some xp treasure will help too). After this you can go full sepoy and win.
Tower will be better vs normal ff with 2 falconets, as a mahout isn't that useful against jan/cannon.
If he tries to go industrial and revolt, 2 cannon elephant can kill his tc before that too.
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
Greece tedere12
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16 Feb 2017, 19:43

Hey I usually try a defensive semi ff with base agra 300 export(4 vills) 600 gold and make only 5 gurka and age with mahout. I think the minutemen from the consulate makes it safer
"Well, now you are playing otto, but tommorow you might become a rapist, or a serial killer" -VaneStoilov

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Germany yemshi
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16 Feb 2017, 19:45

Trickles unsure constant vill production.
Garja wrote: Players on the RE are bad, laggers and they're lazy asses that would sell their mother for a couple of Elo points. It's not just my opinion, it's a fact (which I guess is the same thing, hence your confusion) that the EP is better.

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China fei123456
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17 Feb 2017, 04:14

300e is good too (maybe better?), but tp+consulate is 400w which is a big deal.
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
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Germany yemshi
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17 Feb 2017, 06:39

If you semi-ff you won't be pressured anyway, so MM are just a "waste" of export. You also want the brit 10% boost so it is just flat out worse.
Garja wrote: Players on the RE are bad, laggers and they're lazy asses that would sell their mother for a couple of Elo points. It's not just my opinion, it's a fact (which I guess is the same thing, hence your confusion) that the EP is better.

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Poland pecelot
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17 Feb 2017, 10:51

Thanks, pinning it to the strategy wall!
:ear:
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United States of America Darwin_
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17 Feb 2017, 14:44

I like this build quite a lot, will definitely try it!

What are your thoughts on building mahouts? By late fortress, or after you have spent you mahout shipments, is it worth it to train them, or should you train sowars or transition to zamb/guhka? Are the elephant combat card or the card that makes elephants cheaper relevant/worth sending? Also, would training the Mansabdar Mahout be worth it? Or is it too expensive?

Also, funny story, disciplined sepoy with brit consulate trade cost-effectively against un-upgraded age 3 skirm. They both take 7 shots to kill each other (sepoy only take 5 to kill a skim if they have mansabdar and brit east india company), and sepoy are only 157 vill seconds, compared to a skirmisher's 168. Age 3 sepoy gud unit. Even if the skirms have CIR, it still really isnt that bad for sepoy, considering they are "hard countered" by skirms. Ofc skirms can kite and stuff, but with mahout/sepoy you can probs just force an engagement anyway.
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United States of America __Uhlan__
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17 Feb 2017, 14:54

Don't train mahouts haha, just go zamb/gurka after the initial sepoy push, but you prolly shouldn't even send 3 mahouts it's a rip. I feel just push with 2 mahouts + sepoy mass + your ele's. Then follow it up with gurka/zamb urmi. India scales pretty well into late fortress imo can make more tc'a pretty easily & pretty good units. But in mass mahout + sepoy v a skrim/goon comp will just be kited for days, since mahout don't really snare like normal cav would.
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China fei123456
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17 Feb 2017, 15:11

__Uhlan__ wrote:Don't train mahouts haha, just go zamb/gurka after the initial sepoy push, but you prolly shouldn't even send 3 mahouts it's a rip. I feel just push with 2 mahouts + sepoy mass + your ele's. Then follow it up with gurka/zamb urmi. India scales pretty well into late fortress imo can make more tc'a pretty easily & pretty good units. But in mass mahout + sepoy v a skrim/goon comp will just be kited for days, since mahout don't really snare like normal cav would.

but skirms don't run faster than sepoy :smile:
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
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United States of America __Uhlan__
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17 Feb 2017, 15:59

Couprider wrote:
__Uhlan__ wrote:Don't train mahouts haha, just go zamb/gurka after the initial sepoy push, but you prolly shouldn't even send 3 mahouts it's a rip. I feel just push with 2 mahouts + sepoy mass + your ele's. Then follow it up with gurka/zamb urmi. India scales pretty well into late fortress imo can make more tc'a pretty easily & pretty good units. But in mass mahout + sepoy v a skrim/goon comp will just be kited for days, since mahout don't really snare like normal cav would.

but skirms don't run faster than sepoy :smile:


20 goons 20 skrims, can kite your mahouts very easily, and then it's sepoy v skrim, and if you send 2 mahouts then you won't have siege ele's and 2 flacs can wreck :P
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United States of America Darwin_
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17 Feb 2017, 16:11

__Uhlan__ wrote:
Couprider wrote:
__Uhlan__ wrote:Don't train mahouts haha, just go zamb/gurka after the initial sepoy push, but you prolly shouldn't even send 3 mahouts it's a rip. I feel just push with 2 mahouts + sepoy mass + your ele's. Then follow it up with gurka/zamb urmi. India scales pretty well into late fortress imo can make more tc'a pretty easily & pretty good units. But in mass mahout + sepoy v a skrim/goon comp will just be kited for days, since mahout don't really snare like normal cav would.

but skirms don't run faster than sepoy :smile:


20 goons 20 skrims, can kite your mahouts very easily, and then it's sepoy v skrim :P

If the sepoy can force an engagement and keep the skirms there, as I said in my previous post, disciplined sepoy with brit consulate actually trade cost effectively with un-upgraded skirms in a static fight. Even though skirms are the hard counter, sepoy are just crazy in age 3 and have insane break stats.
Hazza54321 wrote:Holy fuck an autobiography
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United States of America __Uhlan__
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17 Feb 2017, 16:36

Darwin_ wrote:
__Uhlan__ wrote:
Show hidden quotes


20 goons 20 skrims, can kite your mahouts very easily, and then it's sepoy v skrim :P

If the sepoy can force an engagement and keep the skirms there, as I said in my previous post, disciplined sepoy with brit consulate actually trade cost effectively with un-upgraded skirms in a static fight. Even though skirms are the hard counter, sepoy are just crazy in age 3 and have insane break stats.


That's the thing lol, they can't force a engagement.
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United States of America Darwin_
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17 Feb 2017, 20:18

__Uhlan__ wrote:
Darwin_ wrote:
Show hidden quotes

If the sepoy can force an engagement and keep the skirms there, as I said in my previous post, disciplined sepoy with brit consulate actually trade cost effectively with un-upgraded skirms in a static fight. Even though skirms are the hard counter, sepoy are just crazy in age 3 and have insane break stats.


That's the thing lol, they can't force a engagement.

That would definitely be the case once the mahouts are dead, but before that they might be able to. However, this build seems to be almost a strictly anti-otto/spain build, do to those civ's compositions being mostly heavy infantry and lacking in light infantry in early fortress. On top of that, siege elephants are wicked effective against artillery and sepoy are also wicked effective against nearly every unit otto/spain will have in early fortress will have. Also urumi/sepoy wrecks otto after the falcs die, speaking from personal experience here.
Hazza54321 wrote:Holy fuck an autobiography
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Brazil lemmings121
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17 Feb 2017, 20:25

Ye I would also adapt changing mahouts for anything else. They are a super expensive tank, but in practice each of then tanks like half mameluke, just slower and big... Any good player just kites for a while and kill 2 mahouts before the engage.. if you have like 5, then they can tank/do damage and help, but imo anything less is almost useless
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China fei123456
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17 Feb 2017, 21:19

lemmings121 wrote:Ye I would also adapt changing mahouts for anything else. They are a super expensive tank, but in practice each of then tanks like half mameluke, just slower and big... Any good player just kites for a while and kill 2 mahouts before the engage.. if you have like 5, then they can tank/do damage and help, but imo anything less is almost useless

Mahout means
1. His skirm cant deal damage to your sepoy before your mahouts die.
2. Usually his goons cant kill all your mahouts before mahouts catch up with his skirms. And 1-2 attacks from mahout can deal MASSIVE damage to skirms.
If he doesnt have many skirms you wont need mahouts. However, if he has less skirm you just go siege his base and win :flowers:
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
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China fei123456
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17 Feb 2017, 21:23

Darwin_ wrote:That would definitely be the case once the mahouts are dead, but before that they might be able to. However, this build seems to be almost a strictly anti-otto/spain build, do to those civ's compositions being mostly heavy infantry and lacking in light infantry in early fortress. On top of that, siege elephants are wicked effective against artillery and sepoy are also wicked effective against nearly every unit otto/spain will have in early fortress will have. Also urumi/sepoy wrecks otto after the falcs die, speaking from personal experience here.

This may not work vs spain cuz their falconets are too fast, and they may even build a front tower. Consulate rush should be better.
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
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Netherlands Jerom
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18 Feb 2017, 03:27

Why go zamb gurka: they are, when microed, superior units.
Sepoy + mahout cant ever hope to beat a skirm goon composition unless its lagging.

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China fei123456
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18 Feb 2017, 06:06

Jerom wrote:Why go zamb gurka: they are, when microed, superior units.
Sepoy + mahout cant ever hope to beat a skirm goon composition unless its lagging.

No, you just forget how cheap and strong sepoy are. And you have extra redcoats. And skirm dont run faster than sepoy, so they cant kite forever.
Can fortress skirm beat imperial musk? No. Sepoy are not imperial musk, but they're defenitely better than industrial musk.
Gurkha/zam are good with micro, but your opponent have skirms too.
"Why don't you dare to play with me if you already know who I am? You can never beat me even if I don't cheat."
"Aoe3 is dying, and cheating keeps it alive."
——Chuanchuan Chen(陈川川)
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Canada forgrin
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18 Feb 2017, 07:24

If you want sepoy mahout to work then mixing in 10-15 sowar is necessary, their speed can get the snare for you (then it's gg). Mahout will just get kited by goon :(
Mixing gurk into the sepoy ball will be excellent later, once they mass a decent amount of goons.
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Brazil lemmings121
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18 Feb 2017, 11:49

Tbf, i agree that sepoys are still viable in fortress. I wouldn't make a army based mainly in sepoys, but they are a good addition. Some cases gurka sepoy sowar works better then gurk zamb. (When there aren't a lot of goons..)
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France kami_ryu
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19 Feb 2017, 07:04

Couprider wrote:5. No micro! Ignore lag! Skirm has the same speed as sepoy so they can't really kite them, and even if he does so, fully upgraded sepoy are still difficult to kill.


love this
[explicit].
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European Union Asateo
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03 Aug 2017, 08:48

Why not go up with Taj Mahal?
It will decrease FF time and the peace ability helps vs raiding.
I've been looking for an indian answer to france and german ff. Will try the above build.
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Turkey LONEWOLF123
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03 Aug 2017, 08:58

fei123456 wrote:So why should india go semiff? Sometimes your opponent will go age 3 while you may not stop him. French is the best example, and ottoman may ff too.

Deck
QQ截图20170217155054.jpg

Build order:
Age 1
Send trickle first. Age up 14p/15p. Build agra near tc.
Put 3 vills on agra, chop a lot during transition for a TP (important!).
If you have 400w start you can try to build a start TP too, but it's better to get some wood/food treasure so that you won't age up too late.
Age 2
Send 2nd wood trickle first, and train a batch of sepoy to deal with the potent cav raid.
With two wood trickles you can build a market for a few upgrades, but dont delay your age up.
Send 600g then, age up with chaminata gate (not TOV!). Build with 4-8 vills (depends).
Train sepoy during transition, and with a tp you can send 600w too: consulate (ally with brit), 2nd rax.
Age 3
Usually you will send 350f 2mahout shipment first. But intervention/9sepoy/7urumi/2 siege elephant are good too.
Upgrade your sepoy, keep training them from two buildings. You will have to keep 8+ vills on wood. Don't forget mansabdar sepoy!
The next shipment can be 1000f 3mahout, by which time you will have 400e for 6redcoat too. Push!
If he kites you with some skirm/goon, you just go directly into his base, kill his tc and vills. Even if you didn't win the fight you should have better eco then, build 2 stables asap, train sowar/zam etc, and don't forget mansabdar units again.

Tips:
Why go sepoy instead of zamburak/gurkha etc?
1. You'll have to upgrade two units if you go zam/gurkha, and you have to age up with tower then.
2. Gurkha is nothing special (they have 19 range only), and zamburak without 30% attack card isn't OP either. However, sepoy is the best musk in the game, and sepoy with discipline, brit allience, and mansabdar aura are MONSTERs.
3. Sepoy+mahout combo has excellent siege ability, while gurkha+zam don't. You can easily destroy your opponent's buildings after a fight, and stop some turtle building/fi/revolt etc.
4. Upgraded sepoy can even kill 2 cannons withou losing much, while gurkha can't.
5. No micro! Ignore lag! Skirm has the same speed as sepoy so they can't really kite them, and even if he does so, fully upgraded sepoy are still difficult to kill.

Why do I age up with gate instead of tower?
1. A mahout can be useful if your opponent tries a timing push, while 800w can't.
2. You only need to upgrade 1 unit, so you'll need less wood.
3. Age 3 sepoy has insane hp/atk already, but mansabdar will make them even stronger. As you'll take fights against unit counter table (sepoy vs skirm/goon), you'll need these extra hp/attack.

Why do i send 3+2+1 mahouts?
To kill skirms of course! They have incredible hp, and can tank tons of damage from anything (even from goons), and your sepoy can fire at will.

going defensive ff is always better for india agianst ottoman , juts if you are india be carefull agians ottoman
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Italy Garja
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03 Aug 2017, 09:11

It is true that disciplined sepoy with ups are insane but a good player will manually micro them so it is still a musk unit in age3 and an expensive one.
You might want tomskip the sepoy batch at start if that helps getting market techs. 2 sepoy + agra + monks + mm should deal with some cav no problem.

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