Best / Most Useful Mercenaries?

[Jotunir]

Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

[chris1089]

Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

They cost your notes, your spare change, and half of the mortgage on your house.

[LegalPenguin]

I love Ronin.

[duckzilla]

Fusiliers are okay. They are better than Imperial Musketeers, but available in colo. Of course, they have to cost a shit ton of coin. Any upgrade cards for Muskets that you might have will scale on these imperial stats.

Flint lock? Is +15hp for usual muskets, but +30hp for Fusiliers
Paper cartridge? is +3.45dmg for muskets, but +10.5dmg for Fusiliers
Military drummers? is +0.4 speed for muskets, but +0.55 speed for Fusiliers

If they were any cheaper, Swedes would be even more absurd than they are anyway. Especially when one takes into account their merc combat card (+20% hp/dmg) and the imperial aging bonus (+50% hp/dmg) which combined with all other upgrades, allows the fusilier to become pretty much an imperialized imperial unit.

[Jotunir]

Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

They cost your notes, your spare change, and half of the mortgage on your house.

Well for Dutch that is no problem, and also they have the infinite fusilier card. It makes them cost 200 gold each + 1 shipment, which is considerably better than paying 300 gold for one at the saloon if, and only if, you get them. The only clear advantage of having them in the saloon is that you can have them in Fortress, although at that point, it will suck you dry of .
Germans have an even better offer at 100 gold each + 1 shipment, but it is a one time only card and they generally have less gold available than Dutch.
Still, we are speaking of industrial mercs for the most part, most games end before that.

[ShinkuroYukinari]

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Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

They cost your notes, your spare change, and half of the mortgage on your house.

Well for Dutch that is no problem, and also they have the infinite fusilier card. It makes them cost 200 gold each + 1 shipment, which is considerably better than paying 300 gold for one at the saloon if, and only if, you get them.

Actually, it's less efficient than training them normally. 2000 coin, plus the baseline cost of a shipment in Age4, which is 1600 resources. You actually pay 3600 in opportunity+resource cost for them, making it 360 coin per fusilier.

[Jotunir]

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Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

They cost your notes, your spare change, and half of the mortgage on your house.

Well for Dutch that is no problem, and also they have the infinite fusilier card. It makes them cost 200 gold each + 1 shipment, which is considerably better than paying 300 gold for one at the saloon if, and only if, you get them.

Actually, it's less efficient than training them normally. 2000 coin, plus the baseline cost of a shipment in Age4, which is 1600 resources. You actually pay 3600 in opportunity+resource cost for them, making it 360 coin per fusilier.

But you have them guaranteed. You are also paying for that. As Dutch, you need them for your late game army composition if the game goes that far. You cannot rely only on the luck of the draw.

[deleted_user]

they get 3 shot by a TC tho so,

[ShinkuroYukinari]

Show hidden quotes

Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

They cost your notes, your spare change, and half of the mortgage on your house.

Well for Dutch that is no problem, and also they have the infinite fusilier card. It makes them cost 200 gold each + 1 shipment, which is considerably better than paying 300 gold for one at the saloon if, and only if, you get them.

Actually, it's less efficient than training them normally. 2000 coin, plus the baseline cost of a shipment in Age4, which is 1600 resources. You actually pay 3600 in opportunity+resource cost for them, making it 360 coin per fusilier.

But you have them guaranteed. You are also paying for that. As Dutch, you need them for your late game army composition. You cannot rely only on the luck of the draw.

Given their insane cost and Dutch lategame gold issues, I'd rather focus on Halbs with Cannons or Skirm-Ruyter. Potentially some outlaws if income is an issue, given how pop inefficiency is less of an issue for a civ with 50 extra mil pop.

[Jotunir]

Show hidden quotes

Garbage*

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

They cost your notes, your spare change, and half of the mortgage on your house.

Well for Dutch that is no problem, and also they have the infinite fusilier card. It makes them cost 200 gold each + 1 shipment, which is considerably better than paying 300 gold for one at the saloon if, and only if, you get them.

Actually, it's less efficient than training them normally. 2000 coin, plus the baseline cost of a shipment in Age4, which is 1600 resources. You actually pay 3600 in opportunity+resource cost for them, making it 360 coin per fusilier.

But you have them guaranteed. You are also paying for that. As Dutch, you need them for your late game army composition. You cannot rely only on the luck of the draw.

Given their insane cost and Dutch lategame gold issues, I'd rather focus on Halbs with Cannons or Skirm-Ruyter. Potentially some outlaws if income is an issue, given how pop inefficiency is less of an issue for a civ with 50 extra mil pop.

How about Halbs, cannons and fusiliers? It generally works much better than just halbs and cannons.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_arms

[Le Hussard sur le toit]

Why would you need fusilliers as Dutch late game ? Ruyters+skirms or halbs/skirms/falcs sounds great.

[Jotunir]

Why would you need fusilliers as Dutch late game ? Ruyters+skirms or halbs/skirms/falcs sounds great.

Personal choice, I consider that Fusiliers "pack a punch" much more than Skirms. I still use skirms though, it is just that I like to complement them with something spicier.

[Kaiserklein]

Fusiliers are okay. They are better than Imperial Musketeers, but available in colo. Of course, they have to cost a shit ton of coin.

Available in colo only for sweden and if you send a card.
They cost more than 3 musks. And 3 musks >> 1 fusilier. They're not okay

Any upgrade cards for Muskets that you might have will scale on these imperial stats.

Flint lock? Is +15hp for usual muskets, but +30hp for Fusiliers
Paper cartridge? is +3.45dmg for muskets, but +10.5dmg for Fusiliers
Military drummers? is +0.4 speed for muskets, but +0.55 speed for Fusiliers

This is really flawed logic. You can't just compare the stats gained on 1 fusilier to those on 1 musk, since musks are 3 to 4 times cheaper. Flint lock is 45 hp on 3 musks, which is more than 30 hp... Can't count like that anyway.
The only good thing is that upgrades for fusiliers scale on fortress stats, even in colo. But garbage fortress stats are still bad when upgraded.

Why do you think that? They replace musketeers for the civs that lack them.

Civs that don't have musketeers usually don't need musketeers, you don't need a replacement, especially in fortress.
Fusiliers are just bad vs basically everything. Skirms melt them. They lose rather hard to most musk type units. They're a mediocre anti cav because their hp and melee damage / multiplier are just bad. They do soft counter goons but that's about it. They obviously have extra speed too, but that just doesn't win fights because of the shitty stats.

Well for Dutch that is no problem, they have the infinite fusilier card for late game. It makes them cost 200 gold each + 1 shipment, which is considerably better than paying 300 gold for one at the saloon if, and only if, you get them.
Germans have an even better offer at 100 gold each + 1 shipment, but it is a one time only card and they generally have less gold available than Dutch.
Still, we are speaking of industrial mercs, most games end before that.

No one wnats to ship infinite mercs in late game instead of upgrades. Also no one wants fusiliers in industrial


tl;dr: 1 highlander > 1 fusilier, despite costing 100 less gold. They don't have the speed and the multiplier vs goons, but they have everything else, so...

[Riotcoke]

Fusiliers are damn dogshit

[Jotunir]

Civs that don't have musketeers usually don't need musketeers, you don't need a replacement, especially in fortress. Fusiliers are just bad vs basically everything. Skirms melt them. They lose rather hard to most musk type units. They're a mediocre anti cav because their hp and melee damage / multiplier are just bad. They do soft counter goons but that's about it. They obviously have extra speed too, but that just doesn't win fights because of the shitty stats.

I disagree with your assessment, they do have very high damage output and they are a valuable adition to any army.
Skirms should melt them, they are anti infantry units...
They lose to Highlanders only, and that is because they have extra hp.
Also, their high speed should help you choose favourable matchups, raid their eco, etc.

No one wnats to ship infinite mercs in late game instead of upgrades.

Sometimes, adding some extra mercs is really useful, specially if you are pushing or being excessively pushed back, more so than upgrades. It is highly situational.

Fusiliers are damn dogshit

No they are not.

[gibson]

Fusiliers sucks ass, end of story. Think about it this way, one mine gives you enough gold for 6 units.

[Jotunir]

Fusiliers sucks ass, end of story. Think about it this way, one mine gives you enough gold for 6 units.

I think with banks in mind, not only mines.
Also, as I said before, I would rather ship them, it is a better deal overall.

[chronique]

@Jotunir you have the right to like a garbage units (i like rams), probleme here is you say that this unit can be use at a competitive level. Theirs stats are bad for theirs cost, there are always better option, and everybody with a better level told you that this unit sux.

Don't be stubborn at this point and move on.

[aaryngend]

You guys are crazy trying to convince someone who:

a) uses all his energy to diss aoe3:DEleted
b) has a friggin' Fusilier as his avatar

[Jotunir]

You guys are crazy trying to convince someone who:

a) uses all his energy to diss aoe3:DEleted
b) has a friggin' Fusilier as his avatar

I have it as my avatar because it's my favourite unit.

@Jotunir you have the right to like a garbage units (i like rams), probleme here is you say that this unit can be use at a competitive level. Theirs stats are bad for theirs cost, there are always better option, and everybody with a better level told you that this unit sux.

Don't be stubborn at this point and move on.

Rams do suck hard. Fusiliers are much better.

[deleted_user]

the rhode island rams don't suck hard

[Kaiserklein]

I disagree with your assessment, they do have very high damage output and they are a valuable adition to any army.

They do not. Let's say they cost as much as 3.5 musks, and that's vet musks in fortress. 1 fusilier is 70 damage, 3.5 vet musks is almost 100 damage. And 300 hp to 630 total hp.
I know we can't really maths like that, notably because of drop off, but still the difference is huge. Fusiliers have shit stats.

Skirms should melt them, they are anti infantry units...

They kill them twice as fast as they kill most musks, that's the point...

They lose to Highlanders only, and that is because they have extra hp.

I guess we aren't playing the same game, if your fusiliers only lose to highlanders lol. Like I explained they lose to any ranged infantry and any musk. They lose to cannons. They don't hard counter goons nor cav. They hard counter pikes I guess..?

Also, their high speed should help you choose favourable matchups, raid their eco, etc.

Sure, I acknowledged that. That's basically the only good thing about the unit. Doesn't nearly make up for all its horrible aspects.

Sometimes, adding some extra mercs is really useful, specially if you are pushing or being excessively pushed back, more so than upgrades. It is highly situational.

No. Shipping this dogshit unit instead of training more industrial, carded units? And instead of shipping useful late game upgrades? Never. Plus you have to wait 1 whole minute for them to come, gl holding a push with that.


For the record, I probably played more games with fusiliers (or any merc for that matter) than anyone else here. And I can tell you I'm unhappy when I get them in the saloon, because it's a game losing merc in so many MUs. Gl beating any civ with strong infantry (or tbh any civ at all) with that unit.
It's just fun to play with it because it's so fast and trolly, and you can outplay yiour opponent. But it's inherently garbage.

[Jotunir]

I disagree with your assessment, they do have very high damage output and they are a valuable adition to any army.

They do not. Let's say they cost as much as 3.5 musks, and that's vet musks in fortress. 1 fusilier is 70 damage, 3.5 vet musks is almost 100 damage. And 300 hp to 630 total hp.
I know we can't really maths like that, notably because of drop off, but still the difference is huge. Fusiliers have shit stats.

Skirms should melt them, they are anti infantry units...

They kill them twice as fast as they kill most musks, that's the point...

They lose to Highlanders only, and that is because they have extra hp.

I guess we aren't playing the same game, if your fusiliers only lose to highlanders lol. Like I explained they lose to any ranged infantry and any musk. They lose to cannons. They don't hard counter goons nor cav. They hard counter pikes I guess..?

Also, their high speed should help you choose favourable matchups, raid their eco, etc.

Sure, I acknowledged that. That's basically the only good thing about the unit. Doesn't nearly make up for all its horrible aspects.

Sometimes, adding some extra mercs is really useful, specially if you are pushing or being excessively pushed back, more so than upgrades. It is highly situational.

No. Shipping this dogshit unit instead of training more industrial, carded units? And instead of shipping useful late game upgrades? Never. Plus you have to wait 1 whole minute for them to come, gl holding a push with that.


For the record, I probably played more games with fusiliers (or any merc for that matter) than anyone else here. And I can tell you I'm unhappy when I get them in the saloon, because it's a game losing merc in so many MUs. Gl beating any civ with strong infantry (or tbh any civ at all) with that unit.
It's just fun to play with it because it's so fast and trolly, and you can outplay yiour opponent. But it's inherently garbage.

I get your point, I still think they are awesome and the trolly potential is outrageous. One thing that I would like to point out is that you should compare them to 2 musketeers since they occupy 2 pop. This reminds me of the old "Ruyters are lame" thread.
I prefer quality over quantity.

[gibson]

For the record, I probably played more games with fusiliers (or any merc for that matter) than anyone else here.

bold statement, thoughts @Riotcoke @deleted_user4 @me

[Jotunir]

For the record, I probably played more games with fusiliers (or any merc for that matter) than anyone else here.

bold statement, thoughts @Riotcoke @deleted_user4 @me

He has a love-hate relationship with them, that explains it.