Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Make Cass to 'nilla Cass?

Yes
11
38%
No
9
31%
Yes, but make some minor changes
9
31%
 
Total votes: 29

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Canada forgrin
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by forgrin »

Cassadors (Portuguese skirmishers) used to be quite a unique unit back in Vanilla days. However, they were "standardised" back in TWCs and have just been "meh" ever since. Stats wise:

Today's Cass
-110hp
-17atk
-%50rr
-4.5speed
-3.0 Rate of Fire (standard).
-20 range

Vanilla Cass
-85hp
-26atk
-%60rr (edited, thought it was %50)
-4.5speed
-4.5 Rate of Fire (slower than usual).
-20 range

As you can see, Vanilla Cass were much more unique in their "glass cannon" style, and had strongly defined strengths and weaknesses. They were especially strong when fighting other skirm-units and heavy infantry, but could be punished much stronger by cav and artillery.

It's perhaps important to note that this style of Cass is more historically accurate. Cacadores, translating to "hunters," were elite units typically armed with rifled weapons and reknown for their marksmanship. Rifles at the time took longer to reload, but were much more accurate than muskets.

In game, these units were especially strong when well micro'd and were very rewarding units to those who learned how to use them. However, left without anticav, or left without micro, they were significantly weaker.

I think it's been very interesting to return at least some of these attributes while bringing out some uniqueness and historical accuracy as well.
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France [Armag] diarouga
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

That's interesting imo but don't forget they were better vs cav coz of nilla's dumbness.
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Canada forgrin
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by forgrin »

diarouga wrote:That''s interesting imo but don''t forget they were better vs cav coz of nilla''s dumbness.


Yeah forgot about multipliers, would probably slap the TAD multipliers on the ''nilla stats, but I don''t know how that''s test.
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New Zealand zoom
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by zoom »

Again, 4.5 RoF might be interesting. The other changes aren't IMO.
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Canada forgrin
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by forgrin »

zoom wrote:Again, 4.5 RoF might be interesting. The other changes aren''t IMO.


Slower RoF with increased damage? Because just slower RoF is a straight up DPS nerf.
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New Zealand zoom
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by zoom »

Yes, that's the idea...
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No Flag Jaeger
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Jaeger »

zoom wrote:Yes, that''s the idea...
Why would you want to nerf cassadores? I think 26 attack with slower ROF is an excellent idea
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by momuuu »

ovi12 wrote:
zoom wrote:Yes, thats the idea...
Why would you want to nerf cassadores? I think 26 attack with slower ROF is an excellent idea

I think you all want the same thing. Same dps, slower rof. It suits the unit really.
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France [Armag] diarouga
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

They would be better to hit and run but they would overkill.
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No Flag Jaeger
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Jaeger »

diarouga wrote:They would be better to hit and run but they would overkill.
Higher skillcap, always a good thing
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Netherlands Mr_Bramboy
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Mr_Bramboy »

Didn't they have 60% ranged resist on vanilla?
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Canada forgrin
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by forgrin »

bramboy wrote:Didn''t they have 60% ranged resist on vanilla?


Yup, they did, wiki lied to me :p will edit it in
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China fei123456
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by fei123456 »

abus has 3.5rof 40atk and bombard attack which ignore your 60% rr.
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Canada forgrin
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by forgrin »

paul wrote:abus has 3.5rof 40atk and bombard attack which ignore your 60% rr.


So...? They still die in 3 hits with 85hp, just with more overkill. Even better for Ports.
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by anonymousv2 »

Here are the stats I think Cassadors should have. They keep the Vanilla intent, but make them more similar to Skirm.

My Cassadors
-100 hp
-23 attack
-50% rr
-4.5 speed
-4 ROF
-20 range
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Italy Garja
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Garja »

I much prefer the TAD version of cassas. If they were like nilla I wouldn't play ports a single time.
Beisdes TAD cassas are arguably better.
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Netherlands momuuu
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by momuuu »

garja wrote:I much prefer the TAD version of cassas. If they were like nilla I wouldn''t play ports a single time.

this statement would have more value if you tried to elaborate why you wouldnt play ports then.
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New Zealand zoom
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by zoom »

That's a valid point, but go to fucking bed already instead of spawn-camping this place, insta-replying to everything without giving posters a fair chance to edit, Jerom!
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Italy Garja
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Garja »

jerom wrote:
garja wrote:I much prefer the TAD version of cassas. If they were like nilla I wouldnt play ports a single time.
this statement would have more value if you tried to elaborate why you wouldnt play ports then.
because 4.5 rof sucks. For one, the more flashy the game the better it is
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Papist »

zoom wrote:Again, 4.5 RoF might be interesting. The other changes aren''t IMO.
You think Ports need a nerf? Are you sadistic or something? >':D
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Netherlands momuuu
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by momuuu »

zoom wrote:That''s a valid point, but go to fucking bed already instead of spawn-camping this place, insta-replying to everything without giving posters a fair chance to edit, Jerom!

okay, gn.
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by lordraphael »

zoom wrote:Again, 4.5 RoF might be interesting. The other changes aren''t IMO.
dont abus guns have 4.5 rof now ? and they have 40 SIEGE DMG sounds quite bad to me having a unit with 26 dmg and 4.5 rof when there is another unit which only slightly more but has like almnost double the dmg and hp of the first one :)
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by pikadasgalaxias »

If the settler back to cost 100 food, fine ...
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Canada forgrin
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by forgrin »

pikadasgalaxias wrote:If the settler back to cost 100 food, fine ...
Try playing Ports on the RE patch at a high level, then say that... you don''t get it lol.
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Revert Cassadors back to 'Nilla standard

Post by Kaiserklein »

I really prefer nilla ca?as indeed, because they are so different from skirms. They are just harder to micro, because they are paper thin vs cav and they overkill more. Tad ca?as might be better overall, because way more hp, almost same dps, and only 10% less rr, but if you abuse the kiting potential of nilla ca?as they are really great. Just much funnier to micro
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