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so the uhlan nerf was a failure and an unnecessary change since people can bypass it.

Hardly unnecessary. Colonial uhlans die to one less hussar hit, but ok.

tedere12 wrote:how did germany suddenly become OP? I'm pretty sure ger france were considered top tier on the first EP versions (not OP tho) and then got nerfed. Now suddenly germany is op without being changed.

France was nerfed, russia was buffed a bit.
Meanwhile i think russia is stronger than france. Or at least it used to when i played.

Dsy wrote:

tedere12 wrote:how did germany suddenly become OP? I'm pretty sure ger france were considered top tier on the first EP versions (not OP tho) and then got nerfed. Now suddenly germany is op without being changed.

France was nerfed, russia was buffed a bit.
Meanwhile i think russia is stronger than france. Or at least it used to when i played.

Russia's only buff in current Ep is 17 strelets shipment switched to 20 strelets

deleted_user wrote:Hardly unnecessary. Colonial uhlans die to one less hussar hit, but ok.

not sure how relevant that is, since germany mostly goes for semi ff

tedere12 wrote:so the uhlan nerf was a failure and an unnecessary change since people can bypass it.

It wasn't unnecessary because without it skirm/uhlan would still be op, but yea people bypass it.

Russia got buffed btw, musketeers are les expensive.

tedere12 wrote:

Dsy wrote:

tedere12 wrote:how did germany suddenly become OP? I'm pretty sure ger france were considered top tier on the first EP versions (not OP tho) and then got nerfed. Now suddenly germany is op without being changed.

France was nerfed, russia was buffed a bit.
Meanwhile i think russia is stronger than france. Or at least it used to when i played.

Russia's only buff in current Ep is 17 strelets shipment switched to 20 strelets

deleted_user wrote:Hardly unnecessary. Colonial uhlans die to one less hussar hit, but ok.

not sure how relevant that is, since germany mostly goes for semi ff

Ruskets are cheaper

tedere12 wrote:

Dsy wrote:

tedere12 wrote:how did germany suddenly become OP? I'm pretty sure ger france were considered top tier on the first EP versions (not OP tho) and then got nerfed. Now suddenly germany is op without being changed.

France was nerfed, russia was buffed a bit.
Meanwhile i think russia is stronger than france. Or at least it used to when i played.

Russia's only buff in current Ep is 17 strelets shipment switched to 20 strelets

deleted_user wrote:Hardly unnecessary. Colonial uhlans die to one less hussar hit, but ok.

not sure how relevant that is, since germany mostly goes for semi ff

It's clearly relevant for more reasons than I stated.

[Armag] diarouga wrote:Yea, people used to go skirm/uhlan and never make a single WW (that was the H2O rule). Now people just go skim/jaeger/WW and it's even better than what the ger players used to do.

Hang on. Since WWs have been left untouched in the EP patch skirm/Jaeger/WW would be a strong alternative to skrim/uhlan (maybe better?) on the RE patch as well?

bepsi wrote:

[Armag] diarouga wrote:Yea, people used to go skirm/uhlan and never make a single WW (that was the H2O rule). Now people just go skim/jaeger/WW and it's even better than what the ger players used to do.

Hang on. Since WWs have been left untouched in the EP patch skirm/Jaeger/WW would be a strong alternative to skrim/uhlan (maybe better?) on the RE patch as well?

Yes. Both are as good with EP uhlans in my opinion, but I guess skirm/uhlan is easier.

[Armag] diarouga wrote:

bepsi wrote:

[Armag] diarouga wrote:Yea, people used to go skirm/uhlan and never make a single WW (that was the H2O rule). Now people just go skim/jaeger/WW and it's even better than what the ger players used to do.

Hang on. Since WWs have been left untouched in the EP patch skirm/Jaeger/WW would be a strong alternative to skrim/uhlan (maybe better?) on the RE patch as well?

Yes. Both are as good with EP uhlans in my opinion, but I guess skirm/uhlan is easier.

WW are so annoying though.

Skirm/uhlan isn't a thing in 90% of games. And WWs are still easily worse than goons

Ww are better at sniping falcs, and probably trade vs goons cost effectively

Sure they're better at sniping falcs and also vs musk/huss. They lose to goons though, and just get sniped down much faster by ranged units generally speaking. And they can get caught by a cav mass unlike goons and suck at kiting

Goons are much easier to use and better units, ww are just better vs musk and falcs, i think goons are better.

Aren't WW also more efficient vs tanky cav (cuirs, Mahout, Mams, etc.) than goons?

Why would they?

Don't WW have better dmg/cost?

Nah they dps almost exactly the same. 5 goons and 3 ww cost exactly the same 450f 450g, and 5 goons deal 5*22*1.2 = 132 while 3 wws deal 3*42 = 126 damage per volley.

I did the Math, and WW have about 12% more dmg/cost, meaning vs tanky cav they should be more efficient, as overkill becomes much less of a problem.
WW dmg/cost (0,14) Goon dmg/cost (0,122)

why did you do add *1.2 to the calculation of goon dmg @Kaiserklein ?

vet goons I guess.
Anyway WW in mass are pretty annoying. It's just lot of strong units against which you need lot of counter units and that opens up for weaknesses in opponent combo.

WW scale better with ups as well. Too bad their overkill on cav like huss sucks.

Ah ok. Man this aoe3 wiki source is tilting me. Always need to check if the stats refer to age 2 or 3.

amiggo1999 wrote:Ah ok. Man this aoe3 wiki source is tilting me. Always need to check if the stats refer to age 2 or 3.

The wiki is generally shit

Goons has marginally higher attack/res while WW has higher hp/res