Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

No Flag storm999
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by storm999 »

if you want i can even get screenshots from him with timestamps that prove you are lying but theres no point because you know its true
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by OliverP »

dick
storm
dick
storm
storm
Oliver :love:
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United States of America dicktator_
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by dicktator_ »

By everyone I did not mean myself I meant the other tourney admin staff. I added "lol" because I was amused by the idea that everyone was immediately blaming sid when at the time I didn't see anything pointing to sid being the one smurfing. That was an idea that they came up with that I did not agree with. In fact, when everyone started blaming sid, I defended sid. While we're on the subject on lying, sid lied to me, saying he has "no idea" who is playing on Christian when in fact he knew perfectly well who was on it (in the second photo gich is responding to me). The first photo is a conversation between me and sid and the second photo is the tourney chat.
Attachments
sidlies.png
indefense of sid.png
steniothejonjoe wrote:I can micro better than 99% of the player base and that's 100% objective
:mds:
No Flag storm999
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by storm999 »

of course he lied to you, you were on the admin panel. that was the WHOLE point of it. but once you realized it was him you could think of no reason to help him?

your claim that you only suspect it was sid after temutu's post is 100% PURE bullshit. you literally said "EVERYONE THINKS chrisitan is sid" like 30 minutes before you DQ. you knew well in advance and did nothing, absolutely nothing. NOTHING. NOT EVEN A WARNING.

you should stop using his smurf accounts and return his keyboard. fucking hypocrite
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by dicktator_ »

storm999 wrote:of course he lied to you, you were on the admin panel. that was the WHOLE point of it. but once you realized it was him you could think of no reason to help him?

your claim that you only suspect it was sid after temutu's post is 100% PURE bullshit. you literally said "EVERYONE THINKS chrisitan is sid" like 30 minutes before you DQ. you knew well in advance and did nothing, absolutely nothing. NOTHING. NOT EVEN A WARNING.

you should stop using his smurf accounts and return his keyboard. fucking hypocrite

I swear I had no idea it was sid until his first post on temutuAoe3. Not giving any warning whatsoever was a mistake as I said earlier. But when I said everyone, I meant everyone other than me. I talk to sid so much that there was no need to clarify that to him. You can see the screenshot in my previous post where I was defending sid to the rest of the admin panel.

Edit: more screenshot proof, me defending sid to admin panel because I didn't think it was him
Attachments
indefense of sid 2.png
steniothejonjoe wrote:I can micro better than 99% of the player base and that's 100% objective
:mds:
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by EAGLEMUT »

@storm999 I don't see how any of your posts made here hold any value after this screenshot. Dicktator outright asked Sid about the smurfing and he just denied it.. simple as that.

Seems to me you just made some wrong conclusions based upon more wrong conclusions. I recommend trying to cool down and reassess the situation. :hmm:
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momuuu wrote: ↑theres no way eaglemut is truly a top player
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by Gichtenlord »

boy, don't start arguing with storm. I can assure you that it's not worth the time. :D
r]
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by pecelot »

honestly, why would you not suspect them of smurfing in the first game? ofc me and Eagle are not the best treaty players, but both charlemagen's and Ryan's perfomance wasnt so fabulous as well. In terms of pure PR we were better on paper + one of them (christian I think) plays mostly NR55 Ori with a civ we banned in that game, and yet they beat us quite convincingly. If you make such an investigation, at least have a look at the roots of this matter?
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by OliverP »

Conclussion:
People were smurfing on those two accs.
Those two accs got dq
Dick asks in this threat who those "people" were.
An angry storm arrives and blames dick for everything.
Dick defends himself with screenshots.
Angry storm is still angry and blames dick some more.
The end
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by WickedCossack »

Perhaps I was far too hasty when I brazenly bestowed the Jerom vs Somppu scheduling thread with the mantle of Thread Of The Year ....
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by _H2O »

Honestly there has already enough attempting to distract from the issue.

Long story short:

Admins acted appropriately.
Don't smurf and use proxies and lie all at once and you get to play in fun community events.
End of thread.

All the other nonsense needs its own thread.
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by storm999 »

Gichtenlord wrote:boy, don't start arguing with storm. I can assure you that it's not worth the time. :D

GAYchenlord you are soooo lucky you are facing noobs like ramex and ajiv if there was any merit and skill based gameplay and players were playing according to skill rather than bullshit about account names.

but i guess since you are one of the "admin" it was your honest fair decision to play VS noobs like ajiv/ramex (that way you get an easy game and have better chance to win tourney) right? that doesn't seem selfish at all

this seems like realy fun and fair tourney lol, i guess you guys can go and distribute money to sabusa and oliverp since they will be winners.

pathetic.
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Bavaria Gichtenlord
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by Gichtenlord »

storm999 wrote:
Gichtenlord wrote:boy, don't start arguing with storm. I can assure you that it's not worth the time. :D

GAYchenlord you are soooo lucky you are facing noobs like ramex and ajiv if there was any merit and skill based gameplay and players were playing according to skill rather than bullshit about account names.

but i guess since you are one of the "admin" it was your honest fair decision to play VS noobs like ajiv/ramex (that way you get an easy game and have better chance to win tourney) right? that doesn't seem selfish at all

this seems like realy fun and fair tourney lol, i guess you guys can go and distribute money to sabusa and oliverp since they will be winners.

pathetic.


Hello storm :love:
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by momuuu »

_H2O wrote:Honestly there has already enough attempting to distract from the issue.

Long story short:

Admins acted appropriately.
Don't smurf and use proxies and lie all at once and you get to play in fun community events.
End of thread.

All the other nonsense needs its own thread.

I didnt get it. Could you maybe make a powerpoint + spreadsheet with data explaining this?
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by OliverP »

storm999 wrote:i guess you guys can go and distribute money to sabusa and oliverp since they will be winners.

:love:
We kissing now? :blush:
No Flag storm999
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by storm999 »

OliverP wrote:
storm999 wrote:i guess you guys can go and distribute money to sabusa and oliverp since they will be winners.

:love:
We kissing now? :blush:



OliverP you needn't kiss my ass. I'm not the ones sponsoring the prize, your "admin" buddies are. So keep kissing their ass, hope for an easy game and that good competitors are eliminated.

You know temutu would have given you lot more than a kissing if he was allowed .
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by OliverP »

storm999 wrote:
OliverP wrote:
storm999 wrote:i guess you guys can go and distribute money to sabusa and oliverp since they will be winners.

:love:
We kissing now? :blush:



OliverP you needn't kiss my ass. I'm not the ones sponsoring the prize, your "admin" buddies are. So keep kissing their ass, hope for an easy game and that good competitors are eliminated.

You know temutu would have given you lot more than a kissing if he was allowed .

I rate that as "maybe" then :blush:
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Re: Temutu and Christian2502 disqualification

Post by dicktator_ »

Things are getting out of hands with emotions etc and no one is adding anything constructive anymore, so I am going to close this thread. If anyone has any questions/comments/concerns I would encourage them to read this post:
dicktator_ wrote:Alright, my head is a lot clearer now so I'm going to explain exactly what happened, what went wrong, and why there's so much drama and controversy over this particular disqualification.

What happened: We had sufficient reason to believe christian2502 (and possibly temutu as well) were smurfs. These reasons included no games on the christian2502 account in the past 5 months, a sudden drastic improvement in performance compared to previous games on the account, and use of proxy IPs/VPNs by both temutu and christian2502. As smurfing goes directly against one of our rules, the tourney admins unanimously decided to disqualify christian2502 and temutu.

Where we as tourney admins went wrong: While I still believe the punishment to be fitting of the crime, the execution of the punishment could have been much better:

-We did not give the users on temutu or christian2502 a chance to give their side of the story. We DQ'd temutu and christian2502 without warning and without attempting to reach out to them. AJIV and ramex19 had a say in the final decision, so, for fairness purposes, we should have given temutu and christian2502 that same opportunity. It's likely that the result punishment would have been the same, but by giving them a chance to have a say the decision would not be so biased and one sided. Also worth mentioning is that those within ESOC are for the most part aware that smurfing generally results in immediate disqualifications (this can be seen in the supremacy tournaments), but it might not be obvious to those outside of ESOC.

-We cited lag as a reason for the disqualification. There is absolutely nothing in the rules that says lag should lead to a disqualification. Furthermore, we did not have the "definite proof" that I claimed we had that temutu and christian2502 were the sole cause of lag, as can be seen by the screenshot with ramex19's yellow ping.

-We didn't make any rules regarding player lag. Player lag can ruin games and give some teams a disadvantage, but we should have had some kind of pre-set rule or procedure on how to determine who is lagging and how to handle it.

-We did not change the rules to reflect the change in streaming policy. I still think it was unfair to compare a discrepancy in rules regarding streaming policy to blatant smurfing, but the point that temutuAoe3 made still stands. The moment we decided to allow Gichtenlord and _H2O to stream their tourney games, we should have updated the rules to reflect the change in streaming policy.

-We waited too long to take action. It was obvious after the game against charlemagen and _H2O that their opponents were most likely smurfs. We should've looked into it and taken action immediately after that game and prior to the game against AJIV and ramex19, regardless of whether or not _H2O was interested in a rematch.

Hopefully we can learn from our mistakes here when running treaty tournaments in the future.

My offering: (This does not in any way represent the opinions of other admins). Here is what I am willing to do to make up for errors in judgement on behalf of myself and other admins. If the real users of temutu and christian2502 say who they are, and that they are willing to rematch, I will attempt to convince AJIV, veni, and the other admins to grant them a rematch. I can't guarantee that they will agree to it, but I'll do my best to convince them.

That said... smurfing in tournaments is still wrong. It has detrimental effects on the tourney as a whole, including but not limited to that it fucks up seeding (players are seeded based on ELO) and that it gives the smurfs an unfair advantage in that their opponents have no idea what they're up against. We made errors in judgement when handling this smurfing case but the biggest error of judgement was the decision to smurf in the first place. If the real users behind temutu and christian2502 had just played on their mains none of this would have happened.


And this post from cometk:
"
storm999 wrote:
Gichtenlord wrote:boy, don't start arguing with storm. I can assure you that it's not worth the time. :D

GAYchenlord you are soooo lucky you are facing noobs like ramex and ajiv if there was any merit and skill based gameplay and players were playing according to skill rather than bullshit about account names.

but i guess since you are one of the "admin" it was your honest fair decision to play VS noobs like ajiv/ramex (that way you get an easy game and have better chance to win tourney) right? that doesn't seem selfish at all

this seems like realy fun and fair tourney lol, i guess you guys can go and distribute money to sabusa and oliverp since they will be winners.

pathetic.

smurfing is prohibited because it's dishonest and it messes with the seeding. let me reiterate: there would have been no issue if you and sid had signed up with your main accounts. it should have been abundantly clear that we'd have liked for you to play; we approached you on creating the mapset for the tournament. if you were concerned that your team would be ineligible due to the 4600 rule, you could have messaged us about it, just as ajiv did. all we ask for is honest communication. smurfing the tournament is not honest."
and if these posts do not cover it feel free to PM me or message me on ESO/twitch.
steniothejonjoe wrote:I can micro better than 99% of the player base and that's 100% objective
:mds:

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