EP should fix this

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Spain yoqpasa
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EP should fix this

Post by yoqpasa »

Hi, I just wanted to point out a mistake that hasn't been fixed yet by EP. It's about some industrial upgrades for unique units such as ruyters, uhlans, lancers, etc. The upgrade info says it increases stats 10% but it increases 33-40%. Here some examples:

Dutch ruyters: base HP 168. After IV upgrade they get 224 (+33%)
Portuguese goons: base HP 240. After IV upgrade they get 320 (+33%)
French curaissers: base HP 500. after IV upgrade they get 700 (+40%)

I just ignored attack damage since I would need to round numbers.

This is what I mean just in case anyone didn't get it.

[spoiler=spoiler]
ruyt 10%.png
[/spoiler]
[spoiler=spoiler]
goon 10%.png
[/spoiler]
[spoiler=spoiler]
cuirs 10%.png
[/spoiler]
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Sweden Gendarme
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by Gendarme »

Don't you dare nerf cuirassiers @EAGLEMUT!
Pay more attention to detail.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by momuuu »

I think you're mistakenly taking veteran stats as base stats for goons and ruyters. Gendarmes do scale off of veteran stats though.
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Italy gamevideo113
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by gamevideo113 »

Yeah those units get +33% because they scale with base stats while cuirassiers scale with veteran stats. I think OP was asking to fix the tooltip though.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by yoqpasa »

momuuu wrote:I think you're mistakenly taking veteran stats as base stats for goons and ruyters. Gendarmes do scale off of veteran stats though.


Ok let's take goons for example.

Age 2 goons have 200 HP (with team early dragoon's card)
Age 3 goons have 240 HP, which is 20% more
Age 4 goons have 320 HP, which is 33% more than age 3 and 60% more than age 1 ones.

So industrial goons have 33% more stats than age 3 goons and 60% more stats than base ones. Definetly not 10% .
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New Zealand zoom
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by zoom »

1. They all provide +40% of base attack and hitpoints.
2. I agree they should be updated to better or more clearly reflect "1".
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by yoqpasa »

And by the way this post is not about nerfing IV cuirs to +33% or buffing goons to +40% (which can be also useful in order to balance next patches), it's more about fixing the info.
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Re: EP should fix this

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Post by lemmings121 »

actually, you are missreading the tooltip. it says add +10% AND sets guards stats to active. guard stats is +30%.
those are the special 1k/1k guard upgrades that gives +40% instead of the standard +30% for the 600/600.
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Re: EP should fix this

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Post by lemmings121 »

200 + 20% = 240 (veteran)
200+ (20%+30%) = 300 (guard)
200+ (20%+30%+10%) = 320 (royal guard, special units)
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by zoom »

lemmings121 wrote:actually, you are missreading the tooltip. it says add +10% AND sets guards stats to active. guard stats is +30%.
those are the special 1k/1k guard upgrades that gives +40% instead of the standard +30% for the 600/600.
I'm pretty sure the tooltip is misinformative, to one extent or another.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by momuuu »

yoqpasa wrote:
momuuu wrote:I think you're mistakenly taking veteran stats as base stats for goons and ruyters. Gendarmes do scale off of veteran stats though.


Ok let's take goons for example.

Age 2 goons have 200 HP (with team early dragoon's card)
Age 3 goons have 240 HP, which is 20% more
Age 4 goons have 320 HP, which is 33% more than age 3 and 60% more than age 1 ones.

So industrial goons have 33% more stats than age 3 goons and 60% more stats than base ones. Definetly not 10% .

If going by the way all percentage upgrades are defined, then it's 40%. Otherwise, you should start complaining about all upgrades in the game. 15% combat cards don't give 15% stats to veteran units, the imperial upgrades don't give 50% stats to industrial units, and most other guard upgrades aren't effectively 30% compared to base stats.

This one is effectively 40%. It's basically normal guard (30%) plus a 10% bonus. It should thus be changed to 40%
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by Hazza54321 »

guard + 10% = royal guard
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by momuuu »

lemmings121 wrote:actually, you are missreading the tooltip. it says add +10% AND sets guards stats to active. guard stats is +30%.
those are the special 1k/1k guard upgrades that gives +40% instead of the standard +30% for the 600/600.

Wow you're actually right. As a kid I always considered these upgrades to be bad haha.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by zoom »

I think the point is that it should say simply "increases X attack and hitpoints by 40%."
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by yoqpasa »

zoom wrote:I think the point is that it should say simply "increases X attack and hitpoints by 40%."


Exactly, imagine a new player thinking ¿Why should I spend 2k resources on 10% upgrade?
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by momuuu »

yoqpasa wrote:
zoom wrote:I think the point is that it should say simply "increases X attack and hitpoints by 40%."


Exactly, imagine a new player thinking ¿Why should I spend 2k resources on 10% upgrade?

Imagine a new player playing EP.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by princeofcarthage »

It's because the way it is coded, it seems rather stupid cuz they just had to put attack for 40% instead of 10%, they are going write whole code for 10% anyways, was just matter of putting different value. Instead they added a whole new different line of code for implementing guard + 10%.
Fine line to something great is a strange change.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by yoqpasa »

momuuu wrote:
yoqpasa wrote:
zoom wrote:I think the point is that it should say simply "increases X attack and hitpoints by 40%."


Exactly, imagine a new player thinking ¿Why should I spend 2k resources on 10% upgrade?

Imagine a new player playing EP.


Touché
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by zoom »

princeofcarthage wrote:It's because the way it is coded, it seems rather stupid cuz they just had to put attack for 40% instead of 10%, they are going write whole code for 10% anyways, was just matter of putting different value. Instead they added a whole new different line of code for implementing guard + 10%.
Of course, but the description could easily be changed, I reckon.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by Kaiserklein »

yoqpasa wrote:Hi, I just wanted to point out a mistake that hasn't been fixed yet by EP. It's about some industrial upgrades for unique units such as ruyters, uhlans, lancers, etc. The upgrade info says it increases stats 10% but it increases 33-40%. Here some examples:

Dutch ruyters: base HP 168. After IV upgrade they get 224 (+33%)
Portuguese goons: base HP 240. After IV upgrade they get 320 (+33%)
French curaissers: base HP 500. after IV upgrade they get 700 (+40%)

This is just because you actually research 2 upgrades for royal guard units: the regular guard upgrade + the royal guard. You can even see in the in-game chat that both upgrades are researched, I think. So you research a 30% upgrade + a 10% upgrade, and the game probably just displays the 10% one in the military building. I guess it's just some text in a xml tag that can be fixed very easily. It's true it's not as clear as it should.

On a side note: when aoe talks about %, it's always scaling off base stats (except for a couple weird exceptions like teepees, golden pavillion...). So it's always 40% there, not 33%. There is indeed a difference in fact, because cuirs (and some other units) are shadow-teched to veteran, so basically every upgrade they get is 20% more efficient than on regular units, since their base stats are 20% higher than they should. But that's another issue.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by princeofcarthage »

zoom wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:It's because the way it is coded, it seems rather stupid cuz they just had to put attack for 40% instead of 10%, they are going write whole code for 10% anyways, was just matter of putting different value. Instead they added a whole new different line of code for implementing guard + 10%.
Of course, but the description could easily be changed, I reckon.

Not really regardless of what you do, it will still show
"Guard statues set to active"
"Unit X changes hit points by 15%"
"whatever other effects"

That's because this information is direct output of what tech does, and changes as you change values. This is most likely hard coded into exe file or uses some kind of call function to receive specific value and then have a specific output. This is probably done because of variable effects tech can have. My bet is it's hard coded. So you will have to change basic code itself to 40% and remove the guard upgrade code for your desired output.

"Portuguese dragoon attack and hit points greatly increased" is something which is called from string table and hence can be easily edited.
Fine line to something great is a strange change.
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Re: EP should fix this

Post by zoom »

princeofcarthage wrote:
zoom wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:It's because the way it is coded, it seems rather stupid cuz they just had to put attack for 40% instead of 10%, they are going write whole code for 10% anyways, was just matter of putting different value. Instead they added a whole new different line of code for implementing guard + 10%.
Of course, but the description could easily be changed, I reckon.

Not really regardless of what you do, it will still show
"Guard statues set to active"
"Unit X changes hit points by 15%"
"whatever other effects"

That's because this information is direct output of what tech does, and changes as you change values. This is most likely hard coded into exe file or uses some kind of call function to receive specific value and then have a specific output. This is probably done because of variable effects tech can have. My bet is it's hard coded. So you will have to change basic code itself to 40% and remove the guard upgrade code for your desired output.

"Portuguese dragoon attack and hit points greatly increased" is something which is called from string table and hence can be easily edited.
Oh, I didn't realize. Thanks!

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