MM'ing blockhouses

[Amsel_]

As Russia, it's one of those things that makes me rage hard. It's also not a very fun way for matches to end. But I don't think anything needs to be changed. As Russia, there should be risk for extending so far across the map. As the defender, there should be a reward for gathering information from scouting. It also seems fine from a realism perspective, so long as you imagine minutemen as villagers who picked up a rifle to defend their town. They would, by definition, be more powerful than someone who's just a builder.

If you want to do this sort of strat as China, I would recommend disciples over sentries and irregulars. Disciple rushes and super-aggressive early play actually isn't that bad against Russia.

[Papist]

It isn't inherently that powerful and only works if your opponent isn't paying attention. In light of that, why should it be nerfed? Sure it means gg on the off chance it works but that's true for every cheese strat.

[Kaiserklein]

Well you shouldn't be able to win the game in age 1 imo, even if it's cheese. Also there are situations where you lost your explorer as russia, which means that in theory, if you want to play it safe, you simply cannot fb at all lol. Like the simple threat of an mm call that you can't see coming with your explo would be enough to deny a fb. Isn't this dumb?

[Sargsyan]

well it doesn't mean its an auto lose, I've lost a game against an opponent of same skill by mm'ing his fb and killing 2 vills. yes i know, I'm bad

[_H2O]

Basically calling mm is cheese and lame. Cheese, because in theory your opponent should have his explorer between his bh and your base, so that he can see the mm coming and pull his vils back, which means at best you trades your mm for like 150w and denying his fb, and that's not a good trade imo since it slows down your build too and you won't have mm anymore. And lame, because if it does work it's kinda gg and it just ruins the match up, as russia (or some other civs) sort of need their fb to win in most match ups.

It's just a very boring move imo. Though I know getting rushed every game by russia is boring too lol. Anyway I'd like mm to have a multiplier vs vils too, probably just x0.5 like asian mm.

A little drunk as a comment before the response. Some people do Aggro things like build a blockhouse as close as possible while their explorer is either dead or out of position. Either way, calling mm is not a cheese response. Your own explorer can be used to confirm the mm. This leads to countering aggression. This also means keeping your explorer alive and aware in age 1 is critical. That shows how deep the game could be if people were trying.

[Ashvin]

I think a little more than a little drunk

[zoom]

Anyone else do this when the opportunity presents itself? I've tried it as China a few times mainly because I hate the MU, but I'm not sure if it's worth it if it only kills 1 vill and forces/delays the BH back a bit.
What do you consider the break-even point be; when would you do it?
Or do you think its gay and lame and MM should have a negative multiplier or something?

Over Garja's dead body!

[deleted_user0]

Agree with mankle. If playing safe and having explorer scouting, you can be quite certain to not lose vills and then mm is a bad investment.
Making blind anus blockhouse is a risk you take. Tho, it's a bit dumb to mm shit in unrated games as you basically just wasted 5 minutes of your time as the game is over if losing all fb vills and block.

[edeholland]

Leave mm as they are, if anything buff them to not lose hp overtime

What, why? Why would they need to be even stronger? They already have a significant impact of the game.

[harcha]

Well you shouldn't be able to win the game in age 1 imo, even if it's cheese. Also there are situations where you lost your explorer as russia, which means that in theory, if you want to play it safe, you simply cannot fb at all lol. Like the simple threat of an mm call that you can't see coming with your explo would be enough to deny a fb. Isn't this dumb?

you can make max fwd wall and bh a bit back. taking some precautions means that russia would prob lose just 1 vil which should be a fine trade

[ShinkuroYukinari]

This is one of those moves similar to deleting your agra fort before your aztecs opponent destroys it. It's borderline bug abuse and definitely not an intended feature of the game, but it's there so you can use it.

I seem to be out of the loop, can you explain?

[Kawapasaka]

This is one of those moves similar to deleting your agra fort before your aztecs opponent destroys it. It's borderline bug abuse and definitely not an intended feature of the game, but it's there so you can use it.

I seem to be out of the loop, can you explain?

Deleting your units or buildings if they're about to die can negate the Aztec WC's XP aura bonus at no real cost to yourself. Of course with units in a fight this would require a completely inhuman level of micro and any attempt to exploit it would probably cause far more harm than good to your own army. But in the case of buildings, particularly wonders due to the massive XP bounty (I think killing an age 2 wonder for Aztec is like 2/3 of mercantilism or something ridiculous like that) this can actually be impactful.

[Hazza54321]

I think if u delete any building in aura of wc then azzy should get the bonus xp

[[Armag] diarouga]

This is one of those moves similar to deleting your agra fort before your aztecs opponent destroys it. It's borderline bug abuse and definitely not an intended feature of the game, but it's there so you can use it.

I seem to be out of the loop, can you explain?

Deleting your units or buildings if they're about to die can negate the Aztec WC's XP aura bonus at no real cost to yourself. Of course with units in a fight this would require a completely inhuman level of micro and any attempt to exploit it would probably cause far more harm than good to your own army. But in the case of buildings, particularly wonders due to the massive XP bounty (I think killing an age 2 wonder for Aztec is like 2/3 of mercantilism or something ridiculous like that) this can actually be impactful.

This is big with TPs an shrines because you often kill these. It's especially frustrating when you get the 50/50/50 x3 exp upgrade just before you kill that building and your opponent deletes it. That's cheating honestly.

[Guigs]

Show hidden quotes

This is one of those moves similar to deleting your agra fort before your aztecs opponent destroys it. It's borderline bug abuse and definitely not an intended feature of the game, but it's there so you can use it.

I seem to be out of the loop, can you explain?

Deleting your units or buildings if they're about to die can negate the Aztec WC's XP aura bonus at no real cost to yourself. Of course with units in a fight this would require a completely inhuman level of micro and any attempt to exploit it would probably cause far more harm than good to your own army. But in the case of buildings, particularly wonders due to the massive XP bounty (I think killing an age 2 wonder for Aztec is like 2/3 of mercantilism or something ridiculous like that) this can actually be impactful.

This is big with TPs an shrines because you often kill these. It's especially frustrating when you get the 50/50/50 x3 exp upgrade just before you kill that building and your opponent deletes it. That's cheating honestly.

Just add this to tourney rules honestly

[Aizamk]

I support the petition to ban collen and mitoe from deleting all their units and resigning

[harcha]

it's about time we get together to bring a gift for mitoe

[Shikari]

I was so tired of loosing to forward bh so I did call the mm for the first time. I honestly came while killing his 3 bills explorer and bh.