US Politics Megathread

[Horsemen]

Left-wing liberals are shocked to discover that rich people don't pay tax

[wardyb1]

This whole tax thing is a nothing burger tbh, Firstly we don't even know if it is true but let's assume it is all true and has come directly from the IRS.

Even if it is true that he paid tax in only 11 out of 18 years that means he did pay tax in the other 7 years.

This means he is bouncing debt across tax years when it is of benefit and then paying the tax in years which are more suitable to him- that is just standard business practice available to all businesses of any size if their bank deems the core business to be viable.

The real method is to take the entire 18 years period, plus and minus the profits and losses and if there is a net gain then average the tax liability on that, the fact that none of these articles mention this and that apparently the IRS know about it without having a problem with it leads one to speculate that he simply made x money and paid x tax on it across that period just like anyone else.

If it looks too low you will have found out what most people already know- that Accountants are a thing.

It's just calculated to coincide with the debates so that if Joe does well it can create a wave or if Joe does badly it will take the edge of off it.

People just see headline like 'Billionaire pays no tax' and think that someone who has made billions should be paying loads of tax whereas Trump inherited his fortune, he could have just brought a massive property sat on half of it and invested the rest and lived a playboy lifestyle but instead he has ran businesses that have employed many hundreds (thousands?) of people over the years, if he has avoided any tax legally then the question is to ask whether he has employed those people more or less efficiently than the government may have done over the same period.

By all reliable accounts Trump inherited about $2 Billion which would be worth $4 billion if he saved it, best estimates are that he is still worth about $4 billion so therefore if he has paid little tax but employed people solidly over the period he has contributed, after all isn't this a better thing for a wealthy person to do than simply invest in global stock and keep any profits for themselves?

As for debt, $350 million is basically nothing of concern for someone if they have $4 Billion of assets/private wealth, in fact it would be really odd to have that amount of money without having significant debts.

What is interesting to me is why basically every news outlet is running the story without mentioning any of the above...........

You really didn't read the actual article did you? The whole hardly paying any tax thing is just the catchy headline that grabs people. The juice is the tax fraud possibilities and his massive debts which many of which are due in the next 4 years making him a huge liability to national security. He quite clearly has nowhere near $4B in assets. That is what the thread I posted earlier laid out. He's worth jackshit compared to his debts.

As to your point about it being true, well that's the great bit. If Trump wants to disprove it all, he can simply release his tax profile. Nothing is stopping him. The only reason he wouldn't is because it would prove this to be correct.

[oats13]

This whole tax thing is a nothing burger tbh, Firstly we don't even know if it is true but let's assume it is all true and has come directly from the IRS.

Even if it is true that he paid tax in only 11 out of 18 years that means he did pay tax in the other 7 years.

This means he is bouncing debt across tax years when it is of benefit and then paying the tax in years which are more suitable to him- that is just standard business practice available to all businesses of any size if their bank deems the core business to be viable.

The real method is to take the entire 18 years period, plus and minus the profits and losses and if there is a net gain then average the tax liability on that, the fact that none of these articles mention this and that apparently the IRS know about it without having a problem with it leads one to speculate that he simply made x money and paid x tax on it across that period just like anyone else.

If it looks too low you will have found out what most people already know- that Accountants are a thing.

It's just calculated to coincide with the debates so that if Joe does well it can create a wave or if Joe does badly it will take the edge of off it.

People just see headline like 'Billionaire pays no tax' and think that someone who has made billions should be paying loads of tax whereas Trump inherited his fortune, he could have just brought a massive property sat on half of it and invested the rest and lived a playboy lifestyle but instead he has ran businesses that have employed many hundreds (thousands?) of people over the years, if he has avoided any tax legally then the question is to ask whether he has employed those people more or less efficiently than the government may have done over the same period.

By all reliable accounts Trump inherited about $2 Billion which would be worth $4 billion if he saved it, best estimates are that he is still worth about $4 billion so therefore if he has paid little tax but employed people solidly over the period he has contributed, after all isn't this a better thing for a wealthy person to do than simply invest in global stock and keep any profits for themselves?

As for debt, $350 million is basically nothing of concern for someone if they have $4 Billion of assets/private wealth, in fact it would be really odd to have that amount of money without having significant debts.

What is interesting to me is why basically every news outlet is running the story without mentioning any of the above...........

You really didn't read the actual article did you? The whole hardly paying any tax thing is just the catchy headline that grabs people. The juice is the tax fraud possibilities and his massive debts which many of which are due in the next 4 years making him a huge liability to national security. He quite clearly has nowhere near $4B in assets. That is what the thread I posted earlier laid out. He's worth jackshit compared to his debts.

As to your point about it being true, well that's the great bit. If Trump wants to disprove it all, he can simply release his tax profile. Nothing is stopping him. The only reason he wouldn't is because it would prove this to be correct.

I did read the article and several others in fact, you say "The juice is the tax fraud possibilities and his massive debts", well possibilities are one thing and reality is another.

As for the debts equating to a national security liability that is pretty hilarious clutching at straws, to whom exactly does he owe the debt? if it is Banks how is this a liability to security?

This was known when he stood the first time, if it is a problem then America should address the rules on it as such, but that's not the fault of Trump.

If Trump really doesn't have the money to cover his debts and the banks decide that his core business isn't viable and to slowly call in those debts or to downsize them then that is his problem.

Just like any other business.

This is just electioneering.

[Goodspeed]

It's interesting that you say you've read several articles about this and don't even know who he owes the debt to. Deutsche bank, mostly.

If Trump really doesn't have the money to cover his debts and the banks decide that his core business isn't viable and to slowly call in those debts or to downsize them then that is his problem.

The banks could also decide to pressure him into making decisions in politics that benefit them. It's ammo for lobbyists.

[oats13]

It's interesting that you say you've read several articles about this and don't even know who he owes the debt to. Deutsche bank, mostly.

If Trump really doesn't have the money to cover his debts and the banks decide that his core business isn't viable and to slowly call in those debts or to downsize them then that is his problem.

The banks could also decide to pressure him into making decisions in politics that benefit them. It's ammo for lobbyists.

I asked the question rhetorically, It is well known that Deutsche Bank still lent him massive amounts even after he sued them, presumably their analysts thought it worthwhile.

Whether it would be ammo for lobbyists or not is moot, the basic reality is no different than it was four years ago and the rules aren't going to change in the next two months.

It is entirely the business of America if it wants to change them in the future and of no concern to Trump.

I'd also mention that the scale of money here is peanuts compared to say..... Haliburton etc.

[Goodspeed]

It's interesting that you say you've read several articles about this and don't even know who he owes the debt to. Deutsche bank, mostly.

If Trump really doesn't have the money to cover his debts and the banks decide that his core business isn't viable and to slowly call in those debts or to downsize them then that is his problem.

The banks could also decide to pressure him into making decisions in politics that benefit them. It's ammo for lobbyists.

I asked the question rhetorically, It is well known that Deutsche Bank still lent him massive amounts even after he sued them, presumably their analysts thought it worthwhile.

Whether it would be ammo for lobbyists or not is moot, the basic reality is no different than it was four years ago and the rules aren't going to change in the next two months.

It is entirely the business of America if it wants to change them in the future and of no concern to Trump.

I'd also mention that the scale of money here is peanuts compared to say..... Haliburton etc.

Why is it moot that the president's personal finance situation might affect policy decisions? Obviously you don't want that. Who's to say, for example, that he isn't downplaying the virus to protect his profit margins, considering a lot of his assets are in the hospitality sector, with this (for him quite large) debt looming?

Trump seems to be in a precarious situation financially, and since he's only in this for himself I can see why people are worried, or even call it a national security threat.

[fedjahnson]

Hyped ,debate tonight, I live about an hour away from cleveland. Hoepfully both the candidates do well in their respectice stregths.

[007Salt]

Joe Biden is racist against orange people.

[Horsemen]

Joe Biden is racist against orange people.

you ain't black

[deleted_user]

terrible time to get sober; lots of room for drinking games between these two clowns

[007Salt]

Joe Biden is racist against orange people.

you ain't black

The only reason Biden dislikes Trump is because he's orange.... where does black fit in here?

[fightinfrenchman]

CC @gibson the media sucks

[Dolan]

Do ya think they could ask'em to squiggle somethin on a paper?

[007Salt]

Biden can't even get it right with a teleprompter lol.... This debate is going to be funny.

[gibson]

CC @gibson the media sucks

This is what I think about the media

[fightinfrenchman]

I suspect Joe Biden could do well tonight. Don't be fooled by his gaffes. He is a seasoned and fesity debater.

[007Salt]

I suspect Joe Biden could do well tonight. Don't be folled by his gaffes. He is a seasoned and fesity debater.

[Cometk]

[fightinfrenchman]

@007Salt

[007Salt]

@007Salt

Biden said he was in the Senate for 180 years so he better be good if he's that experienced.

[Dolan]

>October 2012

He probably didn't have symptoms back then.

[gibson]

@007Salt

Biden said he was in the Senate for 180 years so he better be good if he's that experienced.

Imagine taking something that was very obviously meant as a joke and taking it literally because it fits your agenda. Its called stupidity.

[007Salt]

@007Salt

Biden said he was in the Senate for 180 years so he better be good if he's that experienced.

Imagine taking something that was very obviously meant as a joke and taking it literally because it fits your agenda. Its called stupidity.

He misread the teleprompter. Learn to do some research idiot. What kind of idiot makes that kind of mistake? I guess all mistakes are a joke when it fits your agenda.

[deleted_user]

@fightinfrenchman Taunt 11

[gibson]

Show hidden quotes

@007Salt

Biden said he was in the Senate for 180 years so he better be good if he's that experienced.

Imagine taking something that was very obviously meant as a joke and taking it literally because it fits your agenda. Its called stupidity.

He misread the teleprompter. Learn to do some research idiot. What kind of idiot makes that kind of mistake? I guess all mistakes are a joke when it fits your agenda.

False idiot noob