ESOC Stereotype Poll

[HUMMAN]

A little poll on recent discussions on gold mines! Gold rush time! Share your opinions!

[voigt1240]

Idk but that movie sure is in my top 5 of all time.

[HUMMAN]

Idk but that movie sure is in my top 5 of all time.

Yeah it has a sub-text of massacre of indians so i thought it would fit nice to the topic.

[Squamiger]

option 5: most individuals are alienated under neoliberal capitalism and feel powerless and hopeless in their daily lives to address the material realities of racism in their society, so they often seek solace in art, music, movies, and video games that depict anti-racist things, and this isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it also doesn't actually address the material conditions of society, and the solution is to build mass institutions in the real world that can overcome alienation and assert power on a systemic level

[HUMMAN]

option 5: most individuals are alienated under neoliberal capitalism and feel powerless and hopeless in their daily lives to address the material realities of racism in their society, so they often seek solace in art, music, movies, and video games that depict anti-racist things, and this isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it also doesn't actually address the material conditions of society, and the solution is to build mass institutions in the real world that can overcome alienation and assert power on a systemic level

I summon @Dolan to answer this highly intellectual passage.

[Garja]

popcorn.img

[007Salt]

There should be a section in the forums called something like "Church of Garja" I think it's time ESOC create it's own space for a religion so we can pray to the God Garja when things don't go our way in AOE3 or before a match.

[Scroogie]

Pretty sure this is how all religion actually started out.

[forgrin]

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

[voigt1240]

I worry how europe is becoming more and more political correct every day. Maybe we are all just becoming too sensitive and thin skinned.

[[Armag] diarouga]

I worry how europe is becoming more and more political correct every day. Maybe we are all just becoming too sensitive and thin skinned.

Ye, I expect Europe to become like the US in 10-20 years unfortunately.

[harcha]

I worry how europe is becoming more and more political correct every day. Maybe we are all just becoming too sensitive and thin skinned.

if you really worry about this just move to eastern bloc

[[Armag] diarouga]

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

[[Armag] diarouga]

I worry how europe is becoming more and more political correct every day. Maybe we are all just becoming too sensitive and thin skinned.

if you really worry about this just move to eastern bloc

Shit countries though.

[harcha]

I worry how europe is becoming more and more political correct every day. Maybe we are all just becoming too sensitive and thin skinned.

if you really worry about this just move to eastern bloc

Shit countries though.

come at me

[forgrin]

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

I don't know if I'm full of myself lol. I just see in what you're saying the same viewpoints I had about PC 5+ years ago, and since then I've been lucky to learn a lot and mature.

Re. America and racism/political correctness, maybe it's just because you don't live here but your analysis of the situation is just wrong. Freedom of speech is still very important here (in Canada too to a lesser extent), moreso than in France imo. If anything, politicians are "becoming worse and worse" because we're finally getting social movement to the left, and the reactionary pushback from conservatives is leading them to elect people like Trump. If you look at the Democratic party in the states they've made considerable strides in the last 4 years.

Maybe I wasn't clear in that other thread, but I don't necessarily think your objection to a game mechanic change is racist. The way you phrased it though, as though the fact that "political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk. I don't know you, so I can't say whether you are racist or not, but you are talking the same way that racists do so some people would make assumptions.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Freedom of speech is still very important here

But still, you think that people who disagree with you are racist. I'm not talking about laws when I say freedom of speech, I'm talking about what you can say and what you can't say.

"political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk

By this logic, every time someone goes against political correctness, he's probably racist. That's exactly what people who create the politically correct want, and that's sad because it means people can't have discussion since you're not allowed to talk about some topics.

Besides, I'm not saying that the change can't be valid because it was influenced by political correctness, I'm saying that the change is bad, and I'm blaming the political correctness for implementing bad changes in the game, that's it.
That's the opposite of what you're saying, the change isn't bad because it is politically correct, it's bad and I'm sad that political correctness impacts aoe3.

[harcha]

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

I don't know if I'm full of myself lol. I just see in what you're saying the same viewpoints I had about PC 5+ years ago, and since then I've been lucky to learn a lot and mature.

Re. America and racism/political correctness, maybe it's just because you don't live here but your analysis of the situation is just wrong. Freedom of speech is still very important here (in Canada too to a lesser extent), moreso than in France imo. If anything, politicians are "becoming worse and worse" because we're finally getting social movement to the left, and the reactionary pushback from conservatives is leading them to elect people like Trump. If you look at the Democratic party in the states they've made considerable strides in the last 4 years.

Maybe I wasn't clear in that other thread, but I don't necessarily think your objection to a game mechanic change is racist. The way you phrased it though, as though the fact that "political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk. I don't know you, so I can't say whether you are racist or not, but you are talking the same way that racists do so some people would make assumptions.

I think his whole thing is that the change is based in "political correctness", instead of "political correctness" influencing the change. Personally I would also be strictly against it if it was the former, but I honestly think it is the latter.

[forgrin]

Show hidden quotes

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

I don't know if I'm full of myself lol. I just see in what you're saying the same viewpoints I had about PC 5+ years ago, and since then I've been lucky to learn a lot and mature.

Re. America and racism/political correctness, maybe it's just because you don't live here but your analysis of the situation is just wrong. Freedom of speech is still very important here (in Canada too to a lesser extent), moreso than in France imo. If anything, politicians are "becoming worse and worse" because we're finally getting social movement to the left, and the reactionary pushback from conservatives is leading them to elect people like Trump. If you look at the Democratic party in the states they've made considerable strides in the last 4 years.

Maybe I wasn't clear in that other thread, but I don't necessarily think your objection to a game mechanic change is racist. The way you phrased it though, as though the fact that "political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk. I don't know you, so I can't say whether you are racist or not, but you are talking the same way that racists do so some people would make assumptions.

I think his whole thing is that the change is based in "political correctness", instead of "political correctness" influencing the change. Personally I would also be strictly against it if it was the former, but I honestly think it is the latter.

This seems like a meaningless distinction no? Whether the idea originated in a way to differentiate gameplay or an idea to improve historical accuracy. If you leave out any "PC" components it's still a 100% logical change, even if the implementation in the beta wasn't perfect (I didn't play it so idk).

[harcha]

Show hidden quotes

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

I don't know if I'm full of myself lol. I just see in what you're saying the same viewpoints I had about PC 5+ years ago, and since then I've been lucky to learn a lot and mature.

Re. America and racism/political correctness, maybe it's just because you don't live here but your analysis of the situation is just wrong. Freedom of speech is still very important here (in Canada too to a lesser extent), moreso than in France imo. If anything, politicians are "becoming worse and worse" because we're finally getting social movement to the left, and the reactionary pushback from conservatives is leading them to elect people like Trump. If you look at the Democratic party in the states they've made considerable strides in the last 4 years.

Maybe I wasn't clear in that other thread, but I don't necessarily think your objection to a game mechanic change is racist. The way you phrased it though, as though the fact that "political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk. I don't know you, so I can't say whether you are racist or not, but you are talking the same way that racists do so some people would make assumptions.

I think his whole thing is that the change is based in "political correctness", instead of "political correctness" influencing the change. Personally I would also be strictly against it if it was the former, but I honestly think it is the latter.

This seems like a meaningless distinction no? Whether the idea originated in a way to differentiate gameplay or an idea to improve historical accuracy. If you leave out any "PC" components it's still a 100% logical change, even if the implementation in the beta wasn't perfect (I didn't play it so idk).

To me it doesn't seem meaningless to discern whether the idea is someone going "uhh... i think someone might not like this, let's change it" instead of "let's check with an expert to make sure that we get it right". Also I am not saying that it's a bad change, I am just very worried about implementation.

Personally if I was the game dev with no AOE3 experience, I would probably make the same decision. As for how good the implementation will be, that is still in the air.

[forgrin]

Freedom of speech is still very important here

But still, you think that people who disagree with you are racist. I'm not talking about laws when I say freedom of speech, I'm talking about what you can say and what you can't say.

"political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk

By this logic, every time someone goes against political correctness, he's probably racist. That's exactly what people who create the politically correct want, and that's sad because it means people can't have discussion since you're not allowed to talk about some topics.

Besides, I'm not saying that the change can't be valid because it was influenced by political correctness, I'm saying that the change is bad, and I'm blaming the political correctness for implementing bad changes in the game, that's it.
That's the opposite of what you're saying, the change isn't bad because it is politically correct, it's bad and I'm sad that political correctness impacts aoe3.

Uh, I don't automatically think that people who disagree with me are racist. Nobody except the most insane narcissistic people could think that and that's totally different from PC in general. You're making a strawman here.

Regarding what you can and can't say, I really doubt there is a significant difference between where I live and where you live. This is something that you're imagining. I work with people with different races, genders and sexual orientations, and I guarantee you the jokes are not all "PC".

By this logic, every time someone goes against political correctness, he's probably racist.

I don't think that's true all the time (also what is "PC" is very fluid depending on the situation, we don't carry around PC phrasebooks lol). However, using the excuse that better representation for affected minorities is "PC", or influenced by it, and therefore invalid, is a very racist thing to do because it's intentionally stalling progress just because it is progress.

I think you can figure out how that's an issue; imagine if you were discussing Jesus for example, and someone said that he was a Jew (an indisputable fact), to which you said "that's PC influencing my religion!". That's how crazy you sound.

[forgrin]

Show hidden quotes

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

I don't know if I'm full of myself lol. I just see in what you're saying the same viewpoints I had about PC 5+ years ago, and since then I've been lucky to learn a lot and mature.

Re. America and racism/political correctness, maybe it's just because you don't live here but your analysis of the situation is just wrong. Freedom of speech is still very important here (in Canada too to a lesser extent), moreso than in France imo. If anything, politicians are "becoming worse and worse" because we're finally getting social movement to the left, and the reactionary pushback from conservatives is leading them to elect people like Trump. If you look at the Democratic party in the states they've made considerable strides in the last 4 years.

Maybe I wasn't clear in that other thread, but I don't necessarily think your objection to a game mechanic change is racist. The way you phrased it though, as though the fact that "political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk. I don't know you, so I can't say whether you are racist or not, but you are talking the same way that racists do so some people would make assumptions.

I think his whole thing is that the change is based in "political correctness", instead of "political correctness" influencing the change. Personally I would also be strictly against it if it was the former, but I honestly think it is the latter.

This seems like a meaningless distinction no? Whether the idea originated in a way to differentiate gameplay or an idea to improve historical accuracy. If you leave out any "PC" components it's still a 100% logical change, even if the implementation in the beta wasn't perfect (I didn't play it so idk).

To me it doesn't seem meaningless to discern whether the idea is someone going "uhh... i think someone might not like this, let's change it" instead of "let's check with an expert to make sure that we get it right". Also I am not saying that it's a bad change, I am just very worried about implementation.

Personally if I was the game dev with no AOE3 experience, I would probably make the same decision. As for how good the implementation will be, that is still in the air.

Your answer is in the dev interview, they said after consultation with people from those tribes they made the choice, ie. "let's check with an expert to make sure that we get it right". As I said though idk about the implementation, but seeing as we can't discuss it yet hard to say more.

[harcha]

Show hidden quotes

I voted #3, but I think some of the euro boys in the other thread sounded like a lot of young white men did in NA 10 years ago. Y'all are just a bit behind the curve, you'll catch up eventually. Not saying that they're racist people, but they're not as aware of how their words and actions are perceived and how they perpetrate racist societies than some of us in NA are.

You're so full of yourself xD.
In America, people don't make the difference between what they agree/disagree with and what is racist or not honestly. That's why you can't say shit anymore. That's sad, because as a result, politicians are getting worse and worse because they can't tackle some issues, and freedom of speech is disappearing year after year.

Claiming that kaiser and I are racist because we think native civs should mine in aoe3 (like you did in the other thread), just shows that you're lacking a lot of tolerance. Tolerance isn't just accepting that people are from different communities, it's also accepting everyone's opinion.

I don't know if I'm full of myself lol. I just see in what you're saying the same viewpoints I had about PC 5+ years ago, and since then I've been lucky to learn a lot and mature.

Re. America and racism/political correctness, maybe it's just because you don't live here but your analysis of the situation is just wrong. Freedom of speech is still very important here (in Canada too to a lesser extent), moreso than in France imo. If anything, politicians are "becoming worse and worse" because we're finally getting social movement to the left, and the reactionary pushback from conservatives is leading them to elect people like Trump. If you look at the Democratic party in the states they've made considerable strides in the last 4 years.

Maybe I wasn't clear in that other thread, but I don't necessarily think your objection to a game mechanic change is racist. The way you phrased it though, as though the fact that "political correctness" influenced it and therefore the change can't be valid, that is the way the real racists here talk. I don't know you, so I can't say whether you are racist or not, but you are talking the same way that racists do so some people would make assumptions.

I think his whole thing is that the change is based in "political correctness", instead of "political correctness" influencing the change. Personally I would also be strictly against it if it was the former, but I honestly think it is the latter.

This seems like a meaningless distinction no? Whether the idea originated in a way to differentiate gameplay or an idea to improve historical accuracy. If you leave out any "PC" components it's still a 100% logical change, even if the implementation in the beta wasn't perfect (I didn't play it so idk).

To me it doesn't seem meaningless to discern whether the idea is someone going "uhh... i think someone might not like this, let's change it" instead of "let's check with an expert to make sure that we get it right". Also I am not saying that it's a bad change, I am just very worried about implementation.

Personally if I was the game dev with no AOE3 experience, I would probably make the same decision. As for how good the implementation will be, that is still in the air.

Your answer is in the dev interview, they said after consultation with people from those tribes they made the choice, ie. "let's check with an expert to make sure that we get it right". As I said though idk about the implementation, but seeing as we can't discuss it yet hard to say more.

Yeah I cought that, it's just that some others seem to be too thick to get it.

[helln00]

Pretty sure this is how all religion actually started out.

I think esoc would count as a cult in some cases.

[Hawk_Girl]

I work with people with different races

This is by definition racist btw xd