ESOCommunity

In the esport games, pro players don't whine because it's their job, they have a coach most of the time, and they don't even have the right to type during the tournament games. In Starcraft II for instance, some guys even got warned for typing "glhf" because it is against the rules.
I think you also have to say "gg" (not sure about that though).

In the lower leagues however, I can tell you that Starcraft II players whine a lot more than aoe3 players, while there is no lag issue, the maps are perfectly symetrical and the balance is great.

[Armag] diarouga wrote:In the esport games, pro players don't whine because it's their job, they have a coach most of the time, and they don't even have the right to type during the tournament games. In Starcraft II for instance, some guys even got warned for typing "glhf" because it is against the rules.
I think you also have to say "gg" (not sure about that though).

In the lower leagues however, I can tell you that Starcraft II players whine a lot more than aoe3 players, while there is no lag issue, the maps are perfectly symetrical and the balance is great.

Doesn't make it any less off-putting and immature. And clearly there's a reason for those rules because of how much it just taints the game for players and viewers alike.

Maybe we should consider instituting that...

Podawe wrote:

[Armag] diarouga wrote:In the esport games, pro players don't whine because it's their job, they have a coach most of the time, and they don't even have the right to type during the tournament games. In Starcraft II for instance, some guys even got warned for typing "glhf" because it is against the rules.
I think you also have to say "gg" (not sure about that though).

In the lower leagues however, I can tell you that Starcraft II players whine a lot more than aoe3 players, while there is no lag issue, the maps are perfectly symetrical and the balance is great.

Doesn't make it any less off-putting and immature. And clearly there's a reason for those rules because of how much it just taints the game for players and viewers alike.

Maybe we should consider instituting that...

I'm not saying it makes it less immature, but it's not "fair" to claim that people don't do that in the other games, people do, unless they're progamers.

I don't really think that it's possible to add such a rule, people admins aren't going to enforce it. If someone types "lag" in the middle of a game, what are you going to do ? Give the win to the opponent lol ? Or if a guy starts complaining after he lost the last game of a series, what can you do, admins surely can't ban him from the next tournaments.

Also part of the reason why the community thinks the top players are too salty is because the top players interact with the community in aoe3.

In Starcraft II, you won't ever see a top player post on a community forum to discuss strategy lol.
And the twitch chat flamers (who are usually not top players) are actually way more toxic than the top players.

[Armag] diarouga wrote:

Podawe wrote:

[Armag] diarouga wrote:In the esport games, pro players don't whine because it's their job, they have a coach most of the time, and they don't even have the right to type during the tournament games. In Starcraft II for instance, some guys even got warned for typing "glhf" because it is against the rules.
I think you also have to say "gg" (not sure about that though).

In the lower leagues however, I can tell you that Starcraft II players whine a lot more than aoe3 players, while there is no lag issue, the maps are perfectly symetrical and the balance is great.

Doesn't make it any less off-putting and immature. And clearly there's a reason for those rules because of how much it just taints the game for players and viewers alike.

Maybe we should consider instituting that...

I'm not saying it makes it less immature, but it's not "fair" to claim that people don't do that in the other games, people do, unless they're progamers.

I don't really think that it's possible to add such a rule, people admins aren't going to enforce it. If someone types "lag" in the middle of a game, what are you going to do ? Give the win to the opponent lol ? Or if a guy starts complaining after he lost the last game of a series, what can you do, admins surely can't ban him from the next tournaments.

Also part of the reason why the community thinks the top players are too salty is because the top players interact with the community in aoe3.

In Starcraft II, you won't ever see a top player post on a community forum to discuss strategy lol.
And the twitch chat flamers (who are usually not top players) are actually way more toxic than the top players.

I never claimed that people don't do it in other games.

Also, the AOE3 community is no where near the size of the StarCraft community, so I don't think it's fair to compare.

But again, that still doesn't address the issue.

lol some clueless things being posted here

Was talking to a friend from France yesterday about how AOE3 was the greatest game and that the only big problem that Microsoft needed to fix in this game was the lag and then we could go back to playing it again.
But no chance Microsoft will do this and another game like AOE3 will not be made again, because it was only popular with a very niche public. AOE3 was not popular with any main audience of either AOE2 or SC2, they both disliked it. The AOE2 crowd disliked it because it was too fast and different, which is what made it so great in my view.
When I first started playing AOE3 I too found it too fast and was still trying to play it slow and boomy like boring AOE2, but then when I discovered PvP and how people actually played it for realz, that's when I gradually realised there was a much better, fast-paced way of playing it. That's why so many AOE2 boomers never got into this game, they were never willing to learn a new way of playing an RTS, they wanted that immersive, boomy, boring atmosphere they were used to from AOE2.

So yeah, we agreed that Microsoft will just do the commercial thing with AOE4, make it like AOE2 because that will please the crowds. And AOE3 will remain like a fortunate, accidental result of a gamble that Ensemble once made and that will probably not happen again. Nobody's doing creative and innovative gambles anymore, everyone's playing it commercially safe now.

Dolan wrote:Was talking to a friend from France yesterday about how AOE3 was the greatest game and that the only big problem that Microsoft needed to fix in this game was the lag and then we could go back to playing it again.
But no chance Microsoft will do this and another game like AOE3 will not be made again, because it was only popular with a very niche public. AOE3 was not popular with any main audience of either AOE2 or SC2, they both disliked it. The AOE2 crowd disliked it because it was too fast and different, which is what made it so great in my view.
When I first started playing AOE3 I too found it too fast and was still trying to play it slow and boomy like boring AOE2, but then when I discovered PvP and how people actually played it for realz, that's when I gradually realised there was a much better, fast-paced way of playing it. That's why so many AOE2 boomers never got into this game, they were never willing to learn a new way of playing an RTS, they wanted that immersive, boomy, boring atmosphere they were used to from AOE2.

So yeah, we agreed that Microsoft will just do the commercial thing with AOE4, make it like AOE2 because that will please the crowds. And AOE3 will remain like a fortunate, accidental result of a gamble that Ensemble once made and that will probably not happen again. Nobody's doing creative and innovative gambles anymore, everyone's playing it commercially safe now.

This is such a huge shame though. I’ve played some AOE2 campaign and that was it because I found the game so extremely long winded and boring. That’s my personal opinion anyway. I just found it so slow and unenjoyable, or maybe I just didn’t understand the game very well.

Then I came across AOE3, and the game took up a lot of hours in my teenage years because I was just in love with the game.

[Armag] diarouga wrote:In the esport games, pro players don't whine because it's their job, they have a coach most of the time, and they don't even have the right to type during the tournament games. In Starcraft II for instance, some guys even got warned for typing "glhf" because it is against the rules.
I think you also have to say "gg" (not sure about that though).

In the lower leagues however, I can tell you that Starcraft II players whine a lot more than aoe3 players, while there is no lag issue, the maps are perfectly symetrical and the balance is great.

Also part of the reason actual pro players dont whine as much is because you don't get to the highest level of a popular esport with the attitude of "I lost because of the game", but rather with the attitude of "What can I do next time to beat this." Not to say that pro players never whine, but their attitude towards the game and mentality is different than many aoe3 "pros".

They don't whine because if there's anything broken in the game they're playing professionally, they abuse it to secure a win too. Pros will use anything that is within the rules to get a win. You play for wins and money, so why waste time whining, it's just a job.

CuCkO0 wrote:This is such a huge shame though. I’ve played some AOE2 campaign and that was it because I found the game so extremely long winded and boring. That’s my personal opinion anyway. I just found it so slow and unenjoyable, or maybe I just didn’t understand the game very well.

Then I came across AOE3, and the game took up a lot of hours in my teenage years because I was just in love with the game.

I'm still happy that AOE3 happened.

Srsly, balance issues never really bothered me that much, it was lag that was the biggest dealbreaker. I could deal with patch imbalances without complaining much, but lag, game freezes, OOS in the middle of a battle, all this was too much and it made me feel I was wasting my time so many times, I eventually pulled down the blinds and moved on to other games.

Hopefully DE can fix some of the issues that older games have and we'll see from there. Official dev support is what we need the most. AOE2DE guys will complain about patches bringing new bugs in but they don't realize how good it is to even have someone patching the game in the first place.

iNcog wrote:Hopefully DE can fix some of the issues that older games have and we'll see from there. Official dev support is what we need the most. AOE2DE guys will complain about patches bringing new bugs in but they don't realize how good it is to even have someone patching the game in the first place.

haha, you should take a look at pubg subreddit these days.

Not interested. Obviously some devs will do better than others

iNcog wrote:

vividlyplain wrote:

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edeholland wrote:

iNcog wrote:

edeholland wrote:

vividlyplain wrote:

iNcog wrote:You could probably make more aggressive metas with maps too. but when we get those people complain

there's honestly no point to making maps for this community or donating time to help run events, etc

What is this gatekeeping? There are so many reasons for doing stuff for the community. I get that you had some bad experiences when creating maps, but you are still enjoying the content the community produces, so there definitely is a point to keep doing it.

Ede, you need to realize that it can be very draining to help out. There are many good reasons to help out, it's very fulfilling, but it's a double-edged sword. If you put hours of work into maps only to get a few people talk mad shit about them, how is that going to feel good? It feels like a waste of time. Our mapmakers have always been the butt of criticism that is slightly too vehement imo.

I do understand it can be very draining, I didn't deny that. I'm responding to his point that there is "no point in donating time" which is not true.

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iNcog wrote:

vividlyplain wrote:

iNcog wrote:You could probably make more aggressive metas with maps too. but when we get those people complain

there's honestly no point to making maps for this community or donating time to help run events, etc

why

for many reasons (maybe i shouldn't care about most of it) the fulfillment is outweighed by the drama and bullshit

i have enough "draining" me in real-life i don't need a stressful hobby too

I feel ya brother. Well just take a break from the draining part of it (which is being productive) and just enjoy the community a bit. :)

idk how anyone finds enjoyment in this community tbh

vividlyplain wrote:

iNcog wrote:

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vividlyplain wrote:

edeholland wrote:

iNcog wrote:

edeholland wrote:

vividlyplain wrote:

iNcog wrote:You could probably make more aggressive metas with maps too. but when we get those people complain

there's honestly no point to making maps for this community or donating time to help run events, etc

What is this gatekeeping? There are so many reasons for doing stuff for the community. I get that you had some bad experiences when creating maps, but you are still enjoying the content the community produces, so there definitely is a point to keep doing it.

Ede, you need to realize that it can be very draining to help out. There are many good reasons to help out, it's very fulfilling, but it's a double-edged sword. If you put hours of work into maps only to get a few people talk mad shit about them, how is that going to feel good? It feels like a waste of time. Our mapmakers have always been the butt of criticism that is slightly too vehement imo.

I do understand it can be very draining, I didn't deny that. I'm responding to his point that there is "no point in donating time" which is not true.

iNcog wrote:

vividlyplain wrote:

iNcog wrote:You could probably make more aggressive metas with maps too. but when we get those people complain

there's honestly no point to making maps for this community or donating time to help run events, etc

why

for many reasons (maybe i shouldn't care about most of it) the fulfillment is outweighed by the drama and bullshit

i have enough "draining" me in real-life i don't need a stressful hobby too

I feel ya brother. Well just take a break from the draining part of it (which is being productive) and just enjoy the community a bit. :)

idk how anyone finds enjoyment in this community tbh

sorry to hear that :/ sometimes it's hit or miss

shit rolls downhill @iNcog

ugh, this is true. I don't have ESOC in mind when I'm agreeing with you but other stuff in life right now. but, yes.

in terms of AOE stuff though there are some good developments in the works. we can't let setbacks of today prevent us from getting more enjoyment down the line. sometimes you need to step away and consolidate instead of trying to make the most of today. it's a tricky thing to do

You guys should check out the League of Legends community and then come tell me how nice the AoE3 community is.

minimoult21 wrote:You guys should check out the League of Legends community and then come tell me how nice the AoE3 community is.

LoL isn't even that bad. The weak link in a 3v3 team game is just as likely to get flamed as a feeder in LoL, in my experience.

Not even close bro

Except there's no report tool in AOE3 and in AOE3 you're not stuck in a lost game for at least 15 minutes, usually a lot more since nobody wants to resign early, especially if they got one kill and think they will carry.

What makes LoL most infuriating is this lack of options to leave a game at any point you want. If you go afk, you're reported and get punished for afk. In AOE3 you can resign whenever you want at no cost, except your mates' opinion. In LoL, you are stuck wasting time in a game that is lost and which makes everyone bitter and projecting all their frustration onto the easiest targets. So, very often you have to play it out for more than 20 minutes, even though the game was obviously lost in the first 10 minutes, when most lanes lost, you got no drake, mid tourret is already down and the enemy is already fed and roaming through your jungle. And despite all this, they still don't want to FF and will keep playing for 20 more minutes or a lot more.

Oh and there are also the fun parts of the game, when Yasuo can kill you with only 2 kills and you have 10. He can also block your ult with a tornado, a cheaper ordinary spell basically. And the game is full with this crap that makes no sense. Champs blocking ults with regular spells. Champs that can kill you even if you're insanely fed and they have like 2 kills and one item. And on top of this, you get the usual chaotic team that doesn't come to get drakes, junglers that don't gank and just farm, people playing with 5000 ping who keep disconnecting, etc. At least they connect back right at that second when the nexus is sieged.

Yeah, it doesn't even come close to AOE3.

Somehow i came to the point...

It is just a game... No one is missing me here or there so whats the point.... it is just internet.
When i want to play i go play... everyone should do what they want in the right time and not overspend any thing... Hava a real life have frinds have a job have a bf or gf read a book meditate make sports what ever... there are plenty better things for your health then playing all day long aoe3

ps this might be my last post on this forums if anyone is interessted

Have a great day

I personally miss you, @QueenOfdestiny you've done a lot for aoe3 and were a good presence for us

Yeah tbh it was funny when Queen was casting with Kaiser. It was one of my favourite casting duos, just because of the bants and random stuff.

Also, I think most people here have a life outside AOE3 or gaming in general. It's just that often people play games to have some fun at the end of the day or at weekends. And when you come home from work or just have to have some fun playing a game and that turns out to be more work and negativity, then it sucks.

I feel like any game with built in voice chat is gonna be inherently more toxic than aoe, at least in my experience.