Age 1 card for ports?

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Tonga sdsanft
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Age 1 card for ports?

Post by sdsanft »

What's the best age1 card for ports? I know typically people either send eco theory of they just save a shipment so I was just wondering what the arguments are for each. Also, when is the explorer card viable? When used properly you can win age1 very hard and get lots of good treasures, plus it's much easier to contest an fb (think Russia if he only sends 2 vills). What are your guys thoughts.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

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Post by yemshi »

Hero card is the best ATP counter.
Dog doesn't have negative multiplier against vills and your hero can take the other one down with ease. Togheter with an own TP he should have 2 TP at MAX.
You might just send ATP yourself though...
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by macacoalbino »

Are we seeing the birth of a new meta? :D
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Diarouga »

ATP and schooners.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by lordraphael »

ye atp and schooners is easily worth 3 vills. Thats why port is OP in fact. Port is kinda balanced around people either skipping the age 1 card or sending eco theory. Just play a game on a non tp map or on a tp map and only make 1 tp at max while sending eco theory. Youll notice that they seem fairly balanced if you play like that, strong but not OP.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Diarouga »

lordraphael wrote:ye atp and schooners is easily worth 3 vills. Thats why port is OP in fact. Port is kinda balanced around people either skipping the age 1 card or sending eco theory. Just play a game on a non tp map or on a tp map and only make 1 tp at max while sending eco theory. Youll notice that they seem fairly balanced if you play like that, strong but not OP.

Yeah, that's why I suggested to remove schooners and ATP, because as you said, Port is balanced if they send eco theory. And anyway, they're not meant to age with 12vills, take 4 TPs, build a forward TC and spam unit shipments to keep the map. It should be a defensive civ.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Goodspeed »

300w underrated
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by pecelot »

300w I find good for aggression. I also like a lot the Navigator card on maps like Yukon or Hudson Bay/Saguenay.
Other than that, possibly 7 sheep or just skip the card and save for more in age 2.
The standard ones are ATP, schooners and eco theory.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Jaeger »

yemshi wrote:Hero card is the best ATP counter.
Dog doesn't have negative multiplier against vills and your hero can take the other one down with ease. Togheter with an own TP he should have 2 TP at MAX.
You might just send ATP yourself though...

Well just send explorer card and make 200w TP's yourself maybe
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by pecelot »

I think that's what he meant :!:
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by sdsanft »

@Diarouga why would you want to remove viable options? I like ports because they have multiple options in age 1, instead of getting rid of them, it would be better just to nerf atp and schooners (60w ships for schooners and maybe lower the hp of atps). Also, getting more viable age 1 options for other civs would be great too.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by CurassierAndCurassier »

S C H O O N E R S

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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

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Careful @CurassierAndCurassier you never know when a wild pecelot might appear
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Darwin_ »

300w is a good card, as it allows you to get 2 tps/tp+market during transition without any or much chopping. I normally dont like to TP on a 200w start with ports just because it normally forces you to go 14 vills, which slows down your age up a fair amount, and thus makes 2nd town center placement a bit more dangerous. Thus, I am left with 100w, so that +300w shipment allows me to either get 2 tps, or a tp and a market with hunting dogs and placer mines and only chop 25 wood.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Diarouga »

sdsanft wrote:@Diarouga why would you want to remove viable options? I like ports because they have multiple options in age 1, instead of getting rid of them, it would be better just to nerf atp and schooners (60w ships for schooners and maybe lower the hp of atps). Also, getting more viable age 1 options for other civs would be great too.

Because it's broken for example?
On the RE, Iro had 10 viable options, now they only have one and it's not even viable :P
My point is that watching ATP games is just not interesting, and op. They can take the map with their forward TC and spam unit shipments from here and hold any push, and if you don't try to contest the map (you won't get the map regardless actually), just get outboomed super hard.
Port is a defensive civ really, the optimal play should be eco theory and then eco play, not this ATP bs.

And well schooners with Port is just a joke, you spam vills from 6TCs and your opponent can't even break you lol.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by pecelot »

Darwin_ wrote:300w is a good card, as it allows you to get 2 tps/tp+market during transition without any or much chopping. I normally dont like to TP on a 200w start with ports just because it normally forces you to go 14 vills, which slows down your age up a fair amount, and thus makes 2nd town center placement a bit more dangerous. Thus, I am left with 100w, so that +300w shipment allows me to either get 2 tps, or a tp and a market with hunting dogs and placer mines and only chop 25 wood.

I don't think it's that unusual, you should generally utilise the benefit of additional wood at the beginning of the game. 13 vills I don't find that unnecessary, if you can sneak a quick age-up in match-ups versus aggressive civs — it's fine, but not necessary IMO. Losing your 2nd TC early on is rather impossible, unless you're super-late and your opponent goes for an extreme aggression, like shipping pikes first, which again is unusual and scoutable, so to speak.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Diarouga »

pecelot wrote:
Darwin_ wrote:300w is a good card, as it allows you to get 2 tps/tp+market during transition without any or much chopping. I normally dont like to TP on a 200w start with ports just because it normally forces you to go 14 vills, which slows down your age up a fair amount, and thus makes 2nd town center placement a bit more dangerous. Thus, I am left with 100w, so that +300w shipment allows me to either get 2 tps, or a tp and a market with hunting dogs and placer mines and only chop 25 wood.

I don't think it's that unusual, you should generally utilise the benefit of additional wood at the beginning of the game. 13 vills I don't find that unnecessary, if you can sneak a quick age-up in match-ups versus aggressive civs — it's fine, but not necessary IMO. Losing your 2nd TC early on is rather impossible, unless you're super-late and your opponent goes for an extreme aggression, like shipping pikes first, which again is unusual and scoutable, so to speak.

Aging with 13vills means that you have your 2nd TC 25sec earlier, and thus that you can take the map or start training vills 25sec earlier (=1 more vill).
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by pecelot »

On the other hand, instead of at the very beginning, you get your TP quite late. Also, with some wood treasures that you usually are able to grab it's not even that much chopping.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Diarouga »

pecelot wrote:On the other hand, instead of at the very beginning, you get your TP quite late. Also, with some wood treasures that you usually are able to grab it's not even that much chopping.

Oh you were talking about the TP, yes it's totally worth to age 14 then.
But like when you start with 100g, it's better to age 13 without market than 14 with market.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Darwin_ »

pecelot wrote:On the other hand, instead of at the very beginning, you get your TP quite late. Also, with some wood treasures that you usually are able to grab it's not even that much chopping.

Its 1/2 passes of xp vs. being much more likely to lose your second TC. I personally would rather be safer than have that little bit more of xp...

Personally I disagree with Diarouga on aging with 14 every time when you can get a TP. Unless you are going to place your tc fairly defensively, than I wouldnt go for 14 most of the time. You can go 14 in some matchups, but against brits/russia it can be very risky. Also, quick age ups are one of Ports strong-suits.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by pecelot »

I just don't see how you can normally lose a TC with the 14 vill age-up, unless you put up it super-offensively. It's certainly more than 2 passes, not to mention that later on you just get shipments quicker, have your resources sent sooner and age up faster, and in the end you get your 3rd TC sooner, too ;) And I don't really think that Ports age that much faster, they don't have any bonuses in age 1 — in fact, they lack vill shipments.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by yemshi »

They can send 3 shipments in a row anyway.
12/20 or even 11/20 is just better.
More map control, faster 400w, crates, faster 2nd TC vills, faster FF, faster ST.
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by Darwin_ »

pecelot wrote:I just don't see how you can normally lose a TC with the 14 vill age-up, unless you put up it super-offensively. It's certainly more than 2 passes, not to mention that later on you just get shipments quicker, have your resources sent sooner and age up faster, and in the end you get your 3rd TC sooner, too ;) And I don't really think that Ports age that much faster, they don't have any bonuses in age 1 — in fact, they lack vill shipments.

Ports can age before 4:10, something only challenged by 10/10 india, brits, and azzy. Sacrificing that age up for like 100 xp is not worth it IMO
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by pecelot »

100 XP?
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Re: Age 1 card for ports?

Post by tedere12 »

The war dog card>300w in any case imo. If they fb they lose vills, also they lose explorer and you get all treasures.

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