Dutch TR40 Build orders

[gro74]

Seems like there's a lot of room for variability when using Dutch for treaty. The video guides I have seen were quite different and I notice that not everyone uses South Sea Bubble (coin-to-wood trade card).

I'm interested in seeing some good videos or recordings that utilize different builds. Primarily with South Sea Bubble because I've been trying to find the most efficient way to use it.

If you feel strongly one way or the other about someone else's build order, please provide evidence for your argument in the form of videos, recs, or at least screen shots of your score at the 40 minute mark.

[_NiceKING_]

Dutch can now get pretty good score on FP (65 vills, improved bank gather rate), so you do not really need trade.

[gro74]

Dutch can now get pretty good score on FP (65 vills, improved bank gather rate), so you do not really need trade.

I believe you, but I generally play on RE.

[_NiceKING_]

Dutch can now get pretty good score on FP (65 vills, improved bank gather rate), so you do not really need trade.

I believe you, but I generally play on RE.

Well, it's gonna be hard for you to find good streams or vids for RE Dutch since most of the good players play on FP only.

[_NiceKING_]

Anyways, here is the old vid for Dutch boom from Stormcoming. No Trade, 1800+.

[spoiler=Part I]

phpBB [video]

[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Part II]

phpBB [video]

[/spoiler]

[Gichtenlord]

good old days of mediocre booms

[gro74]

Dutch can now get pretty good score on FP (65 vills, improved bank gather rate), so you do not really need trade.

I believe you, but I generally play on RE.

Well, it's gonna be hard for you to find good streams or vids for RE Dutch since most of the good players play on FP only.

That's fair, but at least an FP video/rec might help give me an idea of how to restructure the build for RE. But thanks for linking Storm's boom. Still would love to see other vids/recs of Dutch TR 40 booms if anyone wants to share.

[sdsanft]

Isn't Dutch really really bad in treaty anyways (like very bottom tier)?

[_NiceKING_]

Isn't Dutch really really bad in treaty anyways (like very bottom tier)?

Yup, they suck on RE.

[gro74]

Isn't Dutch really really bad in treaty anyways (like very bottom tier)?

Yup, they suck on RE.

150 mil pop is so much fun though But anyways that's not the point. I'm just looking for info on how to play Dutch very efficiently because it's fun and I like learning how to play all civs in the game. I'm sure I'm not the only one

So I'm not interested in shifting the topic to civ balance.

[_NiceKING_]

Isn't Dutch really really bad in treaty anyways (like very bottom tier)?

Yup, they suck on RE.

150 mil pop is so much fun though But anyways that's not the point. I'm just looking for info on how to play Dutch very efficiently because it's fun and I like learning how to play all civs in the game. I'm sure I'm not the only one

So I'm not interested in shifting the topic to civ balance.

[spoiler=Here is RE Dutch in fight ][video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMoXqMQL9YI[/video][/spoiler]

[pecelot]

good old days of mediocre booms

how have then improved? i mean where is the area of developing such BOs? I find it pretty straightforward and it just comes down to proper execution, but are the old builds really varying from the current ones?

[adderbrain5]

This is what I like to do...but as I just posted on another thread I'm just a noob.

Build a bank ASAP and do whatever you have to do to do it. That way from there on out vil production is pretty much sustained. Even hold off building a house if needed. Then I do market and techs, and age up to two. I stay in two long enough to build all banks, and usually create livestock pens full of sheep/cows. Sheep/cowing is the only real way for dutch to maintain a competitive economy if the TR fight drags on, and it's good to start early. You need far less vils on food that way, although it takes a bit of micro. Sometimes I even do the 1500 XP church thing to get your extra two banks card. At this point If I have teammates Ill have to fight off dickheaded assumptions that Im just a terrible noob for still being in age two while they are aging to 5, but I probably have 4k coin and food in the bank, so its on to 3, maybe build another TC depending on vil count, and age up to 4 with 50 vils with the +4 vil option so that you can have 54. Aging to 5 happens pretty quickly from the full age 2 boom. Id consider sending the wood trade at around 30 minutes or even earlier, that way you don't have to worry about wood the whole game. But usually I don't even use that card in my deck.

THE FIGHT....

dutch have to fight smart. Lose less units than him considering you are one of the few civ that really has a threat to drain in NR40. Win fast, overwhelming his population capabilities with lots of mortars with increased attack strength in addition to matching his military pop for pop. This may work vs 100 pop civs, or weak unit civs like china, but it is pretty hard to win vs france, or germany. Germany can just have enough resources to WW spam you after killing all settlers minus SW, french actually could too probably, but 120 fighting pop french still beats dutch pretty handily. I have been owned as dutch by a french skirmie halbred mixture, and frankly he could just kill 30 CDB and match ur pop. instant cur make it pretty hard to beat too because if he manages to kill all the halberds u have out its instant cur to the face...which rek skirmisher lines, and are too hard to run from with ruyter. ANYWAY GLHF

[_NiceKING_]

Actually France beats every single civ lol

[_NiceKING_]

Standard Dutch Boom

[spoiler=Show]Age I

As soon as you start, separate villagers on gold crates first (each on separate crate then shift click gold mine), quickly queue your first villager when you got 100 gold. Put 4 villagers on gold off the start. This 4 on gold is enough for you to keep constant villagers production.
Build a house.
For first bank, 2 vils on food, new villagers out on wood.
At 2 mins, you should have the first card waiting, send food trickle.
Build the first bank right when you have enough 350 food/350 wood.
Take 1 villager off gold after you finished building your first bank.
Send Exotic Hardwood card.
Build your 2nd bank and take all villager off gold and onto food since you will have enough gold pouring in through bank now.
Build a market, research first upgrade for wood/food. Also build a house before your villagers reach 20.
Build 2 more banks and take all villagers off wood and to food.
Send 2 extra banks card.
You should have enough 800 food to age up at 24 villagers. Go Age II with the 400 wood option.

Age II

Research market ugrade for wood/food.
Send Church card.
Your villagers should gather enough 1200 food and you have lots of gold from bank to go straight to Age III with fast age up.
Take 15 villagers off food and onto wood for town centers and banks in Age III.

Age III

Build 2 more TCs as soon as you're in Age III.
Research 2 extra banks in Church.
Research all gold upgrade in market.
Stay in 3rd age spreading villagers between wood and food (gold should be coming in through banks) until you have 8 banks built and 50 villagers made.
After reaching MAX villagers in Age III, Age up with the politician that gives you 4 Ruyters and 4 additional villagers. This will put you at a total of 54 villagers, 4 more than the limit of 50.
During aging switch more villagers to gold.

Age IV

Send Tulip Speculation card
Buy Mercantilism in Church for XP.
Send 2 Factories, research the gold upgrade in factory and keep them on gold.
Send Refridgeration card.
Aim for that 4000 food/4000 gold of Age V. Age up with 2000 gold option.

Age V

Build Capitol right away. Research Imperial upgrade for gold first [then wood and food] so you can build 2 more banks.
Now you have a total of 10 banks. Let's pray this should give you enough gold for unit upgrade, first army and a bit fighting till you can send plantation cards. ^^
Build 4 mills and 4 plantations, upgrade them.
Send Sustainable Agriculture and Food Silos card then start to work on mills.
Send important cards for your military first: Advanced Asernal, Fencing School, Cavalry School. Then remember to send 3 plantation cards as soon as possible for villagers to switch to plantation.

FIGHT

Dutch has to win by managing your military very cost effectively. Halberdier and Hussar will own your food eco very fast if you're not careful.
Ruyter/Skirm/Massive Artillery is really the way to go. But by training gold heavy combo, you will risk running out of gold even with banks and most villagers on gold. To sustain your economy, try your best to keep your artillery safe. Always have culverins out to kill enemy culverin aiming at your precious artillery, Horse Artilleries will bring you a favourable kill ratio with their splash damage while Mortars destruct your enemy home base. Remember to protect them the whole time so you don't have to waste 6k gold making them again.
However, if you find yourself losing artillery or just in a bad position: PULL BACK. You can't spam to the same spot to try and hold ground, because you'll get killed.
If you can keep your opponent's artillery to a minimum while maximizing your own artillery's lifetime, may the odds ever be in your favour!

source: http://aoeiii.wix.com/[/spoiler]

[gro74]

This is what I like to do...but as I just posted on another thread I'm just a noob.

Build a bank ASAP and do whatever you have to do to do it. That way from there on out vil production is pretty much sustained. Even hold off building a house if needed. Then I do market and techs, and age up to two. I stay in two long enough to build all banks, and usually create livestock pens full of sheep/cows. Sheep/cowing is the only real way for dutch to maintain a competitive economy if the TR fight drags on, and it's good to start early. You need far less vils on food that way, although it takes a bit of micro. Sometimes I even do the 1500 XP church thing to get your extra two banks card. At this point If I have teammates Ill have to fight off dickheaded assumptions that Im just a terrible noob for still being in age two while they are aging to 5, but I probably have 4k coin and food in the bank, so its on to 3, maybe build another TC depending on vil count, and age up to 4 with 50 vils with the +4 vil option so that you can have 54. Aging to 5 happens pretty quickly from the full age 2 boom. Id consider sending the wood trade at around 30 minutes or even earlier, that way you don't have to worry about wood the whole game. But usually I don't even use that card in my deck.

That's quite a different boom than I've seen used, but I like it! Could you post a rec? On average, what is your score the moment the treaty ends?

[_NiceKING_]

I stay in two long enough to build all banks, and usually create livestock pens full of sheep/cows.

ahahah cows/sheeps with Dutch

....You should aim to go to age 3 asap to build TCs instead of maxing banks in age 2.

[gro74]

....You should aim to go to age 3 asap to build TCs instead of maxing banks in age 2.

In the build you showed Storm stayed age 1 to build 4 banks. Could you demonstrate the build you're talking about now?

[_NiceKING_]

....You should aim to go to age 3 asap to build TCs instead of maxing banks in age 2.

In the build you showed Storm stayed age 1 to build 4 banks. Could you demonstrate the build you're talking about now?

That's the build I was talking about.

[dicktator_]

good old days of mediocre booms

how have then improved? i mean where is the area of developing such BOs? I find it pretty straightforward and it just comes down to proper execution, but are the old builds really varying from the current ones?

If we disregard Lukas (and me on a good day) booms didn't really improve much between 2011-2015. Stormcomings boom should be good. The era of mediocre booms was 2010 and earlier because people hadn't figured out the proper bos yet.

At the moment fp Dutch boom is exactly the same as re Dutch except you don't max vills in age 3 (you age to 4 asap) and you age with 1000 coin (vill age up was removed).

[adderbrain5]

I ONLY BUILD ONE BANK IN AGE 1, THE REST IN AGE 2. WELL SEE IF IT WORKS OUT THAT I EVER PLAY A DUTCH TR AGAIN ILL TRY TO POST IT LOL

[_NiceKING_]

I ONLY BUILD ONE BANK IN AGE 1, THE REST IN AGE 2. WELL SEE IF IT WORKS OUT THAT I EVER PLAY A DUTCH TR AGAIN ILL TRY TO POST IT LOL

5 banks in age 1 forever

[pecelot]

isnt the almighty quick 8 banks FF good enough?

[gro74]

isnt the almighty quick 8 banks FF good enough?

Quick?

[AOEisLOVE_AOEisLIFE]

people are still playing treaty ? in 2016 ? like is that still a thing ?