Anyone knows any good AoE3 You Tubers?

[dansil92]

Iirc from the old heaven games forums someone did a full comparison showing that russian units are 20% weaker BUT upgrade on the full original stats bringing imperial russian musks only the 20 hitpoints and 5 attack weaker but still 20% cheaper making them the most cost effective in the game. Russia is so very good lategame because even though the eco is average the units are super cheap so the later the game goes the more cost effective they get. Russia struggles in supremacy simply because they lack a decent answer to skirm goon where cost is the limiting factor. Instantaneous training is only super relevant in games where you will actually send your train time cards

[DracoWolfgand]

No, I mean, they are-Cheaper-Then normal Musketeers, but... I was talking specifically in terms of population efficiency. And honestly, on this regard... Unless there was a part of your math that I missed, Iiiii dont remember Russian Musketeers occupiyng less population space then the ones of any other civ.

On top of that, I was more looking at how good Russian musketeers are on the late game. Now, from what I understand, your math was done assuming just their default Colonial Age stats. I know games dont often get to the Industrial Age, but by this point, as Royal Guards and upgrade cards become more relevant, I assume the math will get more com... You are about to say there is no point using Musketeers on the Fortress Age forwards, arent you?

Population efficiency isn't really relevant to this discussion, because you aren't going to reach max pop in most games.

I used musks for my example because doing the comparison is easy (since Euros have the same unit). The same phenomenon is even more dramatic for strelets and cossacks, which do have upgrade cards and are more likely to make an appearance in the late game.

Cossacks are great. Strelets are... You know, I have split feelings on then. By default, they are worse then the Russian Skirmisher... But they also have more cards dedicated to upgrading then the Russian Skirmisher.

But anyway, the original point of the discussion was not as much to compare Russian Musketeers to the Musketeers of other civilizations as it was to compare the Russian Musketeer to the Russian Tartar Cavalry Archer. Basically, SamuraiRevolution believes there is no point on using Cavalry Archers as the Russians when you could be using Musketeers instead, and I... Disagree, as I believe that, in the handful of circunstances where the Royal Guard upgrade actually becomes relevant, Tartars are just a all-around superior lategame unit. I could explain why, but honestly, if I did I would be just repeating myself by this point, sooooo... Errr... What are-Your-Thoughts on Russian Musketeers vs Russian Cavalry Archers?

[Papist]

Pretty sure the main reason Russian lategame is good is not because the unit is good but more because it’s so easy to stay at max pop when your units train instantaneously.

That too, but I thought Draco was talking about sup, when that isn't usually a factor.

[dansil92]

No, I mean, they are-Cheaper-Then normal Musketeers, but... I was talking specifically in terms of population efficiency. And honestly, on this regard... Unless there was a part of your math that I missed, Iiiii dont remember Russian Musketeers occupiyng less population space then the ones of any other civ.

On top of that, I was more looking at how good Russian musketeers are on the late game. Now, from what I understand, your math was done assuming just their default Colonial Age stats. I know games dont often get to the Industrial Age, but by this point, as Royal Guards and upgrade cards become more relevant, I assume the math will get more com... You are about to say there is no point using Musketeers on the Fortress Age forwards, arent you?

Population efficiency isn't really relevant to this discussion, because you aren't going to reach max pop in most games.

I used musks for my example because doing the comparison is easy (since Euros have the same unit). The same phenomenon is even more dramatic for strelets and cossacks, which do have upgrade cards and are more likely to make an appearance in the late game.

Cossacks are great. Strelets are... You know, I have split feelings on then. By default, they are worse then the Russian Skirmisher... But they also have more cards dedicated to upgrading then the Russian Skirmisher.

But anyway, the original point of the discussion was not as much to compare Russian Musketeers to the Musketeers of other civilizations as it was to compare the Russian Musketeer to the Russian Tartar Cavalry Archer. Basically, SamuraiRevolution believes there is no point on using Cavalry Archers as the Russians when you could be using Musketeers instead, and I... Disagree, as I believe that, in the handful of circunstances where the Royal Guard upgrade actually becomes relevant, Tartars are just a all-around superior lategame unit. I could explain why, but honestly, if I did I would be just repeating myself by this point, sooooo... Errr... What are-Your-Thoughts on Russian Musketeers vs Russian Cavalry Archers?

Because you can train musketeers instantly, they make excellent fodder for keeping your pop at 200, annoying an opponent, and rebuilding forts. Cav archers are a dedicated unit very specialized in taking down melee cav and artillery. The melee resist, extreme tankiness (more than any non-elephant ranged cav), home city upgrades+arsenal+royal guard, ability to tank artillery fire, and increased mobility vs musks makes them a far superior unit in most regards once imperial age is reached (though still taking 2 pop which can be a bit of a limiting factor).
In most supremacy matches you wont reach that point, making the musketeer generally your all around unit for early to midgame russia.

[P i k i l i c]

My post actually did not even mentioned Mahout Lancers. Now, if you want to have a conversation about Mahouts, you are free to do that, just... Well, if you watched Samurai video about the Indians, you will see that he actually enjoys using then( And Elephants in general ) as much as I do, if not more so. ... So, if your point is suppose to be that I shouldnt criticize a more experienced player, well, I guess I ough to be using more Mahouts, then!

In all seriousness, I am not claiming to be some kind of professional. It is simply that, when I mention a specific unit, or tactic, that I prefer to use, I actually prefer explaining why I prefer to use this tactic, rather then going "Take my word for it, I know what I am talking about.". So, I prefer that, when responding to my posts on the future, you respond to the points I make on the post as in opposed to my perceived lack of experience or points that I have made on a different topic on the past. With that said, if you would like to explain to me, be it on the form of a post or even show me on a recorded game, just why Russian Musketeers are awesome and you should always use then over Tartar Cavalry Archers, and the same thing goes for Indian Howdahs versus Zamburaks, naturally I am all ears.

Thank you for your answer. I was actually not speaking about your post above, but your posts in general, and that's why I didn't quote you, but mentioned you instead. I seems like you always like discussions and not take what you say for granted, which is nice. My main point is: you can trust what people say here, most are much better than you (and than me, btw)

[Shikari]

I've actually been meaning to make some videos like this for a long time. I even have full scripts/images/footage. Just haven't had the time to really invest into finding a good video editor that doesn't cost me $99999999999999 and learning how to use it :(

Just pirate Sony vegas mitoe. I want those vids..

[Kaiserklein]

Russian Skirmisher

What

[DracoWolfgand]

I somehow completely forgot Russians lack Skirmishers altogether :p. I dont know why I keep making these slip-ups....

[HUMMAN]

Well its better to have %20 more stat with paying %25 more. The stronger you are, more durable your units, less space occupied(for meleeing cav, rusket not great against cav) and more fire range obtained(since u have few units). You can even argue you pay %20 more house-pop for the lack of stat, 2w per unit.