What if we added warship upgrades to another building?

[Mitoe]

We all know it's very difficult to fight water when your opponent has fully upgraded warships with 3000 hp and 100+ attack etc etc when you haven't even touched water yet.

What if we added the upgrades to a building like the Arsenal, so you could upgrade your boats before going water? They would ofc also be in the dock, so you don't need an arsenal if you're already setup on water. I think this would help a lot in making water a bit easier to combat though.

Thoughts?

[HUMMAN]

Instead canons and buildings need more upgrades against warships.

[yemshi]

Or people need more warships to deal vs warships?

[fei123456]

towers are too weak against warships.
the 1st upgrade of tower is way too stupid: you spend 400w 200g, wait for 1 minute, and upgrade its 30 attack to 45? no HP increase, no anti-ship bonus?

[Mitoe]

Love how none of these comments are about the actual suggestion, and are only about land vs water options

[princeofkabul]

Arsenal is kinda full when you add advanced arsenal to the innit. How about church? It already has bastion upgrade which is researchable from both wall and church.

Good idea.

[Mitoe]

Yeah not sure really where the upgrades would go. Kinda weird to put it in the church (doesn't really fit thematically), but yeah probably doesn't fit in the Arsenal the way it's currently designed.

[Garja]

I dont think the balance pros justify the ugly design of having water stuff on the church.
I dont even think this is needed for balance.

[edeholland]

Yeah not sure really where the upgrades would go. Kinda weird to put it in the church (doesn't really fit thematically), but yeah probably doesn't fit in the Arsenal the way it's currently designed.

A university?

[Gendarme]

Just ban Kynesie

[Hazza54321]

dont think its needed, kinda late to start contesting when they have full upped ships anyway

[Sargsyan]

I got a better suggestion, learn to play water

[edeholland]

If you wanna help contesting water while the enemy already has full warships + upgrades, I think a decent change would be to allow trained ships to stay in the dock. If they are released all at once, as least your boats won't be killed as soon as they are trained.

[Hazza54321]

thats already the case with canoes i dont see a problem with that, if youre trying to contest sea then park a culvs by the coast whilst you setup your navy

[Jaeger]

We all know it's very difficult to fight water when your opponent has fully upgraded warships with 3000 hp and 100+ attack etc etc when you haven't even touched water yet.

What if we added the upgrades to a building like the Arsenal, so you could upgrade your boats before going water? They would ofc also be in the dock, so you don't need an arsenal if you're already setup on water. I think this would help a lot in making water a bit easier to combat though.

Thoughts?

I don't see why not

[zoom]

Interesting idea. How about Castle/Outpost or Castle/Foundry or TC?

[Garja]

How about they remain in the dock as they are warship upgrades?

[n0el]

I think the game would be much more interesting if the arsenal was a must have building. Tweaking techs available there and potentially adding more.

[edeholland]

How about they remain in the dock as they are warship upgrades?

Fair enough. And enable players to build a dock on land so they can research the tech.

[Garja]

Or...leave it to them to build a dock on water before it's too late.

[SoldieR]

I get the idea, but it seems like just a way to try to help land meta "bots" beat water even tho they didn't contest it for the first 15 min of a game.

[Garja]

If there is any issue with dock upgrades is just that they take too long.
This is relevant not only when one player want to catch up but also whenever one player decides to invest more to fight sea. By the time the ups are completed the theme of the game has often changed into a land battle or else and those resources are wasted. Also because they take so long you usually need extra docks to keep the warship production going. Admiralty card doesn't exactly solve this problem and it's also a bad change since TWC civs have almost no use for that card now.

I think the game would be much more interesting if the arsenal was a must have building. Tweaking techs available there and potentially adding more.

This is a completely different point tho. And btw arsenal already have that incendiary grenades up which is great for its cost.

[deleted_user0]

I get the idea, but it seems like just a way to try to help land meta "bots" beat water even tho they didn't contest it for the first 15 min of a game.

you shouldnt have to contest water in order to beat a water player on a map that's not of the indonesia type. If you can beat full land by going full water, but you can't beat full water by going full land, then there's a problem. And currently the latter isn't really possible. Hence, there's a problem. Sure, you can beat water players by contesting water, and that should also be possible, but it shouldn't be your only choice. Unless ofc, it's a map where water is the main feature around which the map is designed, like indochina or indonesia etc.

[SoldieR]

Difference of opinion. Mine: if there is a significant amount of water on a map and Player A ignores it completely, Player A should lose, if Player B uses water and holds well enough on land.

In other words, the player that goes land and water deserves to beat the player that goes land only.
Of course this depends on the aggressiveness of each players strat.

PS: there's no such thing as full water, as you start with a tc on land

[Luciofrancosi]

I think that nerfing dock attack would make contesting water a lot easier, maybe even reducing the cost of warships may help!! I just think that being able to garrison fishing boats and on top of that send a card that increases dock attack by 100% means that the player on water doesn't even have to train warships or ship them as the docks will do all the work!!