Ottomans Discussion Thread

[deleted_user0]

"You mentionned treaty in your post, and the games never go to super late game. "

Mine do. Oh shit, I probably play them wrong should go skirm-goon.

[[Armag] diarouga]

"You mentionned treaty in your post, and the games never go to super late game. "

Mine do. Oh shit, I probably play them wrong should go skirm-goon.

If your games go to imperial as Otto, and you lose because of worse units, you surely play wrong.

[deleted_user0]

I don't think there is much difference between you and garja in the end. That's why you make a good couple.

[[Armag] diarouga]

I don't think there is much difference between you and garja in the end. That's why you make a good couple.

Lol, you're the one who's acting like Garja.
Otto is already fucking op in tournament format, why do you want to buff the civ, it doesn't need it.

[Garja]

Your concept of balance is "I should win games with every civ easily or the civ in unbalanced". That's simply not how it works. Especially for otto which are awfully unbalanced design-wise you can't expect to have easy time in lategame. And the funny thing is that very late game is not even that bad. Since at that point you're prob maxed with 99v, 2 factories, likely eco theory and a very strong musk unit type, which is all you need to win in late game.

[deleted_user0]

If games never go late game, how is a very late-game upgrade even a buff?
Logic 404

If it only buffs turtle, which is playing wrong and bad according to you, isn't this win-neutral for both sides?

[[Armag] diarouga]

I have to agree with Garja here.

[deleted_user0]

"I should win games with every civ easily or the civ in unbalanced

Isn't this a paradox?

[bwinner]

I think otto is good in late game. I already won game vs japan in imperial. What I do is mostly abus behind walls and mix some CA or huss according to what opponent does.

[deleted_user0]

I think otto is good in late game. I already won game vs japan in imperial. What I do is mostly abus behind walls and mix some CA or huss according to what opponent does.

If you win late-game vs japs, both imperial, your opponent must be terrible.

[deleted_user0]

I think otto is good in late game. I already won game vs japan in imperial. What I do is mostly abus behind walls and mix some CA or huss according to what opponent does.

If you win late-game vs japs, both imperial, your opponent must be terrible.

Next time you play vs kynesie, do abus CA imperial strat.

[[Armag] diarouga]

If games never go late game, how is a very late-game upgrade even a buff?
Logic 404

If it only buffs turtle, which is playing wrong and bad according to you, isn't this win-neutral for both sides?

No, because if the change is actually relevant, then Otto would win in late game, which would be a huge balance issue.

Currently, Otto is one of the strongest civs so the point is that you either win with a timing (which should happen often considering Otto is strong), or you lose because your timing didn't work. There is no "Oh shit, my timing didn't work. Actually, it doesn't matter, I'm going to go to late game and win regardless".

To be fair, that's the issue with India, and that's why most people hate the civ.
When facing India, you're going to get rushed, and even if you hold perfectly, India is going to have the same eco as you, and you'll have to deal with the sepoy/urumi timing. And even if you deal with the sepoy rush and the urumi timing, you still need to win in late fortress against sepoy/mahout.
Basically, you have to win 3 times to beat India, and one mistake should cost you the game. I don't want Otto to become the new India.

[deleted_user0]

Are we seriously comparing India and Otto eco?
To get india eco, you have to do meme-tc FF. And after that, there is no timing lol.
Secondly, I dont think otto is "fucking op". Just decent on 4 or 5 tps but there are still good counter picks.

[bwinner]

I think otto is good in late game. I already won game vs japan in imperial. What I do is mostly abus behind walls and mix some CA or huss according to what opponent does.

If you win late-game vs japs, both imperial, your opponent must be terrible.

it was this guy here : http://aoe3.jpcommunity.com/rating2/pla ... pid=708981
You can see 53min game vs me on 1st page. I don't know who it is, but I don't think he is terrible (compared to me at least)

[[Armag] diarouga]

Are we seriously comparing India and Otto eco?
To get india eco, you have to do meme-tc FF. And after that, there is no timing lol.
Secondly, I dont think otto is "fucking op". Just decent on 4 or 5 tps but there are still good counter picks.

Since you don't have to train vills, eco doesn't really matter as Otto.

My point is that currently it's fine. If you manage to hold the big timing convincingly, you're in a good spot against Otto, and you shouldn't have to worry about the ultimate late-game otto unit.

[aqwer]

How about an upgrade for "Abus Guns" which adds 0.5 against "Ranged Cav" 0.25 against "Hand Cav" and -0.5 against "Artillery" in Age-III or IV. @deleted_user2

[Kynesie]

I think otto is good in late game. I already won game vs japan in imperial. What I do is mostly abus behind walls and mix some CA or huss according to what opponent does.

If you win late-game vs japs, both imperial, your opponent must be terrible.

Next time you play vs kynesie, do abus CA imperial strat.

Honestly i agree and disagree about all you said.
For sure , ep dosn t care about very late game. I tried to complain about last ashi nerf. I share to zoi a 41 ashi imp vs 50 brit musk imp video. Trash match(more or less 30 musks alive). Same coast.nothing changed... But i still understand, jap have to win when they reach their strength pike.
About otto jap, if that reach very late game, it s really not one sided atm. It s all about who can hurt first factories or wonders.

[Kynesie]

And about very late game... All op units where nerfed. But the best RE unit , gendarme, still got same stats. Not even funny to reach late game vs fre with some trash goon, trashi or trash chinese pike...

[Hazza54321]

Ashi are great vs gendarme late game with the aresnal upgrade and pavillions and the age 3 card, also export on hatas and not clubman, japs are honestly fine vs gendarme

[Garja]

If anything we could consider changing that special card for CA to give them a multiplier against ranged cav so that otto has one way to deal with goon raids later in the game.

[Kawapasaka]

way to deal with goon raids later in the game.

Walls?

[Kazamkikaz]

making abus 1 population is ridiculous is like making cuirassier 2 population or cannon 3 population

[Kazamkikaz]

How about an upgrade for "Abus Guns" which adds 0.5 against "Ranged Cav" 0.25 against "Hand Cav" and -0.5 against "Artillery" in Age-III or IV. @deleted_user2

The problem is that you want turn abus in skirmisher type, the initial idea of abus is to be artilhery type unit so why - 0.5 vs art?
or bonus against ranged cav?

[Hazza54321]

can we cut the bias and revamp this civ please, jans are so bad atm and their eco is also too shit to compensate

[deleted_user]

can we cut the bias and revamp this civ please, jans are so bad atm and their eco is also too shit to compensate

you srs?