ESOC new UI?

Netherlands momuuu
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by momuuu »

We could also say that talent is an unfair advantage aswell etc. You can nitpick on all the little things there are. For example having a better computer with better framerate is cheating. Imo an UI, like ekanta's, just makes the experience much better which is all we'd want.
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Italy Garja
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by Garja »

Not really, you cannot nitpick stuff, there is a pretty clear line between what alters the game and what not. Talent doesn't have nothing to do with the tools provided by the game.
UI makes the experience better in some cases but they have drawbacks. Some facilitations are just bad for the game like for example seeing all the screen with the trasparent UI.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by Dolan »

Garja wrote:Not really, you cannot nitpick stuff, there is a pretty clear line between what alters the game and what not. Talent doesn't have nothing to do with the tools provided by the game.
UI makes the experience better in some cases but they have drawbacks. Some facilitations are just bad for the game like for example seeing all the screen with the trasparent UI.

External stuff like DPI-modifying software and mechanical keyboards also have an effect on gameplay.
Btw, the ESOC patch was not shipped with the game, it's not standard, it alters the game too, except everyone has it. But not everyone has that pro hardware or other esoteric shit like DPI software.
Compared to that, some UI with the same standard functions but with a little optimised layout is insignificant. You still have to get used to it in time, it's not an immediate advantage, if at all. You just see a bit more map, but then again, moreso can you if you have some superwide display aspect ratio.

And no, the game wasn't made for 16:9, the resolutions you see in game actually are a gamut of choices which include 4:3 and 16:9 resolutions. 4:3 monitors were the most common back in mid 2000s. I know because I had an Iiyama back then with 4:3 ratio. At small differences between aspect ratios differences are small, but if someone has a 21:9 screen, I'm sure they can see a lot more in one screen per width. At that aspect, the game ain't gonna get stretched on width, it will just show more game content in one screen.
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Italy Garja
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by Garja »

I didn't say effect on the gameplay. I clearly meant modify the game files. DPI is a phisical carachteristic of each mouse. You don't even need an external software to change it. Just buy another mouse with different native DPI. There is simply not one universal mouse that everyone should use so it's not the same thing as the UI officially provided by the game.

ESOC patch is ofc a mod in that sense. We would have made it official if it was possible. Or rather we would play on the RE patch (we did for years) if patches kept being released.
Any balance patch implies that some players claim to know what's better. It's not a neutral process in that sense. Others can or cannot adhere to what those players think. It is clearly unofficial and that is made pretty clear.
The effect on the gameplay really isn't an argument in what I'm saying. It's just another topic. Sure, UI often don't carry an unfair udvantage and that's why they're tolerated more or less. This doesn't mean we should encourage questionable game facilitations. It isn't even true that all new games have transparent or very minimal UIs. SC2 has a very standard UI for players.

I'm pretty sure that 16:9 is the default aspect ratio since other games (AOE2 for example) weren't optimized for widescreen monitors and need the HD remake to work that way. AOE3 never needed a remake to work with 16:9. Perhaps they patched it along the way I don't know.
At 21:9 you probably see bit more on the sides but 2 black bars on top and bottom.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by momuuu »

Im pretty sure I saw a pic of someone playing on 3 monitors, seeing 3 monitors of map lol. That might have been a mod or me misinterpreting the picture but I still remember it vividly. That person was adam actually.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by Garja »

Ye multiple monitors should let you see more maps. That's sort of cheating.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by thebritish »

Jerom wrote:Im pretty sure I saw a pic of someone playing on 3 monitors, seeing 3 monitors of map lol. That might have been a mod or me misinterpreting the picture but I still remember it vividly. That person was adam actually.

This is how i play the game: Image
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by thebritish »

Mimsy for President wrote:What you guys think of this one ? I slightly edited jammainen's UI because it had nilla aspect.

TOP : normal UI

BOTTOM : custom UI
24 = LOS
29 = Training time
Resists and Speed should be on the right but I didn't spend too much of my time on this.

uiunitselectionmin.xml
It only works with TAD and messes up nilla's UI.

I want to see how this UI looks ingame.
Where should i put the file you uploaded?
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by Mimsy for President »

thebritish wrote:
Mimsy for President wrote:What you guys think of this one ? I slightly edited jammainen's UI because it had nilla aspect.

TOP : normal UI

BOTTOM : custom UI
24 = LOS
29 = Training time
Resists and Speed should be on the right but I didn't spend too much of my time on this.

uiunitselectionmin.xml
It only works with TAD and messes up nilla's UI.

I want to see how this UI looks ingame.
Where should i put the file you uploaded?
data folder in Program Files. If you don't want to use it because you wanna play nilla or whatever, rename it by adding any letter or number like 1uiunitselectionmin.xml or zuiunitselectionmin.xml etc. Thus, you keep it there in case you want to use it again ;)
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by thebritish »

Mimsy for President wrote:
thebritish wrote:
Mimsy for President wrote:What you guys think of this one ? I slightly edited jammainen's UI because it had nilla aspect.

TOP : normal UI

BOTTOM : custom UI
24 = LOS
29 = Training time
Resists and Speed should be on the right but I didn't spend too much of my time on this.

uiunitselectionmin.xml
It only works with TAD and messes up nilla's UI.

I want to see how this UI looks ingame.
Where should i put the file you uploaded?
data folder in Program Files. If you don't want to use it because you wanna play nilla or whatever, rename it by adding any letter or number like 1uiunitselectionmin.xml or zuiunitselectionmin.xml etc. Thus, you keep it there in case you want to use it again ;)

ok, thanks
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by musketeer925 »

@jerom I just did the three monitors to figure out how to do it. I didn't really intend to use it much haha.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by iNcog »

I want a new UI v_v
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Garja wrote: ↑
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by tilanus »

  • - Offer the most popular UI mods in the ESOC patch as options
  • - Everyone being able to use exactly the same UIs removes the argument of granting an unfair advantage and can thus no longer considered be a cheat.
  • - The use of unfeatured, way too informative - prohibited - UIs should (and can) be banned in a similar way like cheats (that's an advantage in any case btw)
  • - The community and ESOC team has to decide whether they want to display additional information or not. And if so, how much.
  • - If you display additional information, you must show it in all available UI options, because knowledge beats layout (UI layouts can be different, but knowledge needs to be equal; an exception being minimalistic UIs - which is then a concious player decision and nothing an enemy can be blamed for)
  • - The core idea should be to optimize the display/layout of the currently shown game data and not make enemies naked/transparent
  • - Insisting on using outdated UIs fails the patch's objective to improve the competitive multiplayer experience of AoE3 (and any other game)
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by iNcog »

Agreed. Looks like i get another member for my syndicate. :idea:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/incog_aoe
Garja wrote: ↑
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by thebritish »

tilanus wrote:
  • - Offer the most popular UI mods in the ESOC patch as options
  • - Everyone being able to use exactly the same UIs removes the argument of granting an unfair advantage and can thus no longer considered be a cheat.
  • - The use of unfeatured, way too informative - prohibited - UIs should (and can) be banned in a similar way like cheats (that's an advantage in any case btw)
  • - The community and ESOC team has to decide whether they want to display additional information or not. And if so, how much.
  • - If you display additional information, you must show it in all available UI options, because knowledge beats layout (UI layouts can be different, but knowledge needs to be equal; an exception being minimalistic UIs - which is then a concious player decision and nothing an enemy can be blamed for)
  • - The core idea should be to optimize the display/layout of the currently shown game data and not make enemies naked/transparent
  • - Insisting on using outdated UIs fails the patch's objective to improve the competitive multiplayer experience of AoE3 (and any other game)

I cant understand what do you mean by the sentence i checked.. Can you please explain?
-Also +1 for adding your vote for ESOC UI for the patch
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by momuuu »

tilanus wrote:
  • - Offer the most popular UI mods in the ESOC patch as options
  • - Everyone being able to use exactly the same UIs removes the argument of granting an unfair advantage and can thus no longer considered be a cheat.
  • - The use of unfeatured, way too informative - prohibited - UIs should (and can) be banned in a similar way like cheats (that's an advantage in any case btw)
  • - The community and ESOC team has to decide whether they want to display additional information or not. And if so, how much.
  • - If you display additional information, you must show it in all available UI options, because knowledge beats layout (UI layouts can be different, but knowledge needs to be equal; an exception being minimalistic UIs - which is then a concious player decision and nothing an enemy can be blamed for)
  • - The core idea should be to optimize the display/layout of the currently shown game data and not make enemies naked/transparent
  • - Insisting on using outdated UIs fails the patch's objective to improve the competitive multiplayer experience of AoE3 (and any other game)

good post, +1

Although Im honestly not even decided if more information makes it better. I know dolan/neuron started working on an epic UI before he quit, dont think he'll finish it now.. I could make a concept of what I'd consider nice but not sure if that'd be helpful at all since that'd be a paint concept lol.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by iNcog »

Make it, I want to see it.
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/incog_aoe
Garja wrote: ↑
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by Aizamk »

The AoE3 UI is fairly hardcoded in some instances, so there's quite a lot of limitations on what can and can't be done (e.g. with regards to how much you can separate different things such as unit stances in a separate UI, or with the amount of info shown on-screen). I believe Neuron mentioned a few of these problems in his thread.
oranges.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by iCourt »

Rikikipu wrote:The main problem with the UI is that, a custom UI is still considered as a cheat (i remembered H20 talking about it in his stream). That's why for instance, UI's weren't allowed for tourneys.
But what about getting a better/HD user interface when you are online on eso servers (seeing games, talking with people etc) ? I think that images and design there look so old....


It's Not a Cheat

It just was never allowed in tournaments. I believe ES_Paragon used the Ekanta UI.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by thebritish »

The post you requested cannot be found or no longer exists. The administrator or moderator may have deleted the post.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by iCourt »

Fixed link.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by musketeer925 »

I'm currently working on a framework that allows switching in the Spectator UI, among some other things. It could easily be extended to support other UI's.
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Re: ESOC new UI?

Post by iCourt »

musketeer925 wrote:I'm currently working on a framework that allows switching in the Spectator UI, among some other things. It could easily be extended to support other UI's.


It's easy to add to a drop down menu. I had a similar option on the Mac Fan Patches at one point.

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