Discussion: Cherokee native upgrade

[bwinner]

theyre bad skirms, but actually theyre more like better xbows with guns. they have only 16 range. theyre one of the better nats though, i think. but 60w/60f is still quite expensive.

cherokee seminole rush was quite scary on nilla, but thats because they could beat cav start lol XD u got more + no negative multiplier

Also the fact that the nativ shipment was nerfed on TAD

[aligator92]

Playing vs Port and Aztec PR 0s....
Diarouga = noobbasher confirmed

[[Armag] diarouga]

Here is the new meta build.

[deleted_user0]

i thought you would never play aoe anymore...

[[Armag] diarouga]

i thought you would never play aoe anymore...

Not competitively. Here I'm just doing fun builds.

[Hazza54321]

Hes still the best umeu dont worry

[[Armag] diarouga]

No, but I still own 90% of the good builds Kappa

[deleted_user0]

I sell patented rouga builds. Free Civs and Maps included! Contact me on my smurf: PrinceofKabul

[rsy]

New India mirror build btw
rouga build copyright ©

Lol I've been using Cherokee with India for ages gtfo

@Mitoe might remember when I played cohenski's sioux and he was obsing

[_H2O]

Mitoe has been big on getting that tp for the 4 vils as well. Surprised you don’t list this in the analysis as if you build the TP you should get 4 vils for sure.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Not sure if you should always get the 4 vills, because some civs can't afford it. With India you definitely should get the vills though. I delay the market for the 4v in my India build.

I didn't list it, because getting the vills needs a different build order as you need 200 more wood, while the discussion was mostly about doing a normal build order while using the market up discount.

[[Armag] diarouga]

New India mirror build btw
rouga build copyright ©

Lol I've been using Cherokee with India for ages gtfo

@Mitoe might remember when I played cohenski's sioux and he was obsing

Yes, but he didn't have the rouga copyright, so it is basically irrelevant. In 10 years, people will remember this as one of the rouga builds.

[Gendarme]

@supahons France vs Germany is the same MU as Germany vs France, so there are only 105 MUs, not 196.

[Hazza54321]

Wouldnt india be one of the civs that cant afford it

[[Armag] diarouga]

Wouldnt india be one of the civs that cant afford it

No, because when you go for the 600w/300e build you can afford to spend 200 extra wood. Also it's not really extra wood, since you safe more than 400w thanks to the market upgrades.
I'd say that Germany and France can't really afford it unless they skip a TP or send 700w before 4cdb (which might be worth btw).

[fei123456]

Wouldnt india be one of the civs that cant afford it

No, because when you go for the 600w/300e build you can afford to spend 200 extra wood. Also it's not really extra wood, since you safe more than 400w thanks to the market upgrades.
I'd say that Germany and France can't really afford it unless they skip a TP or send 700w before 4cdb (which might be worth btw).

Germany with free amalgamation tech is insane.

[deleted_user0]

Wouldnt india be one of the civs that cant afford it

No, because when you go for the 600w/300e build you can afford to spend 200 extra wood. Also it's not really extra wood, since you safe more than 400w thanks to the market upgrades.
I'd say that Germany and France can't really afford it unless they skip a TP or send 700w before 4cdb (which might be worth btw).

probably it is, if you didn't start age1 market (or maybe even if u did) you get a tp in trans. then you get the a mili building + the nat tp with 400w. you send 700w and build houses + market (if you hadn't already) and you save 200w for the 4v tech. then you ship 4cdb or 3sw and those come around the same time as the 4v from the nat post + you have all market ups when they're out as well. it would be good on arkansas i guess, in mu's where you want to go greedy, yet you won't want to upgrade the tp line cuz somsone else also has 1 or more tps.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Wouldnt india be one of the civs that cant afford it

No, because when you go for the 600w/300e build you can afford to spend 200 extra wood. Also it's not really extra wood, since you safe more than 400w thanks to the market upgrades.
I'd say that Germany and France can't really afford it unless they skip a TP or send 700w before 4cdb (which might be worth btw).

probably it is, if you didn't start age1 market (or maybe even if u did) you get a tp in trans. then you get the a mili building + the nat tp with 400w. you send 700w and build houses + market (if you hadn't already) and you save 200w for the 4v tech. then you ship 4cdb or 3sw and those come around the same time as the 4v from the nat post + you have all market ups when they're out as well. it would be good on arkansas i guess, in mu's where you want to go greedy, yet you won't want to upgrade the tp line cuz somsone else also has 1 or more tps.

I considered it, and it can be viable. However, with food or gold starts you want to build the market in age 1, which makes the native market discount weaker so it's a bit awkward.
Also you're going to delay the 4cdb (or 3sw) shipment, which sucks.

[deleted_user0]

i dunno if it makes it that much weaker tbh, you would just lose out on the 50w for hunting dogs. and delay placermines + steeltraps a little, but considering that you don't have that many vils at that time, it's not that big of a deal I think. obviously yeah, if you were just getting the market tech, it would be probably not worth the effort, but the fact that you can sneak an extra 4v in there, considering it's like a shipment for some civs so worth an abstract 700 res, I think it's worth it. but ofc, it's kinda niche, it heavily depends on the mu. but I can see it being good with ep sioux as well. u drop tp + stable with 400w, ship 700w, get more teepees + market and then u get +4v and ship 5v and u get woodless market tech, even though it's just 2 tech, the 4v is nice. maybe don't even need the market tech thing, although at that point, why not. sioux is always kinda strapped for wood.

[Djigit]

Does thish work for stagecoach?

[deleted_user0]

probably would delay one or the other too much. either stagecoach will be late or market/tp will be late, so I think not. if u get stagecoach i would just get the tp for the 4v later on and get market normally.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Getting the 4v later on isn't an option, because it means you're going to pay 400w/200c for 4v which is way too much in middle game. You'll be busy trying to take the map back after you get stagecoach.

[rsy]

Does thish work for stagecoach?

I tried the tp shipment that sends u a tp and reduces cost by a little bit. Would build normal tp with the first shipment and instead of distributivism send 600w followed by 300 export/600c/2.35 wood trickle. Cherokee tp with market upgrades in transition. Sets u up for stagecoach possibility with the 600w. If not stagecoach then caravanserai, consulate, 200w 200c Cherokee tech for 4v and proceed in age 2 to get map control and then get stagecoach. Or else just 600w 600c age up with the Cherokee 4v tech.

I noted that when I was trying to age up with the 600w followed by 600c i usually didnt have enough resources to get imperial bureaucracy and still age at a respectable time

[Ashvin]

Is it Karni Mata which helped him gather resources as much as you did?

[Djigit]

Is it Karni Mata which helped him gather resources as much as you did?

Combined with French consulate.