AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

No Flag Astaroth
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

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Post by Astaroth »

Really good point by Harrison.

Yeah, these rules are new and might not work out. They are also strict on the players, I realize that.

But as a viewer, I'm really happy to see more diverse games and less "safe" picks first (like the "neutral" France).

Having another strategic element in civ picking is also nice.
United States of America charlemango
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by charlemango »

Mitoe wrote:
n0el wrote:
Show hidden quotes
I donā€™t think anyone capable of making the round of 8 would get screwed by that rule at all
Anyone who is known for being one of the best with a particular civ can easily get screwed by this rule. The top 8 is no exception: for example, Kynesie with Portuguese & Japan, Lukas with China and Lakota, myself with China, iamturk with Japan, etc.

Now imagine a situation where I play against Lukas. Whoever picks first will pick China and have a big advantage because they've completely denied the other player's best civ.

Same thing happens in Kynesie vs Turk. Whoever gets to pick Japan has a huge advantage.
Kynesie and Turk can both choose Japan as their "power pick".
Netherlands don_artie
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by don_artie »

charlemango wrote:
Mitoe wrote:
Show hidden quotes
Anyone who is known for being one of the best with a particular civ can easily get screwed by this rule. The top 8 is no exception: for example, Kynesie with Portuguese & Japan, Lukas with China and Lakota, myself with China, iamturk with Japan, etc.

Now imagine a situation where I play against Lukas. Whoever picks first will pick China and have a big advantage because they've completely denied the other player's best civ.

Same thing happens in Kynesie vs Turk. Whoever gets to pick Japan has a huge advantage.
Kynesie and Turk can both choose Japan as their "power pick".
at that time of the post, that rule wasnt there yet. also just one person will pick japan as power pick, because the other would have already picked it
Australia JKProwler
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by JKProwler »

don_artie wrote:
charlemango wrote:
Show hidden quotes
Kynesie and Turk can both choose Japan as their "power pick".
at that time of the post, that rule wasnt there yet. also just one person will pick japan as power pick, because the other would have already picked it
Can't both players pick the same civ for power pick?
France Le Hussard sur le toit
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by Le Hussard sur le toit »

JKProwler wrote:
don_artie wrote:
Show hidden quotes
at that time of the post, that rule wasnt there yet. also just one person will pick japan as power pick, because the other would have already picked it
Can't both players pick the same civ for power pick?
Yes they can but it will not happen anyway as one of them will grab it asap.

[EDIT : Well what I said is technically false but the crux is true : players will not want to chose the same power civ]
ESOC : came for the game, stayed for the drama.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by vividlyplain »

JKProwler wrote:
don_artie wrote:
Show hidden quotes
at that time of the post, that rule wasnt there yet. also just one person will pick japan as power pick, because the other would have already picked it
Can't both players pick the same civ for power pick?
No, the power pick is a civilization from the opponent's already drafted civs.
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Great Britain I_HaRRiiSoN_I
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

the power pick can be a totally new civ, or a civ which has been drafted by the opponent. The flexibility of this makes it the power pick. don't worry lads if Samwise plays Kaiserklein then both of them will still be able to draft France and Germany each but will have to think about the remainder civ picks.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by comradecommissar »

As a viewer, Id much rather see top players playing the tournament at their best than civ diversity. And given what Kaiser said in his interview last night, not all top players might even play anymore with these views.
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Germany Joe
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by Joe »

comradecommissar wrote:As a viewer, Id much rather see top players playing the tournament at their best than civ diversity. And given what Kaiser said in his interview last night, not all top players might even play anymore with these views.
I have the same concern. hazza already didnt play last weekend. If Hazza Kaiser and other pros wouldnt play due to the new rules I would be sad as a viewer.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by blasdg »

But then Mitoe could finally win a tournament KAPPA
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

Kartoffel Joe wrote:
comradecommissar wrote:As a viewer, Id much rather see top players playing the tournament at their best than civ diversity. And given what Kaiser said in his interview last night, not all top players might even play anymore with these views.
I have the same concern. hazza already didnt play last weekend. If Hazza Kaiser and other pros wouldnt play due to the new rules I would be sad as a viewer.
Hazza didnt play as he doesnt like the game andall the bugs DE has in it. We saw knusch lose 8 units getting sucked into a TP and recently i have seen many explorers/heroes souffer the same fate. Im unsure if any ruleset would encourage him back to competetive playing but that is a decision he will make in his own time.

I listened to kaisers interview and im not fully sure he had fully understood the civ picking rules but again he is welcome to make his own decision. What complicates the matter for him (in my opinion, im probably wrong here) kaiser just won $1375 in a 5 player tournament for winning 3 series and knusch got paid $500 for winning 0 games. Compare this to 1st place in the seasonal is $1500 i think. THe global champioship has very generous prizes throughout the prize paying positions but it might not inspire the top player as they can just go for another table topper.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

comradecommissar wrote:As a viewer, Id much rather see top players playing the tournament at their best than civ diversity. And given what Kaiser said in his interview last night, not all top players might even play anymore with these views.
they are still guaranteed to pick their 2 best civs at the very least.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by JKProwler »

I_HaRRiiSoN_I wrote:the power pick can be a totally new civ, or a civ which has been drafted by the opponent. The flexibility of this makes it the power pick. don't worry lads if Samwise plays Kaiserklein then both of them will still be able to draft France and Germany each but will have to think about the remainder civ picks.
I think this is fair. There was probably some confusion, glad this statement clears it out
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by lemmings121 »

I_HaRRiiSoN_I wrote:knusch got paid $500 for winning 0 games.
where do I sign up?
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Latvia harcha
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by harcha »

lemmings121 wrote:
I_HaRRiiSoN_I wrote:knusch got paid $500 for winning 0 games.
where do I sign up?
DE ladder.
POC wrote:Also I most likely know a whole lot more than you.
POC wrote:Also as an objective third party, and near 100% accuracy of giving correct information, I would say my opinions are more reliable than yours.
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Canada vividlyplain
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by vividlyplain »

I_HaRRiiSoN_I wrote:the power pick can be a totally new civ, or a civ which has been drafted by the opponent. The flexibility of this makes it the power pick. don't worry lads if Samwise plays Kaiserklein then both of them will still be able to draft France and Germany each but will have to think about the remainder civ picks.
Need to guarantee us a German mirror each series tbh
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

vividlyplain wrote:
I_HaRRiiSoN_I wrote:the power pick can be a totally new civ, or a civ which has been drafted by the opponent. The flexibility of this makes it the power pick. don't worry lads if Samwise plays Kaiserklein then both of them will still be able to draft France and Germany each but will have to think about the remainder civ picks.
Need to guarantee us a German mirror each series tbh
my dream is to still cast a 3v3 all german mirror
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by JKProwler »

I_HaRRiiSoN_I wrote:
Kartoffel Joe wrote:
comradecommissar wrote:As a viewer, Id much rather see top players playing the tournament at their best than civ diversity. And given what Kaiser said in his interview last night, not all top players might even play anymore with these views.
I have the same concern. hazza already didnt play last weekend. If Hazza Kaiser and other pros wouldnt play due to the new rules I would be sad as a viewer.
Hazza didnt play as he doesnt like the game andall the bugs DE has in it. We saw knusch lose 8 units getting sucked into a TP and recently i have seen many explorers/heroes souffer the same fate. Im unsure if any ruleset would encourage him back to competetive playing but that is a decision he will make in his own time.

I listened to kaisers interview and im not fully sure he had fully understood the civ picking rules but again he is welcome to make his own decision. What complicates the matter for him (in my opinion, im probably wrong here) kaiser just won $1375 in a 5 player tournament for winning 3 series and knusch got paid $500 for winning 0 games. Compare this to 1st place in the seasonal is $1500 i think. THe global champioship has very generous prizes throughout the prize paying positions but it might not inspire the top player as they can just go for another table topper.
I somewhat disagree. If I was a top player and quite active on the ladder and have a decent a shot at winning $1500 (and the rep u get) by playing a few hours of video games, would be silly to say no regardless if I'm on half a mill pay packet irl.

I think the concern I would have if the tourney rules get too fancy and make result more random and feel out of my control which probably then takes away some of the competitive nature of the tournament and becomes more of a lottery.

Also players do play for prestige / reputation...if u make tournament too random...it takes away some of that element...(player A only won because players xouldnt pick there mains etc..)

But I'm glad the amendment is made to the rules and does seem to strike that balance
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

I disagree of your choice of word lottery, there is no randomness to this whatso ever with players having full control over their strategy throughout the civ drafting process.

Again the power pick means players can still pick their mains and alot of players dont actually share the same 3rd 4th and 5th choice civs.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by n0el »

The lower rated player is going to get at a minimum their top 3 civs.
mad cuz bad
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

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Post by Mitoe »

blasdg wrote:But then Mitoe could finally win a tournament KAPPA
:hmm:
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

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Post by don_artie »

honestly I like the rules as they are now, you are guaranteed as least 2 of your best civs. Lets say you are the higher seed and come into a b07 with a civ pool of : otto, russia, germany, france, dutch and you are first pick.

Player A civilization pick - you pick france
Player B civilization pick - your opponent counter picks germany
Player B civilization pick - your opponent counter picks dutch
Player A civilization pick - you pick russia
Player A civilization pick - you pick otto
Player B civilization pick - picks x
Player B civilization pick - picks x
Player A civilization pick - picks x
Player A civilization POWER pick - picks germany
Player B civilization POWER pick - picks x

This means you will still have 4 of your best picks, with only a 5 civ pool, no matter what happens. I think it's currently just being blown a lot out of proportion. We're a relatively small community with honestly pretty big tourneys for our size, being able to participate in a 5k tourney on a game this size is just awesome imo. If some of the top players are unhappy with the game (either due to bugs or just burnt out or whatever) and not playing it because of that, that is their choice. It is not because of the rules, and trying to create the narrative of someone like hazza not playing due to the rules is just disrespectfull to the organisors. Being able to just play a game and win up to $1500 is awesome, show some respect to the organisors. Hazza didn't play the tabletopper and that had nothing to do with the rules of the tourney, he just isn't (or wasn't) feeling the game enough to sign up. I'm sure the tournament organisors would love for the best players to sign up, but it's not their fault if they don't. They create a nice tournament which you should just feel gratefull for, they are not the ones to put bug in the games or anything like that. It shouldn't be expected of them to just fullfill every wish of a top player every step of the way either. If we don't see the top players participating that does really suck as a viewer, but find someone else to blame than the organisors please
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

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Post by Mitoe »

It still limits things, which I guess is a bit strange for a rule that is intended to increase diversity.

No surprise civs, no mid-series adaptation if a civ isn't working out, less practice before committing to which civs you will play, etc.


I expect less popular civs like Aztec to get picked even less frequently with these rules, for example.
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by JKProwler »

I think Don_Artie put things into perspective nicely. Organisers should be commended for taking there time and effort to place a high stakes tournament like this together.

Tournaments like these help increase the profile for the game and help spawn further tournaments.

I think it's also good to take feedback from players for opportunity to improve the tournament also. It should be a discussion and not an opportunity to rag on the organisers whose just trying there best to improve the experience playing the game
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Uzbekistan Timurid
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Re: AoE3 Global Championship 2021 - Tournament Rules & Information

Post by Timurid »

i am fully behind this compromise format.

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