goongoon vs mitoe

No Flag willhaversham
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goongoon vs mitoe

Post by willhaversham »

Well done Mitoe in winning this tournament, I am sure it is satisfying to win finally! I am someone who has written you off in the past so you have proved me wrong.

On another topic, I want to raise the issue again of ESOC etiquette, again we see goongoon not saying gg - I'm concerned. I said about this a few weeks ago and some people were receptive to what I said some not - I think I've been proved right, we see the impact of admins not regulating ggs because we've now seen it in the biggest stage of all the final. It really is in bad taste not recognising your opponent's efforts and skill. I think this will badly impact the community going forward that people show such 'salt' - I know certainly things like this are important for Brits who respect gamesmanship and also for Asians who believe strongly in honor etc and they may not tune in. Also it may deter future players from entering the tournaments limiting the amount of rounds/tournaments we can schedule in future.

I suppose you can even say I am salty about this, I just feel it is a sorry end to a great tournament.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

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Post by gibson »

Lol not saying gg definitely isn't salty, I completely see why someone wouldn't say gg after losing and if admin force players to say gg I'll never watch a tourney again....
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

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Post by Cometk »

if you force a gg it becomes valueless. saying gg is valuable specifically because the opponent had the choice to not say it
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by Mitoe »

Goongoon behaved just fine the entire series, especially considering that he had no time to prepare or warmup before the series. He and I get along reasonably well, and I definitely understand why he wouldn't feel like typing "gg" after a couple of those games.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by Kaiserklein »

Lol this topic again about the gg. It's just so irrelevant.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by willhaversham »

Cometk wrote:if you force a gg it becomes valueless. saying gg is valuable specifically because the opponent had the choice to not say it


Very good point, I will take this on board
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by Rikikipu »

You have the right to be warmful when you lose. If it is a dead game, if players are not profesional, if it is not even important to take 5 minuts to schedule or to show up on time when all people are watching the stream because it is a videogame, then it should be totally normal to still be happy if you lose no ? Also not saying 'gg' not only is offensive toward Mitoe who has been by the way really sportsman by not taking goongoon's vetoes. but those 2 letters mean a bit more than that. It means that although you have lost, you enjoyed that serie, and you thanks the people who have donated (because 2nd place means you will receive 250$), and you also say thank you to the casters and the organizers overall, because without them this event wouldn't have been possible.
I hope that in a small community people could be a bit more friendly, but it seems I'm wrong.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by KINGofOsmane »

u can say gg when u want lol
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

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Post by Mitoe »

Don't talk bad about goongoon this series. I talked to him yesterday when we were trying to figure things out and it was pretty clear there were some real-life circumstances that were preventing him from knowing when he could possibly play and scheduling and all that. I wouldn't have blamed him if he had decided not to play at all, from how our conversation went.

He played in spite of all of that, and he had to make some sacrifices to make the series happen.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by lemmings121 »

@Mitoe gratz for finally making it, deserved!

But I do have a question:

Why when someone picks sioux,you have the counterpick, and you decide that the best thing vs sioux in the entire game is 3huss first. WHY!?
what was the reasoning behind that?
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by Kaiserklein »

Pretty sure he expected goongoon to go for a side warhut rush like he did vs snowww, and tried to go raid him directly with 3 huss
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by Hidddy_ »

Imo saltyness from competitors and unwillingness to schedule have to do with the way tournaments are organized. I'm not saying the admins do a bad job of running the tournament, and I wholeheartedly appreciate their efforts. However, much can be done to shorten the length of individual rounds(to shorten the overall length of the tourney), promote a sense of urgency to finish matches, and punish those who hold little regard for rules/organization.

I feel like shortening the time span of the tourney is good because humans have short attention spans and lose interest and care for things as time goes on. Which means less scheduling efforts, more forfeits, and more chances for irl commitments to interfere with the tourney. If the tournament were held over a 2-3 week period it would be much easier for players to schedule irl commitments around the tournament, rather than delaying the tournament for these commitments.
Of course there are community members and players that always show respect and willingness to abide by the rules despite all the delays and misconduct.

PS: tourney started Nov 1, it's lasted nearly 3 months. Also I don't think goongoon was being salty or anything of the sort, I understand his frustration of having to schedule for a tourney that has gone on so long while having to worry about school. I feel people were less tolerant of this bc it was the finals, but it's not his fault.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by deleted_user0 »

Cometk wrote:if you force a gg it becomes valueless. saying gg is valuable specifically because the opponent had the choice to not say it


yup, this is the gist. i think goongoon has always behaved quite rudely throughout basically every tournament, but it's always has been kinda within acceptable lines. i think the general rules we have, aka, don't insult and respect each other etc, are just fine. We can't force people to show respect in the same way or the way we want. There's no need for it. and if what mitoe says is true, then it seems like had a good reason to be late. in the end, its just a game and other things are always more important.
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by Snuden »

GG
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

Post by sirmusket »

willhaversham wrote:Well done Mitoe in winning this tournament, I am sure it is satisfying to win finally! I am someone who has written you off in the past so you have proved me wrong.

On another topic, I want to raise the issue again of ESOC etiquette, again we see goongoon not saying gg - I'm concerned. I said about this a few weeks ago and some people were receptive to what I said some not - I think I've been proved right, we see the impact of admins not regulating ggs because we've now seen it in the biggest stage of all the final. It really is in bad taste not recognising your opponent's efforts and skill. I think this will badly impact the community going forward that people show such 'salt' - I know certainly things like this are important for Brits who respect gamesmanship and also for Asians who believe strongly in honor etc and they may not tune in. Also it may deter future players from entering the tournaments limiting the amount of rounds/tournaments we can schedule in future.

I suppose you can even say I am salty about this, I just feel it is a sorry end to a great tournament.

lol this thread made me LOL
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

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Post by look »

lemmings121 wrote:@Mitoe gratz for finally making it, deserved!

But I do have a question:

Why when someone picks sioux,you have the counterpick, and you decide that the best thing vs sioux in the entire game is 3huss first. WHY!?
what was the reasoning behind that?


Because kickass gave the tip of how to end the game at that time of the tournament!
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Re: goongoon vs mitoe

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Post by Mitoe »

lemmings121 wrote:@Mitoe gratz for finally making it, deserved!

But I do have a question:

Why when someone picks sioux,you have the counterpick, and you decide that the best thing vs sioux in the entire game is 3huss first. WHY!?
what was the reasoning behind that?

I dunno. I kinda decided to do it the moment I hit age 2; wasn't planning on it originally. Probably shouldn't have tried it simply because he aged 20 seconds faster than I did, but I don't think it's completely without merit.

Sometimes in tournament you just need to do something your opponent would never expect. It helps disrupt any plans they might have and forces them to adapt on the fly. In this case, 3 huss didn't really accomplish much—except maybe make him think he had to send 3 axe riders instead of aging or sending an upgrade earlier—but maybe it made him stay Colonial a bit longer than he normally would, which I think is probably better for French overall.

Also, one thing I dislike about the "standard" (I guess it's standard?) meta strats vs Sioux where you just make infantry and camp in your base is that it's almost impossible to punish naked FFs or really fast semi-FFs or even some stagecoach play without getting punished on top of letting Sioux go pure Axe Rider if they wish, which is ideal for them in Fortress, I think (don't need to upgrade bow riders, and wakina/axe is probably a better composition than wakina/BR most of the time). Basically it lets Sioux get away with whatever they want. Cav has a lot more pressure and often forces them to mix in BR.

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