Dutch Discussion Thread

[zoom]

Not sure if that's fair. Wood is still the slowest to gather by far (after dutch shadow gold up) and with treas you might get a free tp. Or much faster bank. Food and coin swap sounds more legit to me.

Like I said in the Japanese discussion thread, I cannot, in good conscience, justify such changes to select civilizations, even though it would help balance. The benefit is simply not worth the compromise in consistency and design.

[dansil92]

I'm not 100% sure if this is the best thread for this but since the unit is almost exclusively used by dutch i figured why not:

What if halbs had a base speed of 4.5 instead of 4? They currently are basically the only melee infantry (alongside skull knights) to have such poor speed. This could very likely allow reverts to the attack stats of halbs (desirable, & those buffed stats are nuts even if the unit is poor), would make them slightly more useable, better at catching cav flanks and would make the 'military reforms' card that much better as it would scale a bit more

[Garja]

Dutch doesn't mind either crate, it's pretty much the same. Dutch can age up one vill sooner with the gold crate but it's barely useful at all. Whatever extra crate you get it's going to be spent on the first bank anyway. TP-market aren't great in the end.

[bwinner]

I would like if the "3 fluyt" shipment was nerfed somehow. It's a ridiculous value for an age 3 unit shipment and prevents any water play for the opponent (especially since it synergies very well with the dutch age 3 timmings).
Could either be nerfed to 2 fluyts or cost like 750g Idk.
(posted in wrong thread by accident befor)

[[Armag] diarouga]

I would like if the "3 fluyt" shipment was nerfed somehow. It's a ridiculous value for an age 3 unit shipment and prevents any water play for the opponent (especially since it synergies very well with the dutch age 3 timmings).
Could either be nerfed to 2 fluyts or cost like 750g Idk.
(posted in wrong thread by accident befor)

I agree with this yea.

[duckzilla]

I agree with it, but hate the idea to nerf this splendid shipment. It feels just so dutchy.

[dansil92]

I'd never even considered the value of that shipment, though ive used it quite frequently. Wow, 1800 res in fortress age. Thats more than 17 ruyts...

[Garja]

Vels beat fluyts and trade even with galleons (using the broadside attack). Galleons and fluys are just overpriced af. I think it would be better if they costed 400 resources like vels. Maybe 500 just cause they can train units.
3 fluyts isn't any better than 3 vels card except vs building which I think it's fine.

[dansil92]

But shipping 3 fluyts is also like shipping 3 stables / rax / gren-only-foundries. I do agree that galleons etc. are greatly overpriced tho.

[Mr_Bramboy]

But shipping 3 fluyts is also like shipping 3 stables / rax / gren-only-foundries. I do agree that galleons etc. are greatly overpriced tho.

This is a small eureka moment for me. What if you skipped all military buildings on Malaysia and instead shipped 3 fluyts for three hybrid rax/stable/foundry?

Do units train slower from a fluyt than a barracks?

[I_HaRRiiSoN_I]

But shipping 3 fluyts is also like shipping 3 stables / rax / gren-only-foundries. I do agree that galleons etc. are greatly overpriced tho.

This is a small eureka moment for me. What if you skipped all military buildings on Malaysia and instead shipped 3 fluyts for three hybrid rax/stable/foundry?

Do units train slower from a fluyt than a barracks?

yeah for example see this game from the winter series, Kaister was able to use fluyts to come back and win the game on Florida when he was 2-0 down

[Guigs]

But shipping 3 fluyts is also like shipping 3 stables / rax / gren-only-foundries. I do agree that galleons etc. are greatly overpriced tho.

This is a small eureka moment for me. What if you skipped all military buildings on Malaysia and instead shipped 3 fluyts for three hybrid rax/stable/foundry?

Do units train slower from a fluyt than a barracks?

yeah for example see this game from the winter series, Kaister was able to use fluyts to come back and win the game on Florida when he was 2-0 down

It's a small french water boom like 1 fregate or even 2 caravels would have done the same thing.

[flontier]

And i still dont know why he sent them, he didnt know i have boat or am i missing something. That was so unexpected.

[Hawk_Girl]

dutch water is pretty shit, so idk why you would wanna nerf it. Also how does is synergize well with dutch timings, as you normally want to send your powerful 1kw/unit shipments/unit ups in early/mid age 3. Sure 3 fluyts is good vs one dock slow naked boat boom, but you deserve to lose ur shit then if u just make boats and nothing to defennd it

[Guigs]

And i still dont know why he sent them, he didnt know i have boat or am i missing something. That was so unexpected.

He probably expected it seeing to your playstyle, you were really passive as france vs dutch when there's no reason to be

[Hazza54321]

3 flutys shouldnt be nerfed. They look scary but theyre not a strong warship. Besides its not like its hard to deal with like water dance for instance. Not to mention dutch water capabilities aren’t amazing

[Guigs]

dutch water is pretty shit, so idk why you would wanna nerf it. Also how does is synergize well with dutch timings, as you normally want to send your powerful 1kw/unit shipments/unit ups in early/mid age 3. Sure 3 fluyts is good vs one dock slow naked boat boom, but you deserve to lose ur shit then if u just make boats and nothing to defennd it

yeah exactly, sending 3 fluyts vs a portuguese water boom usually doesn't do shit

[flontier]

And i still dont know why he sent them, he didnt know i have boat or am i missing something. That was so unexpected.

He probably expected it seeing to your playstyle, you were really passive as france vs dutch when there's no reason to be

i never show that "strat" to anyone but to majordark lol, so cant know that playstyle, and its a 5huss semi with a age up time that hit about the same time that the standard semi. Only thing that could make him think of were 700w first but he didnt scout it.
And well even if he "supposes" thats such a massive shipment to send at a crucial point of the game, you better scout again if you dont see anydock to be sure to not wasting a shipment instead of sending skirm upgrade of stuffs like that which are way better if i have 0 stuff on water. Idk that feels so lucky.

[Guigs]

And i still dont know why he sent them, he didnt know i have boat or am i missing something. That was so unexpected.

He probably expected it seeing to your playstyle, you were really passive as france vs dutch when there's no reason to be

i never show that "strat" to anyone but to majordark lol, so cant know that playstyle, and its a 5huss semi with a age up time that hit about the same time that the standard semi. Only thing that could make him think of were 700w first but he didnt scout it.
And well even if he "supposes" thats such a massive shipment to send at a crucial point of the game, you better scout again if you dont see anydock to be sure to not wasting a shipment instead of sending skirm upgrade of stuffs like that which are way better if i have 0 stuff on water. Idk that feels so lucky.

I'm not sure honestly, it's dutch with 5 banks and he dealt with falcs (poorly but he did) he can just outmass and still afford this shipment

[flontier]

Show hidden quotes

And i still dont know why he sent them, he didnt know i have boat or am i missing something. That was so unexpected.

He probably expected it seeing to your playstyle, you were really passive as france vs dutch when there's no reason to be

i never show that "strat" to anyone but to majordark lol, so cant know that playstyle, and its a 5huss semi with a age up time that hit about the same time that the standard semi. Only thing that could make him think of were 700w first but he didnt scout it.
And well even if he "supposes" thats such a massive shipment to send at a crucial point of the game, you better scout again if you dont see anydock to be sure to not wasting a shipment instead of sending skirm upgrade of stuffs like that which are way better if i have 0 stuff on water. Idk that feels so lucky.

I'm not sure honestly, it's dutch with 5 banks and he dealt with falcs (poorly but he did) he can just outmass and still afford this shipment

Why ? he didnt have the lead and its not about if he can afford it anyway, but would you send a shipment if there is 90% chance its useless ? instead of useful one like units cards upgrade.

[Guigs]

Show hidden quotes

And i still dont know why he sent them, he didnt know i have boat or am i missing something. That was so unexpected.

He probably expected it seeing to your playstyle, you were really passive as france vs dutch when there's no reason to be

i never show that "strat" to anyone but to majordark lol, so cant know that playstyle, and its a 5huss semi with a age up time that hit about the same time that the standard semi. Only thing that could make him think of were 700w first but he didnt scout it.
And well even if he "supposes" thats such a massive shipment to send at a crucial point of the game, you better scout again if you dont see anydock to be sure to not wasting a shipment instead of sending skirm upgrade of stuffs like that which are way better if i have 0 stuff on water. Idk that feels so lucky.

I'm not sure honestly, it's dutch with 5 banks and he dealt with falcs (poorly but he did) he can just outmass and still afford this shipment

Why ? he didnt have the lead and its not about if he can afford it anyway, but would you send a shipment if there is 90% chance its useless ? instead of useful one like units cards upgrade.

Well he made good use of his fluyts honestly. Beside water, it helped him controlling all the resources on the coast and he trained important batches from the fluyts. Other than that yeah it's quite a gamble if he didn't scout the water

[Hazza54321]

both bad

[Garja]

But shipping 3 fluyts is also like shipping 3 stables / rax / gren-only-foundries. I do agree that galleons etc. are greatly overpriced tho.

This is a small eureka moment for me. What if you skipped all military buildings on Malaysia and instead shipped 3 fluyts for three hybrid rax/stable/foundry?

Do units train slower from a fluyt than a barracks?

Sending fluyts on NE or Saguenay after FFing was quite popular on Nilla

[Jotunir]

Hello, I would like to point out that the "Dutch east india company" card right now is in a bad spot, to say the least. I suggest the hp improvement to be reduced to 50% increase (from 100%) and to compensate the dicount (arguably the only reason people would ever consider using this card) is increased to -25% food/wood cost (from -15% food/wood cost)
It could also add 1 more bank to the bank limit, but it is just an idea, should be interesting to discuss it.
I would like to know your thoughts on the matter.

[[Armag] diarouga]

We don't need every shipment to be equally viable.