500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Would you participate in the nr 20 tournament?

Yes
42
61%
No
27
39%
 
Total votes: 69

User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

dicktator_ wrote:
sergyou wrote:
Show hidden quotes

@dicktator_ do you confirm this disgrace ?

If it happened I don't remember it. The only losses to the amsterda/sonora combo I can find on elo is me/princeofcarthage (pretty embarrassing, but I was Aztecs, I also don't remember this game) and me/dyna (not as embarrassing, I do remember this game actually, I got cav cheesed and I was pissed).

Anyway, all this discussion about who's better and by how much is making me more excited for the tourney.

It's the game where you teamed with WhiteIrishKing 2014/10/11 22:30:00. Dyna shared his account with Sergyou at the time. The 2016 games you see however were with Dyna playing on soñora, nowadays the real soñora plays on qazeh.
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

deleted_user wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:
edeholland wrote:With a proper BO and 5 practice games every captain+ can do a decent boom. I think a NR20 mostly comes down to mechanics and APM.

Yes you can probably get the build order correct, but if you think execution is so easy I want to see you trying it.

Dude a TR boom is the stuff of cakes. I get that the final 2% optimization of a boom can be difficult and really tight, but any self respective sup captain+ with two tries can pull off a typical TR boom with a typical civ - cow booming the only exception.

Treaty gameplay on the other hand is hard as shit.

Since I think trash talking would make you more likely to play I'd say for you it's more like the final 30-35% of optimization. Think that's being harsh? Come beat me in the tournament lol.
User avatar
Netherlands edeholland
ESOC Community Team
Donator 01
Posts: 5033
Joined: Feb 11, 2015
ESO: edeholland
GameRanger ID: 4053888
Clan: ESOC

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by edeholland »

princeofcarthage wrote:
edeholland wrote:With a proper BO and 5 practice games every captain+ can do a decent boom. I think a NR20 mostly comes down to mechanics and APM.

Yes you can probably get the build order correct, but if you think execution is so easy I want to see you trying it.
It's following a BO but you have even more time to read it during the game than in sup. But if you wanna test it so you should get someone to try it who hasn't played loads of treaty.
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

princeofcarthage wrote:Well I also don't remember me and dick losing to amster and sonora, must be early 2016 or something when I was infant in nr20. Amster you used to play nr20 long before I started, I don't know how you beating me in infant days make it fair. As far as it goes today's rusty me is winning vs you despite pathetic artillery control(somehow you have improved a lot lol)

Also while I haven't seen it I do remember amster being excited about beating dick and sergyou with sonora on team, also I remember serg being well serg to amster for next few days/months

Lol yeah the times I've mentioned it is definitely in the doubledigits at this point. My first nr 20 game was 2013/09/30 04:22:00, your first was 2012/12/06 13:19:00 I think and you continued playing after that.
User avatar
Kiribati princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 8861
Joined: Aug 28, 2015
Location: Milky Way!

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by princeofcarthage »

[TLDT]Amsterda wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:Well I also don't remember me and dick losing to amster and sonora, must be early 2016 or something when I was infant in nr20. Amster you used to play nr20 long before I started, I don't know how you beating me in infant days make it fair. As far as it goes today's rusty me is winning vs you despite pathetic artillery control(somehow you have improved a lot lol)

Also while I haven't seen it I do remember amster being excited about beating dick and sergyou with sonora on team, also I remember serg being well serg to amster for next few days/months

Lol yeah the times I've mentioned it is definitely in the doubledigits at this point. My first nr 20 game was 2013/09/30 04:22:00, your first was 2012/12/06 13:19:00 I think and you continued playing after that.

Till 2012 to 2014 I had no idea how to play game I just used to have fun with friends I dont even remember playing 20 in 2013 tbh but anyways
Fine line to something great is a strange change.
No Flag Selena
Crossbow
Posts: 12
Joined: Jul 31, 2019
ESO: Selena25

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by Selena »

I guess I could play if im not too bad..
User avatar
Italy gamevideo113
Howdah
Posts: 1899
Joined: Apr 26, 2017
ESO: gamevideo113

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by gamevideo113 »

What would the map(/s) be for this tournament?
Also, can you take treasures? Trading posts? Natives before the treaty ends?
[Some people aspire to be pr30+, some people aspire to have fun, and some people aspire to play 3v3 Deccan.] - vividlyplain - 2019 Who (nationality) rape ?
stupid logic. noob players can say op?
toxic, Insult, Racism ?
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

gamevideo113 wrote:What would the map(/s) be for this tournament?
Also, can you take treasures? Trading posts? Natives before the treaty ends?

The current map pool is preliminary but is listed in op, you can take treasures. You can take treasures of course, tp and nats depend on map spawn.
User avatar
Italy gamevideo113
Howdah
Posts: 1899
Joined: Apr 26, 2017
ESO: gamevideo113

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by gamevideo113 »

Thanks.
In regards to civs: maybe some should be excluded, if we don't want to see french mirrors throughout the whole tournament. The problem is that there are quite big strength gaps between different civs so you wouldn't really know where to stop banning civs, starting from the top.
[Some people aspire to be pr30+, some people aspire to have fun, and some people aspire to play 3v3 Deccan.] - vividlyplain - 2019 Who (nationality) rape ?
stupid logic. noob players can say op?
toxic, Insult, Racism ?
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

gamevideo113 wrote:Thanks.
In regards to civs: maybe some should be excluded, if we don't want to see french mirrors throughout the whole tournament. The problem is that there are quite big strength gaps between different civs so you wouldn't really know where to stop banning civs, starting from the top.

While I do think french is the top civ I have a hard time saying that's how it works out practically at the moment due to the lack of skilled french boomers.
User avatar
Italy gamevideo113
Howdah
Posts: 1899
Joined: Apr 26, 2017
ESO: gamevideo113

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by gamevideo113 »

[TLDT]Amsterda wrote:
gamevideo113 wrote:Thanks.
In regards to civs: maybe some should be excluded, if we don't want to see french mirrors throughout the whole tournament. The problem is that there are quite big strength gaps between different civs so you wouldn't really know where to stop banning civs, starting from the top.

While I do think french is the top civ I have a hard time saying that's how it works out practically at the moment due to the lack of skilled french boomers.

I assume the civ tier might vary a bit between NR20 and NR40.
I guess it would be fair to let every civ in, but boomy civs like brits and japs are miles ahead compared to otto or spain as far as i can tell, imo even more than on NR40 because of how slow the boom of some civs is. In NR40 slow civs have the time to catch up, but in NR20 it might be harder i think. It's a gamemode that rewards fast booming civs a lot.
[Some people aspire to be pr30+, some people aspire to have fun, and some people aspire to play 3v3 Deccan.] - vividlyplain - 2019 Who (nationality) rape ?
stupid logic. noob players can say op?
toxic, Insult, Racism ?
Germany supernapoleon
Lancer
Posts: 655
Joined: Sep 9, 2015
ESO: Supernapoleon
Location: Munich

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by supernapoleon »

In
"I'M SOOOOOO GOOD AT THE GAME"
Hazza wrote: "I mad u win cos u get carried all game and have to lame every game"
Image
User avatar
United States of America Cometk
Retired Contributor
Posts: 7257
Joined: Feb 15, 2015
Location: California

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by Cometk »

@[TLDT]Amsterda do you have discord? message me Cometk#3297
Image
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

Cometk wrote:@[TLDT]Amsterda do you have discord? message me Cometk#3297

I'll message you. Edit: Had to send a friend request since we're not in any of the same servers.
User avatar
United States of America dicktator_
Howdah
EWT
Posts: 1565
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
ESO: Conquerer999

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by dicktator_ »

Btw some things to consider for the tournament

1. Maps: The two questions for maps are obs ui vs no obs ui or if you want to change anything. Regarding the ui, we can do obs while preserving the build radius, this involves placing TCs for the obs players. However, preparing maps for obs is time consuming, and of course obs players deleting TCs provides XP to the players (obs players can delete their tcs later in the boom when the xp won't impact the boom as much). Furthermore getting the obs TCs to actually place is difficult on small maps (pd) or maps with lots of obstructions (any esoc map), probably impossible on Andes since it's pure rng. So basically it'd take a lot of time, if enough people really want obs maps for this tournament I'd be willing to do it, if people are okay with no obs (which means games won't get casted, hopefully some players will do first person streams then) I'd highly prefer to not have to do it.

The second question is what sort of changes you want on the maps, for example removing the river on Andes. Assuming the changes aren't too difficult, these would not be as time consuming as doing obs so I'd be willing to do it. I would just need a list of changes for each map.

2. Gameplay Rules: Things like half map and warships. Any time I go into a treaty game I assume it is half map and nws, however if you want these rules in tournament games then they need to be clear in the tournament rules, or else some players will lame ws in tourney games and be justified in doing so. I know some nr20 games are no half map but personally I really hope half map is a rule or else things will get really cheesy :D There are also lots of bugs on RE which I hope will be banned. Alt D, explorer crackshot glitch (not a huge deal in tr actually, except that it'll enable people to go for more treausres), the china record game monk aura, and the infinite res thing for China involving ger consulate discovered by Diarouga to name a few, I'm probably forgetting some as well.

3. Civ Rules: Whether to ban civs upfront, whether to allow civ bans, or just allow all civs, and how counterpicks should work in a series (winner picks first vs alternating).

4. Seeding: How to seed players. Could do something like, if a player has a higher tr elo just use tr elo, if a player has a higher sup elo use (TR ELO X 2 + SUP ELO)/3, still iffy since some players are pure nr20 players and some are pure nr40.

Probably forgetting some things but running out of time and I think I covered the most important things
steniothejonjoe wrote:I can micro better than 99% of the player base and that's 100% objective
:mds:
User avatar
Czech Republic EAGLEMUT
ESOC Dev Team
Donator 05
Posts: 4513
Joined: Mar 31, 2015
ESO: EAGLEMUT
Clan: WPact

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by EAGLEMUT »

Why isn't this played on EP/ETP in the first place? That would solve many of those issues, we could even look into the treaty radius bug in UHC to make obs treaty less awkward to implement/use.
User avatar
Kiribati princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 8861
Joined: Aug 28, 2015
Location: Milky Way!

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by princeofcarthage »

EAGLEMUT wrote:Why isn't this played on EP/ETP in the first place? That would solve many of those issues, we could even look into the treaty radius bug in UHC to make obs treaty less awkward to implement/use.

Changes don't balance the gamemode very well, besides some changes from nr20 perspective are outright useless
Fine line to something great is a strange change.
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

EAGLEMUT wrote:Why isn't this played on EP/ETP in the first place? That would solve many of those issues, we could even look into the treaty radius bug in UHC to make obs treaty less awkward to implement/use.

The balance changes aren't really desirable and the point of a nr 20 tournament would diminish if it's played in conditions that nobody has played in before or would play in the future. I don't think any of the active nr 20 players would care for a tournament played on a different balance patch.
User avatar
China juicyfruit1268
Skirmisher
Posts: 105
Joined: Jun 6, 2015
ESO: Torie

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by juicyfruit1268 »

I don't think there is a reasonable patch that balances nr20? I don't think there has been very much testing of nr20 on treaty patch and esoc patch but I'd imagine that TP nr20 Sioux and Japan might be extremely strong.
User avatar
United States of America dicktator_
Howdah
EWT
Posts: 1565
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
ESO: Conquerer999

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by dicktator_ »

Top civs are prob japan china france brit port
steniothejonjoe wrote:I can micro better than 99% of the player base and that's 100% objective
:mds:
User avatar
Kiribati princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 8861
Joined: Aug 28, 2015
Location: Milky Way!

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by princeofcarthage »

Brit can prolly beat japan china port though, depending on map and france as well depending on map. Of course lack of relaible players to know exact results is kinda hard.
Fine line to something great is a strange change.
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

dicktator_ wrote:Top civs are prob japan china france brit port

Definitely but not in that order.
User avatar
Latvia harcha
Gendarme
Posts: 5136
Joined: Jul 2, 2015
ESO: hatamoto_samurai

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by harcha »

princeofcarthage wrote:Brit can prolly beat japan china port though, depending on map and france as well depending on map. Of course lack of relaible players to know exact results is kinda hard.

This. Is why I also think throwing 500 usd at this would be kind of redundant. 250 would be enough. Now obviously it is not my money, just a suggestion.

Also TPs allowed is kind of ridiculous when andes no water and deccan can give tp to one player but not the other, thats a huge swing, definitely would decide the game in a mirror. NWS is a must otherwise i'm not even interested :D
POC wrote:Also I most likely know a whole lot more than you.
POC wrote:Also as an objective third party, and near 100% accuracy of giving correct information, I would say my opinions are more reliable than yours.
User avatar
No Flag [TLDT]Amsterda
Dragoon
Posts: 364
Joined: Aug 18, 2019
ESO: Amsterda

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by [TLDT]Amsterda »

harcha wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:Brit can prolly beat japan china port though, depending on map and france as well depending on map. Of course lack of relaible players to know exact results is kinda hard.

This. Is why I also think throwing 500 usd at this would be kind of redundant. 250 would be enough. Now obviously it is not my money, just a suggestion.

Also TPs allowed is kind of ridiculous when andes no water and deccan can give tp to one player but not the other, thats a huge swing, definitely would decide the game in a mirror. NWS is a must otherwise i'm not even interested :D

Definitely nws on maps without any possibility of water booming, the presence of water maps in map pool has yet to be decided but leaning towards a no or a single one if map pool gets larger. Tp is a pretty big deal but I can't really agree that it would definitely decide the game if one player got it, not to say that it's been decided that going for tp during nr will be allowed.
User avatar
Kiribati princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 8861
Joined: Aug 28, 2015
Location: Milky Way!

Re: 500$ Nr 20 1v1 tournament updated

Post by princeofcarthage »

Water maps with warships could be fun
Fine line to something great is a strange change.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

Which top 10 players do you wish to see listed?

All-time

Active last two weeks

Active last month

Supremacy

Treaty

Official

ESOC Patch

Treaty Patch

1v1 Elo

2v2 Elo

3v3 Elo

Power Rating

Which streams do you wish to see listed?

Twitch

Age of Empires III

Age of Empires IV