London Terror Attack

[Goodspeed]

You pretty much have the TOTAL opposite opinion than I have :-)
Especially this "We as a society need to be the bigger person, meaning we need to stand there and take the blows"

Maybe I just didn't get the irony.

If a child yells at you, do you yell back?

No I do not. I have taught both my girls that in order to be heard, you need to argue in a civilized manner .
But one thing is to deal with children, another thing is to deal with people, willing to blow themselves up for their cause.

Yes, they have clearly not learned to deal with people in a civilized manner, as you have taught your girls. Does that mean you should stoop down to their level?

[deleted_user]

You pretty much have the TOTAL opposite opinion than I have :-)
Especially this "We as a society need to be the bigger person, meaning we need to stand there and take the blows"

Maybe I just didn't get the irony.

If a child yells at you, do you yell back?

I think the more interesting and pertinent question is, "If a child shoots at you do you shoot back?"

[Goodspeed]

You pretty much have the TOTAL opposite opinion than I have :-)
Especially this "We as a society need to be the bigger person, meaning we need to stand there and take the blows"

Maybe I just didn't get the irony.

If a child yells at you, do you yell back?

If a child choppes a knife in your belly, do you say well done?

You teach it not to do that. You give it incentives not to. You don't sell it a machine gun.
Oh and probably call 911.

[deleted_user]

I do actually think the child analogy works well here. Hadn't thought of it before like that.

[Snuden]

No I do not. I have taught both my girls that in order to be heard, you need to argue in a civilized manner .
But one thing is to deal with children, another thing is to deal with people, willing to blow themselves up for their cause.[/quote]Yes, they have clearly not learned to deal with people in a civilized manner, as you have taught your girls. Does that mean you should stoop down to their level?[/quote]

I have never said the recent incident was OK. No killing of innocent people is OK.
But I get so freaking mad, when people (non Muslims in this case) blame themselves for the ISIS attacks.

I am originally from Denmark, and the leftist politicians practically blame the Danes, when yet another integration plan went down the drain.

I brought my Japanese wife to Denmark back in the early 00's and I witnessed first hand how Muslim immigrants DID NOT give a fuck about Denmark or even trying to integrate. On the other hand they bring along their culture, demanding that their host country should recognize said culture as part of the society.

[Snuden]

I do actually think the child analogy works well here. Hadn't thought of it before like that.

It works crap and it proves that Goodspeed is clueless to children and Muslim immigration as a whole.

IMO.

(It could be another instance of the Dunning-Kruger effect)

[deleted_user]

Well that's ok that's why we have opinions

[Snuden]

To which we are all entitled.

[supernapoleon]

We should forbit religion in general. Most war started due to religious reasons

[Gendarme]

Why is the D-K effect so popular in online arguments? In most cases it's not even accurate, and is merely used as a meaningless insult.

[Goodspeed]

I have never said the recent incident was OK. No killing of innocent people is OK.
But I get so freaking mad, when people (non Muslims in this case) blame themselves for the ISIS attacks.

I am originally from Denmark, and the leftist politicians practically blame the Danes, when yet another integration plan went down the drain.

I brought my Japanese wife to Denmark back in the early 00's and I witnessed first hand how Muslim immigrants DID NOT give a fuck about Denmark or even trying to integrate. On the other hand they bring along their culture, demanding that their host country should recognize said culture as part of the society.

So what part of my post do you disagree with, then? Yes, integration is a challenge for every multi-cultural society including the one I live in. My post did not mention this at all. It did touch on an underlying issue but I'm sure you don't disagree that statistically irrelevant attacks like these being politicized and abused by both sides as grounds to become more entrenched in their hatred is a problem. In my opinion the main problem.

[Snuden]

Why is the D-K effect so popular in online arguments? In most cases it's not even accurate, and is merely used as a meaningless insult.

I am sure both Shakespeare and Confucius would be sad to hear that. Probably Darwin too.

[Snuden]

I have never said the recent incident was OK. No killing of innocent people is OK.
But I get so freaking mad, when people (non Muslims in this case) blame themselves for the ISIS attacks.

I am originally from Denmark, and the leftist politicians practically blame the Danes, when yet another integration plan went down the drain.

I brought my Japanese wife to Denmark back in the early 00's and I witnessed first hand how Muslim immigrants DID NOT give a fuck about Denmark or even trying to integrate. On the other hand they bring along their culture, demanding that their host country should recognize said culture as part of the society.

So what part of my post do you disagree with, then? Yes, integration is a challenge for every multi-cultural society including the one I live in. My post did not mention this at all. It did touch on an underlying issue but I'm sure you don't disagree that attacks like these being politicized and abused by both sides as grounds to become more entrenched in their hatred, is a problem. In my opinion the main problem.

I disagree that we should "turn the other cheek" (We as a society need to be the bigger person, meaning we need to stand there and take the blows. We count our losses, move on and don't hold grudges)

Hell NO!

We should welcome and help those in need but once the danger is over in their own country, they should return home. I have met war refugees from Iraq - IN Iraq! He was simply home on holiday, paid by the danish citizens tax money. What I was doing in Iraq? I was working on a project funded by the Danish government, building 3 new power plants for the Iraqi's. After completion we moved on to the next project, while the Iraqi's stripped the generators for copper. More money wasted.

One of the main problems as I see it, is that we have to be so damn political correct all the time. The cartton strip posted by Dolan is a good example. I this very thread I have been accused of being a racist, even though I have worked all my adult life abroad and married a woman from Asia!

I cant even state my opinion about Muslim integration, without being labeled with a negative "racist"

How can we even think that people from North Africa and the Middle East can integrate in the west - on a larger scale. It's impossible, just like it's impossible for us to integrate in for example Iraq.

[deleted_user]

I this very thread I have been accused of being a racist, even though I have worked all my adult life abroad and married a woman from Asia!

This is the stalest non-defense defense against racist accusations there ever was. Not saying you are... but just so you know.

[Snuden]

Ok. Why?

[WickedCossack]

At least I can be 100% sure I'm not racist since my favourite aoe3 civ is India.

[Gendarme]

I bet you ally with the British almost every game for nothing but racist reasons.

[momuuu]

I think you can say the second attack is not terrorism depending on how you define terrorism. As in, I think there are legitemate definitions of terrorism that would make this into something that isnt terrorism.

[Goodspeed]

We should welcome and help those in need but once the danger is over in their own country, they should return home.

Both sides of this argument have merit. I respectfully disagree because I have seen integration work and believe there are no inherent problems with the concept, it's just very hard to get right especially for the receiving society. But I think this is a separate issue. By "we need to be the bigger person and take the blows" I didn't mean we should open our borders. I meant we shouldn't hold grudges, definitely shouldn't retaliate and we shouldn't look at our Muslim neighbours funny the day after an ISIS attack. They are probably more pissed off about it than we are, because they are the ones actually affected by it.

We need to stop blowing extremism out of proportion. There are much bigger issues facing the world. Imagine a Muslim extremist came up to you and said "I killed 10 infidels yesterday!". What do you think is the reaction they want to see? What is the reaction they don't want to see? A fucking shrug is what. You shrug, you tell them "good for you" and move the fuck along. That's what they definitely don't want to see.
When we let the fear and mistrust get to us, hate slowly but surely creeps its way into every corner of our world. Terrorists are not a threat to your life. McDonald's is a threat to your life. Terrorists are only a threat in that they induce irrational fear and hatred. Our media, politicians and the bulk of our society are playing right into their hands.

I have met war refugees from Iraq - IN Iraq! He was simply home on holiday, paid by the danish citizens tax money. What I was doing in Iraq? I was working on a project funded by the Danish government, building 3 new power plants for the Iraqi's. After completion we moved on to the next project, while the Iraqi's stripped the generators for copper. More money wasted.

That's what we do and must keep doing. Good on you and good on Denmark. We spend money to slowly nudge them towards our standard. It doesn't always pan out, and it's going to take a while because religion is a stubborn thing, but it's the best we can do. We are not doing nearly enough, and doing way too much to make it worse instead of better.

One of the main problems as I see it, is that we have to be so damn political correct all the time. The cartton strip posted by Dolan is a good example. I this very thread I have been accused of being a racist, even though I have worked all my adult life abroad and married a woman from Asia!

Yikes. So it's just whites and non-whites to you? If you respect Asians, surely you're covered for every other non-white race as well.

[lejend]

Really makes you think.

[yoqpasa]

[momuuu]

Arent 95% of those victims muslims too?

[Gendarme]

@lejend Be careful. You're close to stepping into the territory of the mother of all conspiracy theories. ESOC is not yet ready for that kind of discussions.

[CelticCrusader]

When will people realise that Islam is the problem. Its the ideology that is the problem, to be specific wahhabism. It s being exported everywhere and funded by Saudi Arabia. This country is one of the biggest human rights violators around. It's a disgrace they are on the un human rights council. We don't have problems with Jewish terrorists, or Sikh terrorists, just muslims . This guy probably would never of mowed down all these people if it wasn't for the multiple attacks on Brits, although I do not condone his actions, it only increases the risk of more attacks against innocent Brits.

To realise the extent of the problems we have a small percentage of muslims in the UK, only 4.4% , but they are responsible for nearly all terrorist attacks, and they are responsible for more sexual exploitation gangs. Now can you imagine if it was at 20% , 30% 40% ? How many attacks do you think will be carried out in the name of islam then ?

[Goodspeed]

When will people realise that Islam is the problem.

Organized religion, including Islam, is a problem. The damage Christianity has caused over the years is immeasurable.
Religion, especially extremism, dies where living standards improve. That's where our focus should be.