Indians Discussion Thread

[deleted_user0]

I'd say the most unjustified and thus nerfable things are:
- gurka self healing (very marginal but still prob a bug)
- monks not having cav tag for goons
- urumi 30% rr on top of their other insane stats (they have rof 1 for who doesnt know). For reference Spahi have 10%, dog soldiers 20% Resistance is usually the only drawback of unique non merc units. Without a drawback those units would be insane.
- agra having a disprortionate los compared to other buildings. I think it has 6 range more than the range of its attack. With otto cons basically covers 1/4 of the map

the first 2 are legit ideas for nerf, but i dunno if the agra los is disproportionate. Don't most towers and buildings have more los than range? TC defo has. And I know units have too.

as for urumi, maybe instead of nerfing RR (i think its fine cuz they're slower than cav, and so need the RR when closing in on infantry) it's better to range the 1 rof, which is odder than the RR.

[fei123456]

the first 2 are legit ideas for nerf, but i dunno if the agra los is disproportionate. Don't most towers and buildings have more los than range? TC defo has. And I know units have too.

as for urumi, maybe instead of nerfing RR (i think its fine cuz they're slower than cav, and so need the RR when closing in on infantry) it's better to range the 1 rof, which is odder than the RR.

30% RR is odd cuz they don't wear clothes.

this guy has 10% RR

cuir has 20%

and this naked guy has 30%?

[gamevideo113]

He has biggu shieldu!

[fei123456]

He has biggu shieldu!

i'd rather say he has a titanium dick

[deleted_user0]

the shield is enough to give him 30% RR if aesthetics is what you go by. Which you shouldn't anyway.

[zoom]

I'd say the most unjustified and thus nerfable things are:
- gurka self healing (very marginal but still prob a bug)
- monks not having cav tag for goons
- urumi 30% rr on top of their other insane stats (they have rof 1 for who doesnt know). For reference Spahi have 10%, dog soldiers 20% Resistance is usually the only drawback of unique non merc units. Without a drawback those units would be insane.
- agra having a disprortionate los compared to other buildings. I think it has 6 range more than the range of its attack. With otto cons basically covers 1/4 of the map

I fail to see Spahi being "insane" with 30% resistance. They were made shit, and they will remain shit.

[zoom]

why urumi has 30% rr while they don't wear anything?

Never underestimate poor people!

[momuuu]

Revert india to 190hp sepoys? Pls?

[lordraphael]

talking about nerfs for india===> jerom comes in and says revert sepoy nerf

[deleted_user0]

Do we really have to make another skirm-goon civ?
The fact that Rapha tends to play india mirror skirm-goon is a proof that sepoys or urumis are not op.

[lordraphael]

Do we really have to make another skirm-goon civ?
The fact that Rapha tends to play india mirror skirm-goon is a proof that sepoys or urumis are not op.

i have been doing that before sepoys had been nerfed aswell.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Do we really have to make another skirm-goon civ?
The fact that Rapha tends to play india mirror skirm-goon is a proof that sepoys or urumis are not op.

Gurkhas counter sepoys, which is why people don't make sepoys in India mirror. It doesn't mean that they're not op however. For instance civs without anti musk in colonial (Brits, China, Iro, Sioux etc) struggle a lot to deal with 100% sepoy. Actually, before the nerf, sepoy rush was even viable vs Dutch and Aztecs which shows how broken the unit was.

Honestly, going for 100% sepoy like on the RE should never be viable because it's just dumb. I remember that once I lost a game to raphael where he went karni mata ff while I went for a VC ff because I just couldn't deal with 100% vet sepoys, although I had more units.

[deleted_user0]

Iro and China (sioux too with idiot tiipiis) do just well vs sepoys. They wont' stay in age 2.

Yes, for example as brit its a problem. That's why I have been suggesting that LB's could get 1.5x heavy inf and maybe twerk attack by 1, for example.
You guys can't be seriously nerfing sepoys more. Muskets are already more cost efficient without ups.

[deleted_user0]

Also, india has the worst (melee) cav of the game...

[Garja]

Current sepoy is just fine?
Also sowar are lancer type. The idea is to have an anti infantry cav + a goon type cav. Same goes for elephants.

[lordraphael]

no one suggested a sepoy nerf. I dont think 180 hp for sepoys has made them weak or underused by the way. So idk what we are even talking about

[Hazza54321]

Ahaha funny how youre talking about the top civ needing a buff to a unit thats still made the most recently. Tabben myself somppu lukas tit prince largely make 100% sepoy + shipments. Its like fucking RE otto with an eco but less speed

[zoom]

Revert india to 190hp sepoys? Pls?

I'll have to get more opinions, but personally I find that sepoys are still highly prevalent, and that reverting the house buff would make more sense. Got an angle?

[zoom]

Do we really have to make another skirm-goon civ?
The fact that Rapha tends to play india mirror skirm-goon is a proof that sepoys or urumis are not op.

i have been doing that before sepoys had been nerfed aswell.

Case in point then, eh?

[zoom]

Iro and China (sioux too with idiot tiipiis) do just well vs sepoys. They wont' stay in age 2.

Yes, for example as brit its a problem. That's why I have been suggesting that LB's could get 1.5x heavy inf and maybe twerk attack by 1, for example.
You guys can't be seriously nerfing sepoys more. Muskets are already more cost efficient without ups.

I don't see anyone suggesting a Sepoy nerf. Do you?

[momuuu]

Revert india to 190hp sepoys? Pls?

I'll have to get more opinions, but personally I find that sepoys are still highly prevalent, and that reverting the house buff would make more sense. Got an angle?

old india was too weak right? just bring back old india.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Iro and China (sioux too with idiot tiipiis) do just well vs sepoys. They wont' stay in age 2.

Yes, for example as brit its a problem. That's why I have been suggesting that LB's could get 1.5x heavy inf and maybe twerk attack by 1, for example.
You guys can't be seriously nerfing sepoys more. Muskets are already more cost efficient without ups.

Sepoys aren't going to be nerfed more, they're fine as they are.

The nerf is totally deserved though, going for only one unit type regardless of the opponent's army composition shouldn't ever be possible.
That's what Sioux and Otto used to do and brs and jans got fixed. The same happened with Japan and ashigarus when TAD came out.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Revert india to 190hp sepoys? Pls?

I'll have to get more opinions, but personally I find that sepoys are still highly prevalent, and that reverting the house buff would make more sense. Got an angle?

old india was too weak right? just bring back old india.

Old India was too weak because the sepoy rush couldn't deal with euro civs, nor with China, because it was too weak to really do something, and then you'd be in age2 vs age3 with inferior units.

The 300 export build changed a lot: the rush was much more powerful (it would often kill the opponent, and it still does from time to time) and it could slow the semi ff civs by a lot, allowing the India player to either age himself, or to have the initiative in age2.

The 300e rush is totally dumb, but «thanks to it», India wasn't bad at all on the previous patch.

Now, with the house discount, India is faster (and it's significant, 100w is 200 VS ie 10 sec when you have 20 vills), and they can semi ff in time, and hold the early fortress agressions, and then win in late fortress with better eco.

So, what is going to happen if you revert the house discount?
Well, India will be 10-15 sec slower and they'll most likely die to semi ff/ff timings, and suck in some MUs, as they did 2 years ago.

And what is going to happen if you revert both the nerf and the buff and bring back old india?
As I explained, the 300e rush will be the only viable option, and you'll see people going 100% sepoy every game, which will without a doubt provide a lot of exciting games, involving creativity and high level micro

[Hazza54321]

it was considered bad because people sepoy rushed everygame vs civs that just makes 5 ranged inf units and holds. just abuse the fact that the agra buys 5mins for you to age up

[fei123456]

how do 5 xbow hold a sepoy rush with 4 sowar?