bullying

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Great Britain Riotcoke
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Re: bullying

Post by Riotcoke »

iwillspankyou wrote:
Riotcoke wrote:
Show hidden quotes

You weren't at lan, I was. Nobody took the twitch chat seriously because everyone understands people in twitch chat are ballsy as they themselves can't be judged. Meanwhile where it mattered everyone was nice and supportive of Garja.

I was there, in the stream, and it was not nice. And can I ask you :?: was it you who made got on to the flor, like praying for Allah :?: If not you, who was it :oops:

No that was Harrison not me
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Tuvalu gibson
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Re: bullying

Post by gibson »

Btw who the hell is harrison I keep on hearing about this person but I have no idea who he is
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Greece BrookG
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Re: bullying

Post by BrookG »

Can we not all chill and have fun? G is just a cool guy.
Correlation doesn't mean causation.
http://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations

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Re: bullying

Post by sebnan12 »

yea id be so pissed if someone praises me and lays down infront of me
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Greece BrookG
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Re: bullying

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Post by BrookG »

And btw Harrison is a brit guy that used to be fairly inactive in the forum and twitch chat, yet quite social in the LAN, but I hope that he has a larger activity in the community in the future
Correlation doesn't mean causation.
http://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations

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Re: bullying

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Post by spanky4ever »

I will be watching u, be nice, that's all :lol:
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Re: bullying

Post by spanky4ever »

if not, I will call u out. :uglylol:
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Great Britain Riotcoke
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Re: bullying

Post by Riotcoke »

Yeah as brook said Harrison was very social at lan and loud, but relatively inactive on the forums
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Re: bullying

Post by spanky4ever »

I hope if you show your ugly bullying face again, the mods will put you down. early
if that is so. I am contemt.
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Re: bullying

Post by spanky4ever »

BrookG wrote:And btw Harrison is a brit guy that used to be fairly inactive in the forum and twitch chat, yet quite social in the LAN, but I hope that he has a larger activity in the community in the future

thx for being a god mod at Sunday, final day, I noticed u :love:
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Greece BrookG
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Re: bullying

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Post by BrookG »

you are welcome spanky, doin my best here
Correlation doesn't mean causation.
http://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations

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Re: bullying

Post by Riotcoke »

iwillspankyou wrote:I hope if you show your ugly bullying face again, the mods will put you down. earl
if that is so. I am contemt.

Who's earl?
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United States of America Cometk
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Re: bullying

Post by Cometk »

gibson wrote:Btw who the hell is harrison I keep on hearing about this person but I have no idea who he is

@I_HaRRiiSoN_I
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Re: bullying

Post by fightinfrenchman »

gibson wrote:Btw who the hell is harrison I keep on hearing about this person but I have no idea who he is


He did a drunk somersault it was cool
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Re: bullying

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Post by Riotcoke »

fightinfrenchman wrote:
gibson wrote:Btw who the hell is harrison I keep on hearing about this person but I have no idea who he is


He did a drunk somersault it was cool

That might have been where he lost his phone.
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Netherlands edeholland
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Re: bullying

Post by edeholland »

Even though I wish Twitch chat was more positive and supportive, I wouldn't take it too seriously and I wouldn't draw conclusions based of the Twitch chat alone.
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Re: bullying

Post by princeofkabul »

iwillspankyou wrote:
amiggo1999 wrote:Howcome you know it all? @spanky4ever lol

I just do. cos I am way smarter than you :biggrin:


lmao
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Norway spanky4ever
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Re: bullying

Post by spanky4ever »

princeofkabul wrote:
iwillspankyou wrote:
amiggo1999 wrote:Howcome you know it all? @spanky4ever lol

I just do. cos I am way smarter than you :biggrin:


lmao

well :smile:
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Re: bullying

Post by deleted_user0 »

Dolan wrote:
umeu wrote:Why do you keep bringing up leftwing and rightwing? You should get out of your box.
I keep bringing this dichotomy probably because I have seen you support points of view which are typically leftwing. I might be wrong about it, though, I don't claim I could estimate your politics simply based on a few posts on a gaming forum.
If it is so all defining for identity, then explain how people with the same sex and same culture, heck sometimes theyre even siblings or twins (so you can't just write it off on genes) can have wildly differing personalities and identities. Also explain how people from very different cultures can be good or even best friends?
Because genetics work in layered ways, it's not just a question of fixed DNA sequences that are shared between twins, it's also a question of epigenetics, of how those genes are expressed (silenced, activated, etc). So it's quite possible for twins sometimes to differ significantly in a few traits.

How can people from different cultures be good or best friends? Because, first of all, they can communicate, so that means they both learned a common language, which means they are already unusual for the community from which they came. Most people never really learn any secondary language to fluency level and don't use a secondary language on an every day basis. Whatever foreign languages they learn in school they typically forget eventually. So, those people who are eager to communicate outside their own culture are atypical, they are what I call "culturally flexible" individuals, who are eager to transcend the limits of their own native culture and adopt foreign styles of communication. For example, this great emphasis on empathy and trust is typical of Anglophone cultures, it's really unusual to show such a level of mutual trust and openness in, for example, Slavophone or East Asian cultures. So, of course, a small number of individuals from each culture are capable of overcoming the differences in communication and affective styles between cultures, learn a secondary language to fluency level and become able to relate to people from other cultures in their own foreign terms. But I think that says more about their mental flexibility to adapt to different formative environments, rather than some kind of universal capacity to relate to anyone from any other culture.


You said sex and cultural background, two things which are basically static in a persons life. So explain the big differences. How come one sex and culture produces people who aren't only wildly different to others of that sex culture, but have similar traits, likes and dislikes to people with a totally different cultural background and sex?

You're also just so completely wrong in your assessment of people. In fact the large majority of humans speak more than one language. About 60% of the people speak 2 or more languages. Literally most countries are not only bilingual, but also bi-cultural or multi-cultural, even though in your biased way, obviously you'll say that the languages and cultures are too similar to distinguish (which is maybe true in some cases, but definitely isnt in others). Are they all culturally flexible? Honestly, this entire theory seems as if you've just made it up, show me a serious book propagating it. I seriously suggest that you take a year off and just go travel by yourself, perhaps it will teach you something real about people.

I've lived in East asia for over 4 years of my life, 2.5 consecutive. What you say about trust and openness is just so misguided and blatantly false, that i don't even know where to begin in order to dispell the stereotypes which you hold and use to judge the world.
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Re: bullying

Post by Dolan »

umeu wrote:You said sex and cultural background, two things which are basically static in a persons life. So explain the big differences. How come one sex and culture produces people who aren't only wildly different to others of that sex culture, but have similar traits, likes and dislikes to people with a totally different cultural background and sex?

People can like the same thing for different reasons. Inner experience of that same thing can be so different from person to person, whether or not they share the same culture, sex or some other category. So the fact that they like the same thing doesn't mean they like it for the same reasons. Everyone projects some past experiences in different ways onto what they like. And the fact that you belong to another culture doesn't make you like a member of another species, obviously you share some traits which are similar across the species. For example, all kids share the same trait of playfulness (which can be found between other species too, and can sometimes make a dog enjoy playing with a bird, etc). If you give them the same game, they will go through it as a raw, playful experience, but also filtered through their cultural lens (which in humans pretty much becomes part of their nature). In such a vast species, obviously, it's likely that some members of the same species will grow to have some similar likings, even though they developed in different regions and their experience of that same thing will be coloured by their own cultural background too.

You're also just so completely wrong in your assessment of people. In fact the large majority of humans speak more than one language. About 60% of the people speak 2 or more languages. Literally most countries are not only bilingual, but also bi-cultural or multi-cultural, even though in your biased way, obviously you'll say that the languages and cultures are too similar to distinguish (which is maybe true in some cases, but definitely isnt in others). Are they all culturally flexible? Honestly, this entire theory seems as if you've just made it up, show me a serious book propagating it. I seriously suggest that you take a year off and just go travel by yourself, perhaps it will teach you something real about people.

I was referring to people who are fluent in more than just their native language. Fluency in a foreign language is hard to achieve, it takes certain personality traits and a lot of time investment and motivation. I doubt that most people can be fluent in two languages. It's just beyond any realistic expectation for average intelligence and training.

How is Poland bicultural? Do you refer to that fact that they might have some cultural/ethnic minorities that happen to live there (such as lots of Ukrainians who came to seek work in the country)? How is Austria bicultural/bilingual? Romania? You could argue maybe for some edge cases like Belgium. But most countries do not blend radically different cultures from across the world, like the USA has attempted to do. You don't see any country being host to Colombian, Polish and Chinese cultures all in one place, with most people appropriating norms and practices from all these cultures and learning their languages. It wouldn't even be practical, people surely have a lot more to be concerned with in their daily lives, rather than learn multiple languages and interact with people from completely different cultures.
And yes I wouldn't consider regional, related cultures as part of a multicultural setting.

Russia might actually be another example, besides the USA, but that's because they conquered and annexed those territories by force, and then later made whatever efforts were necessary to make sure those different cultures had enough facilitations that their communities would never get any idea of splitting with Russia. Stalin even took a methodical approach: he took populations from each part of the Soviet Union and sent them to other USSR countries, making sure each component country had a mixed enough population that they would never grow enough nationalistic, anti-Russian pathos to be able to revolt against Moscow. But that doesn't mean that Russian society became multicultural because of that, Russians didn't really adopt customs or languages from native Uralic peoples as part of an effort to "welcome diversity". No, when they found anything interesting, they just appropriated those customs and called them their own. Like those martial dances which can be found all around the Caucasus (Armenian, Georgian). The Russian Kozachok martial dance is very similar to those from the Caucasus, but those variants are actually older than the Russian ones. So I guess Russians just adopted them from the Caucasus, but translated them into their own culture. Pretty much how it happened in Europe with the "Morris dance" from the UK, which was probably a variant of an older Spanish dance that became popular during medieval ages in Europe. A similar dance (călușarii) can be found even in Romania. But not in Papua New Guinea or India. So yeah, cultures that are related and have cross-polinated each other can't be said to be multiculturalisable. You couldn't call a society made of Norwegians, Dutch and English multicultural. They have so many things in common, their languages have common substrates and their populations share so much of their haplogroups, that they're pretty much part of a common family of inter-related cultures.
Would a society made up of South Americans, Spanish and Portuguese be multicultural? Insofar as they would mix elements of culture inherited from Incans and the Spanish, yes. If they would just mix elements of Spanish culture, there wouldn't be much "multi" in their cultures.

The cultural flexibility concept is an idea I came up with. It's not yet fully developed to the point of being able to make particular, testable predictions, but maybe I will find the time to develop it slightly more.

I've lived in East asia for over 4 years of my life, 2.5 consecutive. What you say about trust and openness is just so misguided and blatantly false, that i don't even know where to begin in order to dispell the stereotypes which you hold and use to judge the world.

Well, there is research that disagrees with your experience. For example: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4976796/
If something so basic and fundamental as pain experience can make people from two completely different cultures have markedly different emotional/empathising experiences, then how could this be the result of my own stereotypes?
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Re: bullying

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Post by deleted_user0 »

Dolan wrote:People can like the same thing for different reasons. Inner experience of that same thing can be so different from person to person, whether or not they share the same culture, sex or some other category.
I would even say it's not the same for any 2 persons in the world. Which is why I think it's not that relevant to make such selections by culture or sex in many cases.

And the fact that you belong to another culture doesn't make you like a member of another species, obviously you share some traits which are similar across the species. For example, all kids share the same trait of playfulness (which can be found between other species too, and can sometimes make a dog enjoy playing with a bird, etc). If you give them the same game, they will go through it as a raw, playful experience, but also filtered through their cultural lens (which in humans pretty much becomes part of their nature).
Yes, like children, adults too share traits, in fact, the similarities are just as numerous, if not more numerous than the differences. And the differences where they exist are relatively small. The lens people filter it through is different per person, per family, per village/city, per region, per country, again changed by religion, sex, age, physical ability, intelligence etc. There are so many factors that you can't just boil it down to 2. The lens of people in North France is probably closer to that of people in South belgium than it is to that of people in South France, yet you would say they're both French so they have same lens. It just doesn't make sense to me.


I was referring to people who are fluent in more than just their native language. Fluency in a foreign language is hard to achieve, it takes certain personality traits and a lot of time investment and motivation. I doubt that most people can be fluent in two languages. It's just beyond any realistic expectation for average intelligence and training.
Most people only have one native language. The languages they know are languages of adjacent tribes or countries. Fluency is a range anyway, and is not used to mean the same as mastery of a language. Many people speak a language other than their native tongue well enough to communicate about complicated things with people that speak that language. For example if you look at the CEFR, b1 would be sufficient. Native speakers are c1-c2. If you look at IELTS, then 7 is sufficient, while most native speakers wouldn't even get ielts 9. Obviously you have to keep using the language in order to not lose the skill, but that's something different.

And yes I wouldn't consider regional, related cultures as part of a multicultural setting.

That's obviously convenient, when you disregard difference between regional cultures just because they're not big enough in your point of view. Plenty of countries in for example Africa, Asia and South America have different cultures within one border. Just look at India, the Phillipines, Indonesia, Nigeria, Mali, Mauretania, Brazil, China. But also France, Spain and Turkey. You might not be able to tell the difference, but they would disagree. Sometimes they live peacefully, sometimes not.


The cultural flexibility concept is an idea I came up with. It's not yet fully developed to the point of being able to make particular, testable predictions, but maybe I will find the time to develop it slightly more.
Yeah, I can see.

Well, there is research that disagrees with your experience. For example: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4976796/
If something so basic and fundamental as pain experience can make people from two completely different cultures have markedly different emotional/empathising experiences, then how could this be the result of my own stereotypes?
Maybe I missed it, but nothing in that article says anything about openness, trust and honesty. So it's definitely your stereotype of east asia. also the differences aren't so markedly different, it seems like they're actually quite small. The conclusion also says that it's in line with some research, yet contradicts others, aka, we still don't know anything. The finding that people empathize about equally with the ingroup as they do with the outgroup and are reasonably adept at recognizing pain in other humans even from different cultures is way more interesting in my opinion. Not so different after all.

I don't dispute that cultural values and upbringing can affect a persons cognitive response. It's obvious that it can. In ww1 veterans from India had certain different ways of dealing with PTSD than English soldiers. In such a case it's relevant to an extent to understand that patient's culture in order to treat the patient. But if you had raised that same indian man in britain from the start, with a british family, he would respond like the british soldier. not like the indian one. Culture isn't rigid and static, people adapt, acquire and let go of things. A person raised for the first 20 years in culture A, who then lives for the next 40 years in culture B will mix those two cultures into his identity. And you can't know what that person acquired or dropped, so when you see that person and go oh, he's from culture A (or culture A+B), that will tell you pretty much nothing about that person unless you get know that person better and also know something about that culture.

So in most contexts, the above doesn't matter. If you hire someone to scoop ice cream, it really doesn't matter much if you know that person has .1 higher perceived pain rate for a needle entering the palm. All that matters is if that person can scoop ice cream. Knowing what someone's culture is doesn't matter when you play aoe3 with them. The reason why it doesn't matter is because it doesn't tell you much beyond generalisations, which as we have already agreed, won't necessarily tell you anything about the individual. I'm not saying it doesn't affect anyone's life, but fixating on the culture and gender instead of on the person is the wrong approach.

anyway that's it for me, I don't have time to properly write the post. we're basically talking about beliefs here anyway, so there's no point really.
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Great Britain I_HaRRiiSoN_I
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Re: bullying

Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

Riotcoke wrote:
fightinfrenchman wrote:
gibson wrote:Btw who the hell is harrison I keep on hearing about this person but I have no idea who he is


He did a drunk somersault it was cool

That might have been where he lost his phone.


If this was in manchester city centre then most likely RIP, plus i dont actually remember that part!
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Great Britain I_HaRRiiSoN_I
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Re: bullying

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Post by I_HaRRiiSoN_I »

iwillspankyou wrote:
Riotcoke wrote:
Show hidden quotes

You weren't at lan, I was. Nobody took the twitch chat seriously because everyone understands people in twitch chat are ballsy as they themselves can't be judged. Meanwhile where it mattered everyone was nice and supportive of Garja.

I was there, in the stream, and it was not nice. And can I ask you :?: was it you who made got on to the flor, like praying for Allah :?: If not you, who was it :oops:


Bearing in mind 'some' alcohol was consumed by many people including myself on the saturday night, I bowed down to the god that is 'G' as a genuine sign of respect for stepping up to the plate and playing LAN 1v1 showmatch with _H20. The 'G' didn't have to play but decided to do after Interjection had asked the pair to continue the stream as well as the Hype train. I understand that there has been drama between these two in the past.

Secondly, the fact that Garja took a plane from Italy to come to the LAN to hang out with everybody shows that he does deserve the respect he rightly gets from the community for the sheer commitment and amount of hard work he has put into the game. He is genuine nice and humble guy in real life and was a great asset to the group of people at the LAN.

At the next meet-up or LAN tournament at escape, I will be looking forward to meet you in person to find out more about the person behind the username and I am sure that I am not the only one in the community.
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Re: bullying

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Post by XeeleeFlower »

After writing my post a few pages back, @Goodspeed and @deleted_user4 gave me a little history lesson that I had either completely missed or forgotten. It's possible that others have as well. Goodspeed alluded to it in a post of his, but didn't go in depth. Basically, the whole "Garja is a god" thing started out as an ironic thing. People who didn't much care for him began to call him this because they thought he was too controlling and stubborn. It then just became a meme and we're now at where we are now. I, for one, didn't know this and assumed that the intentions behind the "big G", "Garja god", etc were because of the work that he has put into this game. I thought it was similar to how we praise @EAGLEMUT for the work that he has done. Had I known that it was actually something done with negative intentions, I wouldn't have engaged in it. I'm pretty sure that most of the people who say these things about @Garja have a similar thought to mine and didn't/don't understand how it came to be. Anyway, with all this in mind, @spanky4ever 's post makes much more sense to me as she probably remembers and/or was there for that drama, so when she sees all this Garja worship, she interpreted it as everyone mocking him. In my eyes, and many others I imagine, it's legitimate praise. All of this appears to be a huge misunderstanding between everyone and possibly even Garja himself. I'm not sure what he really thinks of it all and I highly doubt he will share his thoughts here as no matter what he says could be used as ammo. In any case, he did like my post a few pages back so take that as you will.
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Re: bullying

Post by BrookG »

It might have been some sort of a joke, due to his online stubbornness on game related matters. I will reiterate here that English isn't his native language, neither the native of many of us. Even that slightest misuse can lead to misunderstandings and internet is fast to judge. Yet the love and appreciation we saw in the LAN was genuine and neither forced nor with intend to humiliate. We are overanalysing the issue, in my humble opinion.
Correlation doesn't mean causation.
http://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations

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