Toxic chat and the bullying of our best players are killing the comunity

[spanky4ever]

Go watch some sc2 then @Gichtenlord

notification

- or be more continuing here.

[Dolan]

Remember what you have. You have probably hundreds of hours put in from contributors every week. Yes hundreds.

Imagine how it was for me when I invested months of work in the previous forum (on proboards) and then have admin account removed from me. Then I made that thread in which I explained what happened, and like 80% of the community started mocking me or deprecating my contribution.

That's when I realised no such project is worth investing so much work for free.

So, @everyone

notification

stop whining, it's the internet, you don't like it, you have that "x" in the top corner. Click it, there you go, all the problems are solved.

[Diarouga]

Remember what you have. You have probably hundreds of hours put in from contributors every week. Yes hundreds.

Imagine how it was for me when I invested months of work in the previous forum (on proboards) and then have admin account removed from me. Then I made that thread in which I explained what happened, and like 80% of the community started mocking me or deprecating my contribution.

That's when I realised no such project is worth investing so much work for free.

So, @everyone

notification

stop whining, it's the internet, you don't like it, you have that "x" in the top corner. Click it, there you go, all the problems are solved.

Yeah, I guess people are biased because they only read ESOC's official version

[lordraphael]

Anyway, I don't see why we should cry because garja leaves and blame the people would flamed him but not the other way.

Because people who flame him like you are here but the contributors to the community are leaving.

im just curious has Garja actually said anywhere why he leaves ? Could just be that he has Real life stuff to take care off, temporarily lost interest in the game, Picked up another game or is done with gaming altogether. Did he actually say: " Guys im out because i get flamed so much "?
Dont get me wrong i would totally understand him if that were the case, because flaming against him has been absurd for like more than a year, basically he was flamed when i cameback to aoe and it only got worse. Altho he provokes it with his behaviour aswell, hes not as innocent as some want to paint him, I agree flaming isnt the right way, there are other ways of handling persons you dislike, like ignoring them. THats what i try to do , just ignore the guys that get you mad and youre golden, if more people followed this rule we would have a lot less problems.

[spanky4ever]

Remember what you have. You have probably hundreds of hours put in from contributors every week. Yes hundreds.

Imagine how it was for me when I invested months of work in the previous forum (on proboards) and then have admin account removed from me. Then I made that thread in which I explained what happened, and like 80% of the community started mocking me or deprecating my contribution.

That's when I realised no such project is worth investing so much work for free.

So, @everyone

notification

stop whining, it's the internet, you don't like it, you have that "x" in the top corner. Click it, there you go, all the problems are solved.

Yeah, I guess people are biased because they only read ESOC's official version

I dont know that past @Dolan

notification

I dont know if that was your name then- but I know u are still here. For some reason you want to protect what we have, and not wach it crumble?

[deleted_user0]

Garja = not toxic but quite funny who always takes everything to the extreme + a huge complainer. Easily provokable. Easy to make fun of.

H2o= Completely toxic person (especially in private chats) who shows disrespects to many members. Bad manners ingame and can't accept losing. Not surprised he gets -rep sometimes.

Riki= Made bad maps and had troubles taking critique but otherwise ok guy I guess

Interjection= dunno, probably quite friendly guy + decent caster (but sux ingame XD)

[Rikikipu]

I'm going to talk about me, but I think this is the same for other members in the team.
Personally I got decent amount of free time, and I love this game. Though I've stopped a bit to produce content because overall I'm tired by a lot of complaints. This is not that I think my work or maps are great. This is just that I'm really opened to constructive criticism whereas I just keep reading sometimes

Code: Select all

"This map is bs my 4th hunt is too far"
 "this map sux there isn't tp"
 "this map sux there is a tp"
 "this map sux there is water"
  "this map sux there is only one started gold mine"
 

A lot of negative comments without good arguments. I'm even more upset that I like when people help me and give me advices when I make maps so there is just no reason to be rude like this.
Some players, (top players overall) should understand that making perfect maps is not easy like making perfect balance is not easy. At the end, we should all keep in mind that our shared goal is that we want this awesome game alive and funny as much as possible.

[Diarouga]

Anyway, I don't see why we should cry because garja leaves and blame the people would flamed him but not the other way.

Because people who flame him like you are here but the contributors to the community are leaving.

im just curious has Garja actually said anywhere why he leaves ? Could just be that he has Real life stuff to take care off, temporarily lost interest in the game, Picked up another game or is done with gaming altogether. Did he actually say: " Guys im out because i get flamed so much "?
Dont get me wrong i would totally understand him if that were the case, because flaming against him has been absurd for like more than a year, basically he was flamed when i cameback to aoe and it only got worse. Altho he provokes it with his behaviour aswell, hes not as innocent as some want to paint him, I agree flaming isnt the right way, there are other ways of handling persons you dislike, like ignoring them. THats what i try to do , just ignore the guys that get you mad and youre golden, if more people followed this rule we would have a lot less problems.

He said he leaves because he has other stuffs to do actually.
By the way, I totally understand that I was an asshole with him, but as you pointed out, he was also extremly provocative by his behaviour, so he's not a victim lol.

[spanky4ever]

@Diarouga

notification

I would say so 2 when this community is no longer attractive to spend most of your free time on - cos whatever you do - its WRONG

[rosebud]

I agree with H2O. He's the best player of aoe3 and I think he knows better than us. I feel bad for Garja who is also a very good player. I don't think people should laugh at very good players. If they are good, it's because they deserved it. They worked hard. I've been playing aoe for five month and this kind of behavior is absolutly disgusting. I registered on this website just to share this.
@Gichtenlord

notification

seriously, your nobody. As H2O said, dont waste your time writing stupid posts.

[spanky4ever]

maybe you cold make OP maps now @Diarouga

notification

??

[pecelot]

I don't know, Osmane is weird, I've never been bad with him, and he's always acted nicely when I was here but like a dick in my behinds

Anyway, I don't see why we should cry because garja leaves and blame the people would flamed him but not the other way.
A lot of people also don't want to play with garja (Osmane included).

I really dont like you language, and the way you are talking ppl down! Take a look at yourself - cos you are making such toxic statements! Pleace - Diarouga - you could be a good person for the comunity- start being one

The community doesn't deserve me

Indeed, you should definitely leave us, master, to find the place to shine with your amazing skills!

Btw. I beg to distinguish pure hate and friendly banter, don't be oversensitive, like for example @benj89

notification

already said. Some people in the community are quite symbolic and they ask to be memed sometimes, I don't think it's wrong at all.

[iNcog]

we should smite trolls and have them submit to TRUE AUTHORITY

Dont know what you are saying here? More words would be helpfull - maybe

i'm hardly saying anything really. if anything however, i'm wondering what you would propose to fix people being idiots. because that's what you're talking about there: curing stupidity

you can maybe ask people to try to be better to each other but i don't really think that helps either, if anything its adding fuel to the fire

i agree with the gist of your post, obviously. i'm fine with some nice flaming here and there, but constant, incessant shit-talk is dumb as shit.

[lordraphael]

Show hidden quotes

I don't know, Osmane is weird, I've never been bad with him, and he's always acted nicely when I was here but like a dick in my behinds

Anyway, I don't see why we should cry because garja leaves and blame the people would flamed him but not the other way.
A lot of people also don't want to play with garja (Osmane included).

I really dont like you language, and the way you are talking ppl down! Take a look at yourself - cos you are making such toxic statements! Pleace - Diarouga - you could be a good person for the comunity- start being one

The community doesn't deserve me

Indeed, you should definitely leave us, master, to find the place to shine with your amazing skills!

Btw. I beg to distinguish pure hate and friendly banter, don't be oversensitive, like for example @benj89

notification

already said. Some people in the community are quite symbolic and they ask to be memed sometimes, I don't think it's wrong at all.

Imo we should all take watch the election reports in the USA. Watch and learn how well individuals treat each other in real life !!!!

[edeholland]

I feel like this community without trolls you describe is very hard to achieve on the internet. There is fun in trolling and a bit of flaming but only to a certain level, and that's one that's really hard to discover. I really don't like people being actually toxic, but most of the time I feel people should also be able to take it a bit less seriously.

When people really feel bad and less motivated because of things like the chat, we crossed the line, because I think nobody has the intention of actually making people feel bad, they just want to have fun. So when people have genuine complains and are not responsible for it, we should definitely moderate it.

TL;DR: A bit of banter is fine. If you cross the line, we will have to moderate (maybe we should have done it more, but I haven't heard a lot of genuine complains, only people trolling back). If your intention is crossing the line, go fuck yourself.

[spanky4ever]

we should smite trolls and have them submit to TRUE AUTHORITY

Dont know what you are saying here? More words would be helpfull - maybe

i'm hardly saying anything really. if anything however, i'm wondering what you would propose to fix people being idiots. because that's what you're talking about there: curing stupidity

you can maybe ask people to try to be better to each other but i don't really think that helps either, if anything its adding fuel to the fire

i agree with the gist of your post, obviously. i'm fine with some nice flaming here and there, but constant, incessant shit-talk is dumb as shit.

Im really glad for your response - not being a troll one! I suggested that we as prospectors of the shenanigans - have a voice - to say - this is not OK. I really think that is the best cure!

[edeholland]

I agree with H2O. He's the best player of aoe3 and I think he knows better than us. I feel bad for Garja who is also a very good player. I don't think people should laugh at very good players. If they are good, it's because they deserved it. They worked hard. I've been playing aoe for five month and this kind of behavior is absolutly disgusting. I registered on this website just to share this.
@Gichtenlord

notification

seriously, your nobody. As H2O said, dont waste your time writing stupid posts.

Sorry to say this, but on this forum your skill doesn't matter for shit. What matters is your attitude. I'm not calling names, but if a very good player is behaving bad we will take action all the same, and so should we.

[Gendarme]

@benj89

notification

's post brings up a good point. How dare we call ourselves adults if we get offended by nothing?

This whole thread reminds me of a short dialogue between me and @Darwin_

notification

on another topic, but it could just as well have been this one:

Show hidden quotes

Shows how much Age of Empires and its main players have aged.

I hope this is sarcasm.

Nah its just like how we started the game in 2005 as like 10-15 year olds just screwing around, but now we're 20-25 and still screwing around, but just in different ways you know?

Sure, but it's not like this thread is reflecting our maturity. Quite the opposite.

Lol quite true

Having that said, I think most of you guys here are offended by people flaming Garja/Ryan/Interjection more than they themselves are. I do not think that Garja left the community because he feels offended. Lack of support is a totally different thing. If the joys of being a part of the community is that he gets to entertain the viewers of his stream, create balanced maps for all of us, and contribute with his knowledge on the forum - but he doesn't see that people appreciate what he's doing, then clearly there's no joy for him anymore.

I am rather new to ESOC, so I don't know Diarouga's past, but I have not seen a single bad thing he has done since he returned, and has already contributed a lot - but people seem to be offended by him somehow (?). I think if half of ESOC made fun of Diarouga's French accent, while still appreciating his contributions, it would be totally fine for him, but if nobody made fun of him but instead ignored his contributions and gave no fucks about what he had to say about Aztecs and other things, he would quit this game in a heartbeat.

We enjoy the community, because we get to see high quality content, play, and learn. The top players enjoy the community because they get to produce high quality content and be appreciated by the rest of the community for their efforts.

Now, I don't even know if there's a lack of appreciation in general. Perhaps there was regarding Garja, because so many people expressed their hatred towards the maps and not a lot of people actually appreciated them publically. But it is possible that Garja left for totally other reasons. But I think if there is a problem, the problem is lack of support, and not "flaming".

[rosebud]

I agree with H2O. He's the best player of aoe3 and I think he knows better than us. I feel bad for Garja who is also a very good player. I don't think people should laugh at very good players. If they are good, it's because they deserved it. They worked hard. I've been playing aoe for five month and this kind of behavior is absolutly disgusting. I registered on this website just to share this.
@Gichtenlord

notification

seriously, your nobody. As H2O said, dont waste your time writing stupid posts.

Sorry to say this, but on this forum your skill doesn't matter for shit. What matters is your attitude. I'm not calling names, but if a very good player is behaving bad we will take action all the same, and so should we.

I don't agree. I think H2O deserves more respect then a random player. He is also the biggest contributor of ESOC. Besically all very good players contribute more than anyone else. Plus I know no good player that behave bad. So imo skill matters.

[spanky4ever]

@Gendarme

notification

please look to my original post! Garja has been ridiculed and flamed for mounts now. I think its shamefull

[Gichtenlord]

I agree with H2O. He's the best player of aoe3 and I think he knows better than us. I feel bad for Garja who is also a very good player. I don't think people should laugh at very good players. If they are good, it's because they deserved it. They worked hard. I've been playing aoe for five month and this kind of behavior is absolutly disgusting. I registered on this website just to share this.
@Gichtenlord

notification

seriously, your nobody. As H2O said, dont waste your time writing stupid posts.

You know, I hate discussions which are one sided. It's important to show the pros and cons. All I have shown are possible reasons why people dislike/hate the people mentioned in iwillspankykou's opening post.
Excusing someones actions, just because he contributed a lot for the community is wrong. I can still question his behavior.

About the stupid posts, why do you have to be always serious. Sure sometimes these "stupid" posts like I did in the beginning are annoying, but a forum where there is just seriousity is boring. If you look for a more serious/strict forum go to http://www.teamliquid.net

@iwillspankyou

notification

Why do you like like rosebuds post, but also then like Edehollands post, which is pretty much the counter-argument

[Gendarme]

@Gichtenlord

notification

Because iwillspankyou hates discussions which are one sided.

[spanky4ever]

I agree with H2O. He's the best player of aoe3 and I think he knows better than us. I feel bad for Garja who is also a very good player. I don't think people should laugh at very good players. If they are good, it's because they deserved it. They worked hard. I've been playing aoe for five month and this kind of behavior is absolutly disgusting. I registered on this website just to share this.
@Gichtenlord

notification

seriously, your nobody. As H2O said, dont waste your time writing stupid posts.

You know, I hate discussions which are one sided. It's important to show the pros and cons. All I have shown are possible reasons why people dislike/hate the people mentioned in iwillspankykou's opening post.
Excusing someones actions, just because he contributed a lot of the community is wrong. I can still question his behavior.

About the stupid posts, why do you have to be always serious. Sure sometimes these "stupid" posts like I did in the beginning are annoying, but a forum where there is just seriousity is boring. If you look for a more serious/strict forum go to http://www.teamliquid.net

@iwillspankyou

notification

Why do you like like rosebuds post, but also then like Edehollands post, which is pretty much the counter-argument

I really dont know what u are talking about - all I know is that 21 ppl has agreed to my origin post - go fig

[Gichtenlord]

@Gichtenlord

notification

Because iwillspankyou hates discussions which are one sided.

One was a simple insult to me, while the other one was more of a post to defend me. Kinda feels weird to agree to both

[spanky4ever]

@Gichtenlord

notification

Because iwillspankyou hates discussions which are one sided.

One was a simple insult to me, while the other one was more of a post to defend me. Kinda feels weird to agree to both

go in peace