Should russia get a buff?

Should russia get a buff in the fp?

Yes
37
56%
No
29
44%
 
Total votes: 66

Australia Hazza54321
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

you can go 14v with market, you have to 17v with tp
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by momuuu »

gibson wrote:
zoom wrote:How is it a wasted shipment if its the only thing ensuring you dont lose the game straight away??
because when have you ever played as Russia and had someone go 100% cav against you? This is all completely hypothetical, as no one goes 100% cav.
Go test it out then, because its completely bullshit aswell.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by zoom »

gibson wrote:
zoom wrote:Virtually every single time for the first few minutes. Any good player with opens pure cavalry against Russians with the majority of civilizations In the odd case your opponent isnt opening with cavalry you can raid and its not a wasted shipment either.

You are just so far off logic here its remarkable...
Im just saying you cant know what your opponent is doing and If you dont raid with Cossack and your opponent doesnt push and the Cossack are just standing there a wasted shipment and you should have started crates and send Cossack for timing.
You get around that by scouting and having good awareness of your 5 Cossacks when you send them across the map so that you can turn back if there is any cavalry.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

its never a bad time to send 5 coss in age 2
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by gibson »

jerom wrote:
gibson wrote: because when have you ever played as Russia and had someone go 100% cav against you? This is all completely hypothetical, as no one goes 100% cav.
Go test it out then, because its completely bullshit aswell.

next time I see you online ill bash you with it
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by gibson »

hazza54321 wrote:its never a bad time to send 5 coss in age 2

there are times however when it''s better to ship crates first and then ship 5 Cossack for your push
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

gibson wrote:
hazza54321 wrote:its never a bad time to send 5 coss in age 2
there are times however when its better to ship crates first and then ship 5 Cossack for your push
yes but if you dont ship 5 coss 1st or 2nd vs a cav start of your opponent then you basically lose to all the idle time, as you cant deal with raids effectively, it basically saves you the game early
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Jaeger »

gibson wrote:
jerom wrote:The anti cav shit. Come on, you are smarter than that.
My mommy said Im smart. But seriously, theyre not good as all. They trade cost effectively with cav if and only if all the musk are in hand combat, in which case the cav just leave. If you have like 20 musk vs 10 hussar, like 3 of the musk will be in had combat doing 30 damage, while the rest of them will be doing a pathetic 18 damage. Meanwhile, a hussar kills a musk in 4 hits, has 320 hp so it takes 11 musket jabs to kill him and and an insane 18 musket shots. that means if you have any less then 18 musket , they can all shoot and not 1 hussar will die. These numbers arent quite accurate because Im unsure of the resists of either unit, but it cant possibly get better for russia counting in resists. Ive never actually tried it, primarily because the two civs I play the most are russia and japan, but Im pretty confident that a civ like german or french can go 100% cav no age III and just beat russia. I mean german will have 7 uhlan when russia has 5 musk and french will have 5 hussar when russia has 5 musk. You can win that as germany loosing only 1 uhlan and as french without loosing a hussar. Then when the next batch of musk pop its 10 huss vs 5 musk or 13 uhlan vs 5 musk. At that point youve lost because you wont be able to gather more than 3 feet from your tc, you have no military shipment to help clean up cav, and you dont have the eco to make more than 1 batch of musk at a time.
At least for french, your cossacks should be in his base before he finishes 5 huss, so you might be able to idle him enough to only get 4 out. With germany, its gonna be pretty even. Anyway theyre gonna chase your cossacks, until your 5 musk show up. Then theyre gonna run away. So you can keep track of where their cav is, because once they run away you can start cashing them with cossacks. You have to play this cat and mouse game which tbh its much harder to do with musk coss rather than with pure coss, but with good micro u should be ok. And I think you should be really happy if they stay colonial longer and make more cav. Also dont be afraid to use minutemen when they raid your TC, and from your 700w you can make a BH on your next hunt and can already start to move some vills there.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by fei123456 »

garja wrote:
paul wrote:yeah they semiff but then? longbow beats skirm and kills war wagonand dragoon easily. strelet lose to skirm and cant aim war wagon at all due to their range. hussar = uhlan. cossack lose to uhan (semiff wont send boyar and cossack without boyar sux).
Strelets beat skirms and cossack are better than ulhans. Its likely tho that Germans will have shit tons of units because their semi ff is too good.

if you have tons of strelet it may beat skirm. but how can a semiff russia mass cossack and strelet at 10:00? also, these two units suck without boyar.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by momuuu »

I like either fixed 200w (although fixed crate starts are occasionally pretty unfair, since that means they do start with 100 extra crates sometimes) or +100 coin for early market possibilities.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

jerom wrote:I like either fixed 200w (although fixed crate starts are occasionally pretty unfair, since that means they do start with 100 extra crates sometimes) or +100 coin for early market possibilities.

instead of an extra vill or hunting dogs at start, then giving russia the option to gather for hunting dogs seems fair, surely its worth testing
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by momuuu »

hazza54321 wrote:
jerom wrote:I like either fixed 200w (although fixed crate starts are occasionally pretty unfair, since that means they do start with 100 extra crates sometimes) or +100 coin for early market possibilities.
instead of an extra vill or hunting dogs at start, then giving russia the option to gather for hunting dogs seems fair, surely its worth testing
Although I must say I am not quite so convinced that russia needs a buff at all. They do fairly well I guess, I could kinda find myself in Garjas analysis of the mus, except for the fact that I think he overrated almsot every mu just slightly. I guess they might still be the bottom civ, but hey, theres always gonna be a bottom civ.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

jerom wrote:
hazza54321 wrote: instead of an extra vill or hunting dogs at start, then giving russia the option to gather for hunting dogs seems fair, surely its worth testing
Although I must say I am not quite so convinced that russia needs a buff at all. They do fairly well I guess, I could kinda find myself in Garjas analysis of the mus, except for the fact that I think he overrated almsot every mu just slightly. I guess they might still be the bottom civ, but hey, theres always gonna be a bottom civ.
yeah but the thing is dutch was only slightly worse than russia on re, but they get a massive buff and everyones going on about changing little things. It shouldnt really annoy me but it does lol im sorry
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by momuuu »

hazza54321 wrote:
jerom wrote:Although I must say I am not quite so convinced that russia needs a buff at all. They do fairly well I guess, I could kinda find myself in Garjas analysis of the mus, except for the fact that I think he overrated almsot every mu just slightly. I guess they might still be the bottom civ, but hey, theres always gonna be a bottom civ.
yeah but the thing is dutch was only slightly worse than russia on re, but they get a massive buff and everyones going on about changing little things. It shouldnt really annoy me but it does lol im sorry
Im also not sure Dutch was slightly worse than russia. Theyd lose vs Iro, Otto, Aztec, Sioux, India, China, Japan, British, Germany, Spain, France, and be even with russia (if not lose it, I am completely unsure), and slightly edge out ports. Thats much worse than russia really. I guess if you are really optimistic, Otto, Sioux, India and France are like 55/45 mus? Not to forget that I feel like Spain and Germany are like 20/80 mus and Brits, Japan and Azzie are close to 30/70 or something. I am convinced thats really in a different tier of badness than russia is.

You could be slightly bothered by the spain buffs.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by zoom »

hazza54321 wrote:
jerom wrote:Although I must say I am not quite so convinced that russia needs a buff at all. They do fairly well I guess, I could kinda find myself in Garjas analysis of the mus, except for the fact that I think he overrated almsot every mu just slightly. I guess they might still be the bottom civ, but hey, theres always gonna be a bottom civ.
yeah but the thing is dutch was only slightly worse than russia on re, but they get a massive buff and everyones going on about changing little things. It shouldnt really annoy me but it does lol im sorry

Dutch has not received a massive buff. Please stop talking based on your unfounded theories and have some faith in the bigger nerds play-testing results.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by momuuu »

zoom wrote:Dutch has not received a massive buff. Please stop talking from your personal theories and have some faith in the bigger nerds'' play-testing results.
True aswell. The buff is rather minor, and I have barely felt the effect of it in my games.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

zoom wrote:
hazza54321 wrote:yeah but the thing is dutch was only slightly worse than russia on re, but they get a massive buff and everyones going on about changing little things. It shouldnt really annoy me but it does lol im sorry
Dutch has not received a massive buff. Please stop talking based on your unfounded theories and have some faith in the bigger nerds play-testing results.
having 2 better than age 4 cards in age 1 is insane, as well as more xp from banks. however, 6 bank build limit is a small buff yeah
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by momuuu »

hazza54321 wrote:
zoom wrote:Dutch has not received a massive buff. Please stop talking based on your unfounded theories and have some faith in the bigger nerds play-testing results.
having 2 better than age 4 cards in age 1 is insane, as well as more xp from banks. however, 6 bank build limit is a small buff yeah

the bank cards is a fairly small buff as well. Realistically they are decent age 2 cards that would have to compete for a spot in my decks. Kinda like 4 vill shipments, mediocre cards.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Garja »

In my personal view of things the buff is quite substanctial but not very well aimed.
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Post by Papist »

hazza54321 wrote:maybe considering a fixed 200w start so russia as the option to go market rather than coin start
What would be more valuable to Russia - a market or a tp? Both would make for some interesting gameplay.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by Hazza54321 »

papist wrote:
hazza54321 wrote:maybe considering a fixed 200w start so russia as the option to go market rather than coin start
What would be more valuable to Russia - a market or a tp? Both would make for some interesting gameplay.
i think a tp, especially if you plan to upgrade them if not then hunting dogs. early hunting dogs is very good
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Post by Jaeger »

jerom wrote:
hazza54321 wrote:yeah but the thing is dutch was only slightly worse than russia on re, but they get a massive buff and everyones going on about changing little things. It shouldnt really annoy me but it does lol im sorry
Im also not sure Dutch was slightly worse than russia. Theyd lose vs Iro, Otto, Aztec, Sioux, India, China, Japan, British, Germany, Spain, France, and be even with russia (if not lose it, I am completely unsure), and slightly edge out ports. Thats much worse than russia really. I guess if you are really optimistic, Otto, Sioux, India and France are like 55/45 mus? Not to forget that I feel like Spain and Germany are like 20/80 mus and Brits, Japan and Azzie are close to 30/70 or something. I am convinced thats really in a different tier of badness than russia is.

You could be slightly bothered by the spain buffs.
I think Dutch beats Russia pretty handily on RE
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by iNcog »

I think that Russia past a certain point becomes a great civ. It's their start which is sub-optimal, or slow, and they would maybe just need a small nudge to make their early-game more easy overall.

For example, BH could give 10 pop instead of 5. A small buff, with a niche role, which is nonetheless an early-game boost. That would maybe be more reasonable than upping Strelet range, giving them an extra starting villager or free hunting dogs.
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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by deleted_user0 »

incog wrote:I think that Russia past a certain point becomes a great civ. It''s their start which is sub-optimal, or slow, and they would maybe just need a small nudge to make their early-game more easy overall.

For example, BH could give 10 pop instead of 5. A small buff, with a niche role, which is nonetheless an early-game boost. That would maybe be more reasonable than upping Strelet range, giving them an extra starting villager or free hunting dogs.
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Should russia get a buff?

Post by iNcog »

somppukunkku wrote:
incog wrote:I think that Russia past a certain point becomes a great civ. Its their start which is sub-optimal, or slow, and they would maybe just need a small nudge to make their early-game more easy overall.

For example, BH could give 10 pop instead of 5. A small buff, with a niche role, which is nonetheless an early-game boost. That would maybe be more reasonable than upping Strelet range, giving them an extra starting villager or free hunting dogs.
inb4 6 blockhouse fortification in 7 minutes


Well, see thats the thing with Russia.

Careful with what you boost because maybe it would be too strong.

Isnt 6 BH fortification already viable? Just throw them down on enemy hunts, gg.
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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.

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