Grenadiers

[medinos]

Can you make them possible to even be cost effective ?
Like to make them playable I mean they take long to train and all...

Well ESO-C devs any ideas about that ?

[Kaiserklein]

Really just remove this awkward animation and they might just become viable. Because at the moment if you manage to come in range of enemy infantry, the time for you to use your grenadiers 1 time and the guy can just run. Even in colonial age musks are just more mobile, and overall skirms/goons way way better to micro.
This, or remove the HI tag which is making them so bad against skirms

[thebritish]

i guess you have never seen 50 imperial grenadiers vs 50 imperial skirms. the fact that grenadiers have 50% RR means they own skirms np.
The secret to grenadiers is that they have to be in high numbers, also you cant kite grenadiers so easily because once they get in range, by the time you get out, you will lose atleast 5-6 skirms.
grenadiers are like bow units (they can hit units which are out of their range if they set up their animation before the enemy units gets out of range)

[gh0st]

i guess you have never seen 50 imperial grenadiers vs 50 imperial skirms.

how exactly do you see that fight comming? unless you talking about treaty stuff which isnt the topic i think!

[lordraphael]

Really just remove this awkward animation and they might just become viable. Because at the moment if you manage to come in range of enemy infantry, the time for you to use your grenadiers 1 time and the guy can just run. Even in colonial age musks are just more mobile, and overall skirms/goons way way better to micro.
This, or remove the HI tag which is making them so bad against skirms

i dont even think changing the setup animations for units is even possible. I could imagine it being hardcoded and therefore unchangeable at least i havent seen any change being done to unit attack animations in any patch yet which is a decent indicator for it being not possible. If it was possible various units could be balanced via a change of setup animation namely cetan bows grens yumis ( i would give yumis a similar setup animation to lbs bcs as they are right now they feel to much like skirm unit types with their hit and run capability while having a much stronger attack than skirms have )

[thebritish]

i think you can fix the setup animation if you make it to end faster (ex. if the setup animation is 2.00 seconds, they could try to make it to be 1.50 seconds, while doing the same)

[Rikikipu]

i guess you have never seen 50 imperial grenadiers vs 50 imperial skirms. the fact that grenadiers have 50% RR means they own skirms np.
The secret to grenadiers is that they have to be in high numbers, also you cant kite grenadiers so easily because once they get in range, by the time you get out, you will lose atleast 5-6 skirms.
grenadiers are like bow units (they can hit units which are out of their range if they set up their animation before the enemy units gets out of range)

Kite?

[britishmusketeer]

I think just removing the HI tag

[Garja]

Gren buff is kinda marginal to balance. Also brit grens with ups are actually borderline OP.

[thebritish]

i guess you have never seen 50 imperial grenadiers vs 50 imperial skirms. the fact that grenadiers have 50% RR means they own skirms np.
The secret to grenadiers is that they have to be in high numbers, also you cant kite grenadiers so easily because once they get in range, by the time you get out, you will lose atleast 5-6 skirms.
grenadiers are like bow units (they can hit units which are out of their range if they set up their animation before the enemy units gets out of range)

Kite?

you cant kite forever

[Kaiserklein]

i guess you have never seen 50 imperial grenadiers vs 50 imperial skirms. the fact that grenadiers have 50% RR means they own skirms np.
The secret to grenadiers is that they have to be in high numbers, also you cant kite grenadiers so easily because once they get in range, by the time you get out, you will lose atleast 5-6 skirms.
grenadiers are like bow units (they can hit units which are out of their range if they set up their animation before the enemy units gets out of range)

You can actually kite almost forever against grens, because whenever they finally catch up with you they have that shit animation which slows them down so hard. So you might shoot them like 4-5 times with skirms before grens finally shoot, and then you can do that again...
Also, seeing the costs, it's more like 3 skirms vs 2 grens, so here 60 skirms vs 40 grens...

[thebritish]

I am not talking about the cost, i am talknig about 50 grenadiers vs 50 skirms

[deleted_user0]

Can you make them possible to even be cost effective ?
Like to make them playable I mean they take long to train and all...

Well ESO-C devs any ideas about that ?

i'd like grens either to be available in the barracks and kept as they are, as a siege unit. currently they arent used much because its not worth to make a foundry just for their siege potential. but if they are from the barracks, i can see them being made in small batches vs some civs such as japan or in some situations like vs turtles.

otherwise i'd like to see them remain in the foundtry but totally reworked. i could see a nice role for them as a tanky heavy infantry unit that is good at killing other heavy infantry. kinda like a Jaguar knight but with range instead. it would be good vs heavy infantry (have like a 1.5 bonus + splash, high hp and high RR) but be bad vs ranged infantry (because low range and a 0.75 malus or something vs ranged infantry) this would create a new dimension to musk huss battles or pure musk battles. where if one player would add grens to add musk, the other player could add longbow to kill the grens.

[deleted_user0]

Make them better and you basically make Russia tier 5 at the same time.

[Kaiserklein]

Make them better and you basically make Russia tier 5 at the same time.

They have grens tho

I am not talking about the cost, i am talknig about 50 grenadiers vs 50 skirms

But then it makes no sense ? 50 skirms vs 50 grenadiers isn't a fair fight. It's as dumb as saying "I guess you have never seen 50 heavy cannons vs 50 huss" to argue that artillery beats cav lol...
Anyway 50 skirms beat 50 grens easily

[thebritish]

Make them better and you basically make Russia tier 5 at the same time.

They have grens tho

I am not talking about the cost, i am talknig about 50 grenadiers vs 50 skirms

But then it makes no sense ? 50 skirms vs 50 grenadiers isn't a fair fight. It's as dumb as saying "I guess you have never seen 50 heavy cannons vs 50 huss" to argue that artillery beats cav lol...
Anyway 50 skirms beat 50 grens easily

so, you are saying that if the thing i am producing is more expensive that yours, you must have more things than i have?

[Kaiserklein]

Make them better and you basically make Russia tier 5 at the same time.

They have grens tho

I am not talking about the cost, i am talknig about 50 grenadiers vs 50 skirms

But then it makes no sense ? 50 skirms vs 50 grenadiers isn't a fair fight. It's as dumb as saying "I guess you have never seen 50 heavy cannons vs 50 huss" to argue that artillery beats cav lol...
Anyway 50 skirms beat 50 grens easily

so, you are saying that if the thing i am producing is more expensive that yours, you must have more things than i have?

I'm saying that if you want to see how good a unit does against another, you have to compare them with equal investments... What the fuck is wrong with you ?

[Hazza54321]

just make them trainable from the barracks

[thebritish]

the 3x multiplier skirms have gets neglected because 50% of their damage dissapears which comes to 1.5x multiplier

[Kaiserklein]

the 3x multiplier skirms have gets neglected because 50% of their damage dissapears which comes to 1.5x multiplier

What does it have to do with what we were saying ? And are you aware that skirms have a *2 multiplier vs HI, maybe you're again considering we play in age 5 ?
We should just try this really, since you don't seem to understand. Even if we do 50 skirms vs 50 grens, I will have probs 25 skirms left at the end. If we do a normal ratio, for example 30 skirms vs 20 grens, I guess I would still have 25 skirms left

[thebritish]

lol, thats what i said.
that 2x is 3x multiplier with the arsenal upgrade.
also, they have 50% resistance, so:
skirm has 30 attack, with 3x multiplier its 90, 50% RR, its 45.
45/30=1.5x multiplier.
grenadiers have siege damage, so the 30% RR skirms have becomes irrelevant.

=GET REKT=

[Kaiserklein]

lol, thats what i said.
that 2x is 3x multiplier with the arsenal upgrade.
also, they have 50% resistance, so:
skirm has 30 attack, with 3x multiplier its 90, 50% RR, its 45.
45/30=1.5x multiplier.
grenadiers have siege damage, so the 30% RR skirms have becomes irrelevant.

=GET REKT=

Could we please do something about this xD mods ? I mean, he doesn't have a clue and still pretends to be a pro, trying to teach everyone about everything, I'm tired. Shouldn't we all enjoy a small ban for thebritish so that we can have a bit of peace and he can meditate on himself a bit
thebritish you do know you get this arsenal upgrade approx 1 game out of 100 or less ? So why the fuck do you take it into account ? And who cares about this 1.5 multiplier, it's even easier to kill grens with skirms if you have it lol ???
And you think you're op to calculate stuff like 3 multiplied by 50% and find it does 1.5, but do you even know that skirms have base 15 attack ? Wtf man, why are you opening your mouth, you're spilling garbage everywhere

[thebritish]

lol, thats what i said.
that 2x is 3x multiplier with the arsenal upgrade.
also, they have 50% resistance, so:
skirm has 30 attack, with 3x multiplier its 90, 50% RR, its 45.
45/30=1.5x multiplier.
grenadiers have siege damage, so the 30% RR skirms have becomes irrelevant.

=GET REKT=

Could we please do something about this xD mods ? I mean, he doesn't have a clue and still pretends to be a pro, trying to teach everyone about everything, I'm tired. Shouldn't we all enjoy a small ban for thebritish so that we can have a bit of peace and he can meditate on himself a bit
thebritish you do know you get this arsenal upgrade approx 1 game out of 100 or less ? So why the fuck do you take it into account ? And who cares about this 1.5 multiplier, it's even easier to kill grens with skirms if you have it lol ???

you get this upgrade in 1 out of 100 games, not me. Also, don't be jealous.
Btw, i said that if you take out the RR with the multiplier, the multiplier isnt big, and i doubt that you can beat 400 HP grenadiers with 50% RR with 250 HP skirms. (we can test it if you think that you can win)

[Kaiserklein]

lol, thats what i said.
that 2x is 3x multiplier with the arsenal upgrade.
also, they have 50% resistance, so:
skirm has 30 attack, with 3x multiplier its 90, 50% RR, its 45.
45/30=1.5x multiplier.
grenadiers have siege damage, so the 30% RR skirms have becomes irrelevant.

=GET REKT=

Could we please do something about this xD mods ? I mean, he doesn't have a clue and still pretends to be a pro, trying to teach everyone about everything, I'm tired. Shouldn't we all enjoy a small ban for thebritish so that we can have a bit of peace and he can meditate on himself a bit
thebritish you do know you get this arsenal upgrade approx 1 game out of 100 or less ? So why the fuck do you take it into account ? And who cares about this 1.5 multiplier, it's even easier to kill grens with skirms if you have it lol ???

you get this upgrade in 1 out of 100 games, not me. Also, don't be jealous.
Btw, i said that if you take out the RR with the multiplier, the multiplier isnt big, and i doubt that you can beat 400 HP grenadiers with 50% RR with 250 HP skirms. (we can test it if you think that you can win)

Lol ok we will test it and I will cast it rofl
Skirms would have 240 hp, but do you know people don't start the game in imperial age ? Could you please use your neurons and stop taking that age into account since we never come to it ?
Oh ok you do that upgrade often ? Playing brits ? lmao... Nobody ever makes it, it's a late game upgrade,you can't invest 450w 200g just to get skirms kill musks in 4 shots instead of 5 wtf

[gh0st]

Could we please do something about this xD mods ? I mean, he doesn't have a clue and still pretends to be a pro, trying to teach everyone about everything, I'm tired. Shouldn't we all enjoy a small ban for thebritish so that we can have a bit of peace and he can meditate on himself a bit
thebritish you do know you get this arsenal upgrade approx 1 game out of 100 or less ? So why the fuck do you take it into account ? And who cares about this 1.5 multiplier, it's even easier to kill grens with skirms if you have it lol ???
And you think you're op to calculate stuff like 3 multiplied by 50% and find it does 1.5, but do you even know that skirms have base 15 attack ? Wtf man, why are you opening your mouth, you're spilling garbage everywhere

good luck arguing with that kid, who is pro in his own small word and tries to have opinion on anything and everything without having enough actual in-game experience about the strat/MUs/strategy he is talking about!!
Most of the times he doesnt care about logic, seems he just wanna increase his "post" count ( lol ) by replying on every post/topic without actually having much to contribute.
My advice : try Ignoring.