Grudge match: diarouga vs garja, brits vs china

[deleted_user]

DARE YE CONTEST THE G?!

[deleted_user0]

sure lets do china brit and china iro

so when is this happening?

hudzu i will coach youuu!

[Googol]

sure lets do china brit and china iro

so when is this happening?

hudzu i will coach youuu!

Coach me and iamshurk instead

[sudmakmak]

Garja clearly has no clue about how this MU works, and I'm tired of his bs, I challenge the @Garja to a BO 5, Brits vs China, on Sunday 13th.
1. Hudson Bay
2. Arkansas

(2 maps will be more than enough to end this BO5)

PS: I haven't played for 2 months so it might take me 2 games instead of 1 to make him leave.

Save Its. I wait watch.

[Garja]

taking a brief look at garja's recent tournament success suggests that the outcome will not tell much about the match up. play mitoe's china or something.

I didnt even play bad in tourney, really. Was just one game where I deliberately understimated water play and got punished for it. Among all civs I didnt want to face with India, China and Iro were the worse and I got both of them (tho didn't have to play vs Iro).
Like if I was against you I would advance you and go out at ro32.

Lets look at the facts here garja:

Spring 2015: you beat boneng 3-2 and then lost to Kiljardi 1-3 in the RO16
Summer 2015: You beat 2015 tit 3-0 and then lost to Fard 3-2 in the RO16
Winter 2015: You managed to beat Dyddyd 3-2 but dyddyd played japan only and won both his japan games (including Japan vs Aztec), then you lost to Boneng 3-2
ESOC invitational: Diarouga stomps you 2-0
Autumn 2016: You beat Yurashic 3-0 and then lose 4-0 to H2O
Spring 2017: You don't participate
Autumn 2017: You lose 3-0 to Kingofosmane

While your initial tournament results would qualify you as a top16 player, they don't give you much more credit than that. Actually the biggest achievement was arguably beating boneng 3-2 in the first tournament. After that, there's an early still improving tit, a Japan only player and Yurashic as notable tournament results. I feel like there's many people that could pull that off. It makes you a mid tier player. Not that it really matters, except for the part where you think you are a top tier player. It's just odd. Meanwhile, I'd describe somppu as a mid tier player aswell, despite his best run definitely being more prestigious than yours with a 3-1 victory over mitoe. So I don't even know how you'd easily advance against somppu if any data implies that you're both somewhere between a top32 and top16 player. Now lets look at ELO: RE you are 1880, EP 1650. Somppu has 1820 on RE and 1700 on EP. So, get off your high horse maybe?

I'd agree that a Diarouga vs Garja showmach doesn't mean anything. The skill difference is simply huge.

And if you play AOE for more than 5mins you should also know that those numbers mean nothing.
As for Diarouga skill level you guys are overstimating him by a lot. His mechanics are solid but not impressive and he hasn't achieved anything anyway. The moment he faced a tricky opponent (Aizmak) is the moment you can clearly see the limit of his playstyle.

[deleted_user0]

yesh, i saw that you did much better vs aizamku!

somppu ish the only one who can beat AIZMAKAKAKU

[Garja]

I never said I did much better vs Aiz but in fact I did. At least I can understand the limit of my play and recognize how the opponent play. Diarouga is mostly a BO bot.
Also your superiorioty attitude in the forums when your biggest achievement was laming iro to a not even impressive elo score is very annoying.

[deleted_user0]

also dont forget i rekt you!

[lordraphael]

maybe grudge match garja vs umeu more appropriate.

[yurashic]

Fucking drama bots, discussing who is "mid-tier" out of 20-25 pr30+ players left in aoe 3... Remember Eaglemut's post that only 1.7% games were played on EP in a certain month? We are all in a small sandbox, it's just laughable to argue so much, especially considering how random AOE can be sometimes...

[[Armag] diarouga]

I never said I did much better vs Aiz but in fact I did. At least I can understand the limit of my play and recognize how the opponent play. Diarouga is mostly a BO bot.
Also your superiorioty attitudein the forums when your biggest achievement was laming iro to a not even impressive elo score is very annoying.

I've never denied that, I mostly rely on my BOs and my game knowledge, my mechanics are nothing special.

Still, it shows that I know how MUs works better than a guy who mostly relies on mechanics, because if I win it's thanks to my knowledge.

Honestly, my games vs aizamk weren't relevant at all strategically since these were my first games for more than one month, and thus he showed much better mechanics, which allowed him to come back in game 1, and win the India vs Aztecs game were I shipped 700w instead of 3wp for some reasons.

The only game where strategy mattered was the Russia vs Sioux game, I didn't expect such a fast rush.

[Garja]

also dont forget i rekt you!

Hmm, did you?

[[Armag] diarouga]

also dont forget i rekt you!

Hmm, did you?

#pkckan

[momuuu]

Show hidden quotes

taking a brief look at garja's recent tournament success suggests that the outcome will not tell much about the match up. play mitoe's china or something.

I didnt even play bad in tourney, really. Was just one game where I deliberately understimated water play and got punished for it. Among all civs I didnt want to face with India, China and Iro were the worse and I got both of them (tho didn't have to play vs Iro).
Like if I was against you I would advance you and go out at ro32.

Lets look at the facts here garja:

Spring 2015: you beat boneng 3-2 and then lost to Kiljardi 1-3 in the RO16
Summer 2015: You beat 2015 tit 3-0 and then lost to Fard 3-2 in the RO16
Winter 2015: You managed to beat Dyddyd 3-2 but dyddyd played japan only and won both his japan games (including Japan vs Aztec), then you lost to Boneng 3-2
ESOC invitational: Diarouga stomps you 2-0
Autumn 2016: You beat Yurashic 3-0 and then lose 4-0 to H2O
Spring 2017: You don't participate
Autumn 2017: You lose 3-0 to Kingofosmane

While your initial tournament results would qualify you as a top16 player, they don't give you much more credit than that. Actually the biggest achievement was arguably beating boneng 3-2 in the first tournament. After that, there's an early still improving tit, a Japan only player and Yurashic as notable tournament results. I feel like there's many people that could pull that off. It makes you a mid tier player. Not that it really matters, except for the part where you think you are a top tier player. It's just odd. Meanwhile, I'd describe somppu as a mid tier player aswell, despite his best run definitely being more prestigious than yours with a 3-1 victory over mitoe. So I don't even know how you'd easily advance against somppu if any data implies that you're both somewhere between a top32 and top16 player. Now lets look at ELO: RE you are 1880, EP 1650. Somppu has 1820 on RE and 1700 on EP. So, get off your high horse maybe?

I'd agree that a Diarouga vs Garja showmach doesn't mean anything. The skill difference is simply huge.

And if you play AOE for more than 5mins you should also know that those numbers mean nothing.
As for Diarouga skill level you guys are overstimating him by a lot. His mechanics are solid but not impressive and he hasn't achieved anything anyway. The moment he faced a tricky opponent (Aizmak) is the moment you can clearly see the limit of his playstyle.

Lets see: Diarouga reaches RO8 in spring 2015, ro16 in summer, semifinals in winter 2015, and he wins the ESOC invitational. Meanwhile, you have literally achieved nothing but claim as if Diarouga is bad. Garja, you literally live in a fantasy world where you have to twist reality and facts to protect your own very inflated ego. You're a medium quality player (honestly, I wasn't even surprised when a lt colonel like Kingofosmane literally bashed the fuck out of you) that thinks he's a top3 player and thus warps reality and comes up with ridiculous statements so that he can sleep at night thinking he's 'good' at aoe3. You seriously need a reality check.

I never said I did much better vs Aiz but in fact I did. At least I can understand the limit of my play and recognize how the opponent play. Diarouga is mostly a BO bot.
Also your superiorioty attitude in the forums when your biggest achievement was laming iro to a not even impressive elo score is very annoying.

A semi finalist of a big tournament and an invitational winner. If you look at the sheer tournament results, diarouga is one of the best players on this forum - and although he does come off as a bit arrogant from time to time, it's warrented. I know a player that has a superiority attitude without ever really having achieved much at all. Hint: look in the mirror.

EDIT: forgot to note Diarouga also got 2nd place in War chiefs invitational. If you would play diarouga there's about a 1% chance that you beat him in a serious series. You're 10 leagues lower. Those are simply the facts.

[Garja]

I never said he's bad, but he's overrated, just like you're doing it now. with tourney placement and shit which mean absolutely nothing to me.

[momuuu]

Fucking drama bots, discussing who is "mid-tier" out of 20-25 pr30+ players left in aoe 3... Remember Eaglemut's post that only 1.7% games were played on EP in a certain month? We are all in a small sandbox, it's just laughable to argue so much, especially considering how random AOE can be sometimes...

It's not even something that should be argued about, obviously diarouga is better than garja and obviously a showmatch is useless. If Garja plays Brits and Diarouga plays China diarouga could even 'prove' that china beats british because he's just better.

[deleted_user0]

except that he was the runner up (though he wouldve been top4 if it played out normally) in the biggest and most stacked non-official aoe3 tournament. garja is crazy of course, but that doesn't mean you have to spread falsehoods.

[Garja]

Fucking drama bots, discussing who is "mid-tier" out of 20-25 pr30+ players left in aoe 3... Remember Eaglemut's post that only 1.7% games were played on EP in a certain month? We are all in a small sandbox, it's just laughable to argue so much, especially considering how random AOE can be sometimes...

It's not even something that should be argued about, obviously diarouga is better than garja and obviously a showmatch is useless. If Garja plays Brits and Diarouga plays China diarouga could even 'prove' that china beats british because he's just better.

You make me laugh everytime you say this.

[momuuu]

Fucking drama bots, discussing who is "mid-tier" out of 20-25 pr30+ players left in aoe 3... Remember Eaglemut's post that only 1.7% games were played on EP in a certain month? We are all in a small sandbox, it's just laughable to argue so much, especially considering how random AOE can be sometimes...

It's not even something that should be argued about, obviously diarouga is better than garja and obviously a showmatch is useless. If Garja plays Brits and Diarouga plays China diarouga could even 'prove' that china beats british because he's just better.

You make me laugh everytime you say this.

So accept the showmatch and prove that you're more than a lt colonel? It'll at least be entertaining to see how you deal with losing after these comments. I hope it'll be as good as "I deliberately underestimated water".

except that he was the runner up (though he wouldve been top4 if it played out normally) in the biggest and most stacked non-official aoe3 tournament. garja is crazy of course, but that doesn't mean you have to spread falsehoods.

Tbf, I drew the line between that tournament and spring as 'too long ago'. I wasn't around then and it's still a miracle to me how someone like Garja could perform well. People used to still sort of give him the credit that he would deserve based on that one result, but that's been 4 years (?) now. If you have never seen garja play like that, you're left completely confused as to why people think he's really good (I mean, still easily top32 of course but people really give him much more credit than that). If I watch his stream, where he often loses to random majors/lt colonels or if you look at his tournament results or even play against him, you're just left wondering how he could've made a final of a stacked tournament.

In terms of "falsehoods", I could've looked it up but it's not truly a falsehood. Ever since ESOC has existed, Garja has been a mid-tier player.

[gibson]

except that he was the runner up (though he wouldve been top4 if it played out normally) in the biggest and most stacked non-official aoe3 tournament. garja is crazy of course, but that doesn't mean you have to spread falsehoods.

this is correct, but it’s also correct that at this point in time diarouga is better than garja, potentially by more than just a little bit, so you can’t really take their games as basis for game balance.

[deleted_user0]

except that he was the runner up (though he wouldve been top4 if it played out normally) in the biggest and most stacked non-official aoe3 tournament. garja is crazy of course, but that doesn't mean you have to spread falsehoods.

this is correct, but it’s also correct that at this point in time diarouga is better than garja, potentially by more than just a little bit, so you can’t really take their games as basis for game balance.

oh i dont disagree with that, it was just a response to jerom's post

[Goodspeed]

To be fair Garja is, or at least was, a better player than his tournament results suggest. Why attach so much value to tournaments when we have all played against each other plenty of times to know how good everyone is/was?

[momuuu]

To be fair Garja is, or at least was, a better player than his tournament results suggest. Why attach so much value to tournaments when we have all played against each other plenty of times to know how good everyone is/was?

Well tbh, to me his tournament results nicely reflect his game insight and how well he plays on his streams or if you face him. But thats hardly anything to base an argument on.

[deleted_user0]

Well, like gs says, i think youre being too harsh on him. Garjas problem is basically that hes too stubborn, he wont change his strats or adapt well in game. But his macro and micro are overall quite good and definitely better than most ppl who performed better than him in tournaments. If garja would stop doing his own builds and would start using good in meta builds, hes still a good player. Not as good as he was 5 years ago, but thats the same for everyone in that generation.

I mean even h2o is losing to rdm majors these days.

[gibson]

yea like for example right now hes trying to prove that china is good in age 2, so hes losing to people like sirmusket( non cheating sirmusket)