Garja wrote:Hmm, perhaps it's not phrased well. I mean if there is anything wrong with China is that its fortress is too good and colo too bad or it is the fattening nerf.
The latter does nerf fortress just as much as it nerfs colonial. And in any case it wasn't a proper nerf since it's one of China side bonus. The major impact was to allow China to camp for longer in base. Every other benefit was legit (easier to address early pressure, fluent spam in early fortress, etc.).
I'd rather consider more problematic the fact that all their fortress shipments are significantly above par. 10 skirms, 11 changdao, 5 meteor hammers, british intervention just to name the most blatant cases.
China FF is too strong compared to others. The only civ on same level is probably Germans, which is also incredibly strong in fortress.
China just needs better cav in colo. Steppes aren't even bad stat-wise. Maybe just some more HP. Keshiks perhaps need to be less expensive (their stats are exactly the same of Zambs). Also German consulate buff as suggested above is a nice way to buff China colonial.
The crate thing not only has facepalm logic but is also impactful. 100f means like 15 secs faster aging everytime China gets it. It's totally undeserved considering that a civ like India needs it way more.
Umm... Do you seriously think that China is on the same level with Germany? Have you ever played China in your life?
China is a decent civ on RE because other civs have less natural resources while China doesn't depend on them. China doesn't have a goon unit except for the manchu shipment and no way to mass a lot of skirms, so you rely on your melee surround. It is a civ that always ages up at 5 minutes and sits in the base while having a low eco and no map control to get an army. Many civilizations on EP (Ports, Spain, Dutch, Sioux) were significantly buffed while China was only nerfed lol. It is one of the least played civilizations and that is for a reason. Let's look at the matchups:
Aztec - China is too slow to hold the rush. In certain circumstances China can do well with CM but usually Aztec win.
Iroquois - colonial pressure with some units and an age up, China is dead.
Sioux - mass a lot of cav and skirms and win. Winnable for China, but mostly a coin flip because as China you want cav against skirm/cav and pure inf against cav spam, so you have to guess what to make.
Ports - hold the push, then outeco. Free map control against China is great for Ports.
Spain - China favoured, Spanish units are too weak compared to Chinese.
France - musk huss or age and hit and run a lot, hard but winnable for China but France was nerfed a lot so it is understandable.
Germany - age 3 Germany is just so much stronger, not really winnable.
Britain - free map control and great outeco.
Dutch - free 5 banks and a big mass that hit-and-runs the hell out of China.
Russia - make strelets, sit under TC, win games.
Ottomans - China favoured, but a jan rush can hurt a lot if unexpected.
India - India favoured, India can age up with great eco in this MU and use it's powerful age 3 units.
Japan - winnable for China but quite hard, we all know how strong Japan is if it is untouched for 9 minutes.
Ok, so we have 2 favoured matchups (against weak civs) and 3-4 winnable matchups. Now compare it to Britain or Germany that lose 1-2 matchups. China definitely deserves a hard nerf lol...
Regarding the 100 f thing, you completely ignore the fact that China always has to chop 100 wood to either get 3 vills and not 2 or to get a tp while sending 2 vills. I mean, China is arguably the slowest civ to age up to colonial, only India or Japan can age up later than China but they usually choose to age up before 5 minutes. It is logical and reasonable to get 100 f more when your opponent gets it too.