So... Germany OP.

[Mitoe]

So Germany was played 11 times in the NWC (not counting mirrors). They only won 4 games, and one of those was Hazza failing hard in age 1 with a 5:05 15CDB age up with no TP and a dead explorer while 2 more were with Kaiser’s mercenaries and the last vs my Japan (which is not a great civ) while I was playing super poorly. All other games were losses.

Still OP?

[deleted_user0]

How many games Germany reached fortress?
They were mostly played rather poor.

Kaiser "trolling" his way to easy victories with mercs are rather an argument in favour of opness, right ?

[zoom]

Wrong forum, probable duplicate thread. Thank Garja I'm no ESOC moderator!

[flontier]

It seems a pretty bad map pool for civ like ger or fr, they dont do bad of most of these map but almost everywhere it seems there is a better civ pick to do so i think they really suffer from that as well as fre (almost never picked exept by kaiser ?)

[charlemango]

I don't think Germans are OP, and don't think they should get nerfed. HOWEVER, tournament statistics have an obvious bias because of the counterpicking rules. So the fact that a low win rate exists only proves the existence of a counterpick civ, even though the OP civ could dominate every single other civ. For example, Brit for a long time was considered OP, but did not have a great win rate because the majority of matchups were: a) Brit mirror (50/50 obviously) b) Brit-India (50-50) or c) Brit-Russia (Brit getting counterpicked and dominated).

Likewise, most of these German losses are probably counterpicks. I don't remember all the games, but at least one was colonial German vs Otto on 5 tp map...

[macacoalbino]

Is it possible to fix water? Caravel ROF being broken and stuff like that is something much more urgent than germany atm or any other civ for that matter...

[Djigit]

That's not a very statistically significant sample

[zoom]

What surprised me most was the scarcity of Ottomans picks on New England, and of French picks, in general.

[Mitoe]

Wrong forum, probable duplicate thread. Thank Garja I'm no ESOC moderator!

Intentional. Find it gets more discussion in the general forum.

[Peachrocks]

Yeah. I took some stats of my own, though this was before the final day of play. Germany was the most picked civ easily and had the most mirrors but also one of the worst in terms of win rates. Sample size is a tad small of course but the thing is the players knew the map when picking the civ.

Another interesting stat though from games before the finals is that in all of German's games it was never used as a counterpick though my stat collection may be wrong. It was always used as a first pick either as the first match of the day or it was used when not knowing what the opponent would choose.

[n0el]

balanced

[deleted_user0]

We need @Goodspeed in here to explain why a few random matches dont mean shit.

[Riotcoke]

Give Germany four sw in colonial

[deleted_user0]

Give Germany four sw in colonial

Also +1 uhlan since that is ger civ bonus!

[Riotcoke]

Give Germany four sw in colonial

Also +1 uhlan since that is ger civ bonus!

+2 boss

[pecelot]

Wrong forum, probable duplicate thread. Thank Garja I'm no ESOC moderator!

Intentional. Find it gets more discussion in the general forum.

Mitoe Alaron presents: The Art of Clickbait.

[bwinner]

We need @Goodspeed in here to explain why a few random matches dont mean shit.

That's basic mathematics, but apparently too complex for low IQ ger players 21 :
If we assume that ger get 60% winrate overall aka they totally are OP and we pick 11 random games :
The probability to win 4 or less game is :

So the probability to get such result is about 18% wich, considering the number of this kind of sample we get, is absolutly not a proof that ger is not OP

[Sargsyan]

BEinstein

[Hazza54321]

Tournament games are obviously stupid when measuring balance. Civs that force mistakes i.e otto russia india, always perform well in tournies.

[zoom]

Is it possible to fix water? Caravel ROF being broken and stuff like that is something much more urgent than germany atm or any other civ for that matter...

Please elaborate.

[pecelot]

he probably means that cannon warships don't fire in at the same point in time spans, but rather randomly within them

[kami_ryu]

I don't think Germany is OP.

What would I know though at this point?

[deleted_user0]

We need @Goodspeed in here to explain why a few random matches dont mean shit.

That's basic mathematics, but apparently too complex for low IQ ger players 21 :
If we assume that ger get 60% winrate overall aka they totally are OP and we pick 11 random games :
The probability to win 4 or less game is :

CodeCogsEqn.png

So the probability to get such result is about 18% wich, considering the number of this kind of sample we get, is absolutly not a proof that ger is not OP

This.

Additionally, why is Hazza's noobing being mentioned in OP but not Prince losing to 3 hus shipment because aging 1 vill late?

And honestly, the map pool was quite poor for Germany as earlied mentioned. In addition what comes to my mind was Tabben's (in my opinion) quite poor rush into German FI which would have worked if he simply had winged hussars.
Consider also that we saw plenty of German mirrors in Kam which eliminated a lot of Germans from their main players. Then people kept picking them in such maps as Deccan (shouldn't be the case if for example Mitoe would do proper unit comp vs cease sepoy/urumi), High Plains and even vs iro in Baja California when Germans really shine in standard.

We saw 4 German mirrors in Kam, opening map. Coincidence? 5 if we include germ mirror in Deccan because Kam banned.

[Kaiserklein]

Prince didn't age a vil late. I aged a vil early. That's one of the advantages france gets over germany in that mu.

Anyway, yes it's not enough games to draw conclusions, and yes germany is strong. But you have to admit that for a civ which is considered to be "omg so op easily best civ", it didn't seem that op. People just exaggerate as usual

[Riotcoke]

Prince didn't age a vil late. I aged a vil early. That's one of the advantages france gets over germany in that mu.

Anyway, yes it's not enough games to draw conclusions, and yes germany is strong. But you have to admit that for a civ which is considered to be "omg so op easily best civ", it didn't seem that op. People just exaggerate as usual

The people who claim theres a German lobby on Esoc are themselves an anti-german lobby.